"Looks like Warlord Games IS listening" Topic

Take a look at these:

link

36 figures in a box!! WOOHOO!!

Now they just need to re-design the French 1807 boxes and I'll be a happy camper!!

This is an interesting offering. My informtion on the Vistula Legion centers around a Hourtoulle plate "back in the day" showing all companies wearing the shako with the sunburst brass plate on front – Grenadiers, fusiliers and voltigeurs.

Histofig has similar information:

link

They all wore a short-tailed Bardin-like coat, closed to the waist with yellow lapels, not the long-tailed coat shown here. Their leggings also ended below the knee.

I would be very happy to be wrong, and add a battalion of the Legion. Can anyone confirm this uniform?

The heads seem to be smaller than in earlier offerings, and I like that very much! With bearskins heads from another maker, these could be a great French line unit. I want to do the 27th in the long tailed coat, but with short leggings, and these could easily be converted. Great possibilities! 36 figures ready to use!

GdeP

Those are nice looking figures.

Garde de Paris, I am with you on this. All my sources show the uniform that you describe. It was a kurtka they wore before the bardin coat. Also, I think that only the lancers wore the square-topped schapska, not the infantry. The musketeer (apart from his shako plate) and the pioneer look about right but not the grenadiers. These figures look more like Grand Duchy of Warsaw troops but even there, the coat seems wrong.
Are we being too perfectionist?

GdeP everything I have says sunburst for example: Digby-sunburst, Haythornthwaite-"apparantly all sunburst from 1812", Cassin-Scott. They arrive at their conclusions from primary sources, so it would be interesting to know which source they have based this decision on?

@Artilleryman no we are not being perfectionists. I see this evry much French Infantry disguised as XYZ with some metal heads……completely different to, actual Vistual Legion troops…..

I like to do units of the Napoleonic era correctly – when I can. I don't think that's being a perfectionist. Another contributor did the 2nd Nassau using Victrix French, leaving the tails long – incorrect – but the unit looks great! I leave documentation for my grandson to have when he is old enough to know which are wrong or mythical, which historically accurate. Again, for those who care.

Some day I may do battalion of a mythical French ally in brown coats in this style uniform. Maybe Basques of an alternate universe! They would fit well into the era, serve with King Joe's "Spanish!"

I see an upside to this set, and the sapeur would be great added to another "French unit" in Bardin style to do as the legion, perhaps with covered shakos. If they all had the sunburst, they could be used as the 30th Line!

The heads of the grenadiers might work for me to switch to the six lancers of the Vistula I converted from Willy/Suren Prussian hussars years ago. My czapka is poorly done, but these look great!

GdeP

Gents take a gander at this:

TMP link

Histofig has some variations in the headdress.

Traditional dark blue "Kurtka" with different coloured facings for each regiment and the gaiters were only up to the knee or on some I have seen below the knee….Not perfection just getting it right. But it would as I have said be great see the source they have used for this box set as it will a be great addition to anyone's collection if Warlord have "stolen a march" on others…..

They all have sunburst, not sure what I am missing, but thanks for the link…. :)

The best thing is we are getting 36 figures per box set that is in the right direction….

If only I could read Polish see link:

link

Warlord Games listens well!

At least at the customer level – I just had an order where some of the bits were missing – one quick e-mail and the missing parts were on the way ASAP

Are we being too perfectionist?

No, we aren't. Warlord appears to have blown the uniform. I've never seen Vistula Legion with the habit veste or with the czapka. I agree with Marcus Maximus – they are warmed-over French infantry, with new (incorrect) heads.

Some day I may do battalion of a mythical French ally in brown coats in this style uniform.

Just do the Legion du Midi, an actual unit that served in the Peninsula. Brown coats faced light blue:

link

If you click on the sample painted figures in their ad only the Grenadier seems to have the czapka The fusiliers have a lozenge on their shako.

Afternoon gents,

We researched these extensively, aided and abetted by Polish speakers and their Polish language reference books. We chose to go with the uniforms as depicted in Gembarzewski's mighty tome on the subject (don't ask me the title – it's in Polish!). It's worth noting that the sculptor is also Polish and relied on help from contacts back in his homeland in addition to Gembarzewski.

Rest assured, these miniatures are correct – as much as we can know of something that happened so long ago. Don't forget the Vistula Legion, whilst equipped largely in the French uniforms were proud of their Polish roots and often sought to exhibit this in their attire.

We're very pleased with the result of this set and especially Peter Dennis' box art.

Cheers and Happy Easter!

Paul
warlordgames.com

Hi Paul,
Happy Easter to you and yours.
I think they look great. Question is do i want 2, 4 or 6 boxes.
Thanks

Well that's me sold

*rings bank manager*

F

So these are for 1807-1809 era in Spain when they were outfitted from French stock?

They are toy soldiers for playing a game with. Personally I would forgive the odd detail that may be incorrect.

Jaz
Http://6sided.net

This is seriously good news. And kudos to Warlord for covering a 'minor' army in hard plastic!

(When I say minor, of course I am referring to numbers of units, not the fighting prowess of these gallant Poles!)

I'm impressed that ferg981 was able to ring a bank manager in this day and age etc.

Yes

My man in Nigeria is very good, I only need to send him £50.00 GBP, 000 admin fee for my share of £1.50 GBPm

F

:)

Some of Gembarzewski's with sunbursts 1812 and what looks like a form of Sunburst hard to tell for the 1808 pic link

Are you sure we are not getting this mixed up here with Duchy of Warsaw and the Vistula legion troops which were two different organisations in 1808?

The 4th, 7th and 9th Duchy of Warsaw regts served in Spain and were partially dressed in French uniforms…..as Egale65 has suggested, Maybe the figures are these to support Warlords Peninsular War supplement?

The 3 foot regiments of the Vistula Legion fought in Spain their first real action at Saragossa, where they fought with distinction. The wore a "shorter" style of the habit with the lapels fastening to the waist. A cut that is a few years ahead of the usual French uniform which they adopted in 1812. Light infantry gaiters (i.e. below the knee). The shako with a sunray / sunburst metal plate, was charateristic of the 1809 troops, with the Czapka being adopted by all Polish troops (Duchy or otherwise) at a later date (ref: Windrow & Embleton). IIRC the Czapka was adopted in 1810.

So, Czapka for 1810 onwards for all Polish troops (although there will (always) be the odd unit to catch up), and for Vistula troops in the Peninsular War – shako with sunburst plate, light infantry gaiters, shorter habit with lapels attached to the waist.

Or that every artist including primary and secondary sources (knotel etc) have all got it wrong……
link

It's Warlord's French Infantry with a partial head swap and new command figures. Hardly a revelation. Still only a single, static Grenadier/Light Infantry march pose and no skirmishers. I would have been more excited to see some further metal elite poses (in both march attack and skirmish roles) to pad out the existing plastics. I'll keep waiting before I put my hard-earned down.

I concur with George. or else we would have seen full spure shots and contents within the box set. Shame really that Warlord doesn't provide decent pictures of contents so that one can make an informed decision, same goes for the recent Dacian Nobles release (again no spure shots or decent pics of the contents just some pic of the front box artwork, not instilling confidence with me to spend….)

excellent link Marcus have run through google translate, here be the linky link

Thank you EagleSixFive – much appreciated.

I like the miniatures a lot. Interesting discussion about the uniforms.

Hello, EagleSixFive: I always enjoy these translations – often very humorous. For instance, down this site, the Sapeur is described as a "minesweeper!"

There is also an interesting picture of one soldier on the right of the Vistual Legion, but three others that could pass for French Young Guard – tiraillers and voltigeurs, except that they all have dark blue turnbacks. Adds more conjecture to the mix!

GdeP

Yea! just gotta laugh sometimes. We need something like a "babel fish", though preferably without after effects of slimy/smelly fish ear!

If people don't know what a "babel fish" is google it.

When are these things going to stop going up in price?

61p/figure! Are they really worth that? Guess you pays yer money and takes yer choice.

And yes, they should really have shakos, but in my 15mm division I still went for the Cszapka (pr. Chap-Ka) to bring out that extra Polish deliciousness on the table.

I think they will look just fine as launched.

All

I can confirm these are the Warlord French infantry, with new command figures and a selection of metal heads

Appears to be 7 Cszapka, 3 shakos with pointed plume/polish shako plate, 3 with tufts/polish shako plates, 5 fusilier shako/polish plate and 15 standard fusilier shakos

Ferg

"My informtion on the Vistula Legion centers around a Hourtoulle plate "back in the day" showing all companies wearing the shako with the sunburst brass plate on front"

Haha, I know that plate. It's one of the best in the book!

I often find it odd that people pick fauly so much with these releases, largely due to the fact that there is such a great deal of choice out there, and really even if there wasn't: you don't HAVE to buy this!
I will though, because even with the price increase (£4 more than the last sets for 4 more figures…) having less "obvious" units available in plastic, not just more and more versions of French Line, is great. This is just what I was looking for to add a splash of colour to my French, perhaps alongside my planned Irish Legion…

Very Nice! Now if Warlord will do sprues of czapka only troops for the D of W, we'll be all set!
Except for those of us who need 1801 Danes and 1806 Dutch! Nudge,nudge!

Dear Paul at Warlord Games,
You blew it.
"Don't forget the Vistula Legion, whilst equipped largely in the French uniforms . . ."
That's just plain wrong. The uniforms were Polish, not French, as were the sunburst shako plates.

You know, it's one thing for a hobbyist to do the best research he can, buy and paint figures for his own collection, and still get some details wrong. When I built my 15mm Vistula regiments, I used Bardin French infantry, and painted the sunburst onto the shakos. In 28 mm, I'd say one has to sand down the French shako plates and either paint on the sunburst or fake one up using printed paper.

But to actually MANUFACTURE figures for SALE demands a higher, professional standard. If real Polish researchers were employed for these figures, I'd say either something was lost in translation, or your Polish researchers should be fired in favor of better ones. This information was available to me in the 1990s, and here it is ignored.

All Vistula Infantry wore the short tailed Kurta jackets, and not FRENCH habit vestes. Use of a Bardin jacket would have worked well enough, except for the distinctly Polish turnbacks, but NOT the long-tailed habit veste. All Vistula Infantry wore the shako with sunburst plate, not bearskins or czapkas.

If someone has reliable source material that proves me wrong, I'm willing to look. After all, I'm just a wargamer and collector, not a BUSINESS.

On the brighter side, Warlord Games didn't spend any money on these figures, they're just retreads. No loss.

On the Vistula's uniforms- I think it's not so simple. From its formation, the legion had its depot at Sedan, Vistula officer Heinrich von Brandt mentions issues of uniforms and equipment from there, and also at Bordeaux. I think it's likely that most of the Vistula's kit was of French manufacture- albeit some items in Polish style. In 1812, when new battalions were being recruited in Poland as the regiment waited to invade Russia, THEY had clothes made up locally, but presumably in the same style as the depot issued outfits.

Re headgear- FWIW Hourtoulle's caption to his Vistula plate says that the Grenadiers 'at least' wore the shapska in 1812 rather than the shako worn earlier. He doesn't give a primary source for that, but was certainly a respected authority on French uniforms. I say that because although Polish, the unit was certainly part of the French army. Maurice Orange also shows a Grenadier in Shapska.

One other point re the Warlord figures- all the illustrations of any period of Vistula Legion Voltiguers that I have seen show them with normal elite coy distinctions- ie two belts, sabre, fringed epaulettes (and shako). The Warlord figs look like fusiliers just with a bit of yellow trim painted on the shako.