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"What counts as a Zombie ?" Topic


30 Posts

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663 hits since 13 Nov 2012
©1994-2014 Bill Armintrout
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kreoseus213 Nov 2012 7:39 a.m. PST

What do you count as a Zed ? Just the shambling risen dead or is it zombie is as zombie does ? Do fast moving ragers count as zeds ? what about triffids, crazies or geography teachers ?

Angel Barracks13 Nov 2012 8:08 a.m. PST

I count ragers as zeds and shamblers/shufflers too.

Personal logo John the OFM Supporting Member of TMP13 Nov 2012 8:09 a.m. PST

Definitelty geography teachers.

The problem lies in defining it both too narrowly and too broadly.
It is best to follow the criteria of Justice Stewart who said "I know them when I see them."

RedSaber13 Nov 2012 8:12 a.m. PST

Anyone who Instructs, Briefs or Teaches using Death by Powerpoint is the ultimate zombie creator. Ask them. However, I am not really sure they understand the process completely as they are zombies themselves.

Baggy Sausage Supporting Member of TMP13 Nov 2012 8:15 a.m. PST

My ex-mother-in-law is a zombie. Anyway, that will be my story the next time she rocks up on my doorstep while I have my shotgun.

Scorpio13 Nov 2012 8:36 a.m. PST

The problem lies in defining it both too narrowly and too broadly.
It is best to follow the criteria of Justice Stewart who said "I know them when I see them."

I agree with John the ZOFM.

advocate13 Nov 2012 9:12 a.m. PST

They have to have been alive, and now be clincally dead: just being mad/drugged up is not enough, although it can provide a similar effect.
Which is why George Square in Glasgow was chosen for filming World War Z.

Uesugi Kenshin Supporting Member of TMP13 Nov 2012 10:07 a.m. PST

Ragers = Zeds….fast Zeds.

PapaSync13 Nov 2012 11:04 a.m. PST

"I know them when I see them."

This works for me too. I don't know why it took cops 18 minutes to put this one Zed down as he was eating a homeless mans face off.

link

This guy was fresh Zed too. Hardly any decomposition.

8)

Tinyminis13 Nov 2012 11:16 a.m. PST

I am okay with druggy zombies, that is what a voodoo zombie is anyways.
My favorite though is George Romero style reanimated dead. Slow shamblers that bite, fear fire, and can on occasion use tools (or play XBox)
But I don't care for the idea of fast zombies or ragers.

consectari Inactive Member13 Nov 2012 11:37 a.m. PST

I agree with John the OFM. Impossible to define.

With the vast difference between voodoo zombies and Romero style zombies, Romero zombies and Rage virus zombies there is little common ground. Throw in those from Resident Evil and L4D and it gets even more complicated.

You could almost classify them as mindless or at least single minded, but then there are the new smart zombies from THW.

Chances are, if someone thinks it's appropriate to post here, there's probably some reasonable grounds for it.

ming3113 Nov 2012 11:37 a.m. PST

Dead that walk . Ragers are not zombies cause they bleed . Zombies shamble cause all the blood has settled in thier legs making it hard to move .

Personal logo Ed the Two Hour Wargames guy Sponsoring Member of TMP13 Nov 2012 12:46 p.m. PST

I thought zombies returned from the dead where Ragers are infected and never died. But I could be wrong.

Space Monkey13 Nov 2012 2:16 p.m. PST

I'd keep the line drawn at their having to be undead and only vulnerable to destruction of the brain.
Also, keep them at the same speed as those in 'Night Of The Living Dead'… they weren't all that slow, but they weren't track stars either.

Call those fast, living, crazed things 'Ravagers' or 'Ragers' or 'Ravers'.

Maxshadow Supporting Member of TMP13 Nov 2012 4:07 p.m. PST

Well definitely not triffids. Because they are plants.

Geography Teachers are unique in that they can turn you into one but are not necessarily one themselves.

dictionary.com says "the body of a dead person given the semblance of life" That pretty much rules out Ragers and crazies for me. Because normally Ragers are not dead but infected and sprinting around is a little too animated for "semblance of life" to my mind.

jpattern2 Supporting Member of TMP13 Nov 2012 4:42 p.m. PST

Personal preference, but I'd include ragers and crazies. No triffids or bugs, but I'd include humans controlled by a plant or hive-mind, as long as they acted like zombies.

In my games, though, I definitely prefer dead, slow, and shambling.

FriendOfMrGreen Inactive Member13 Nov 2012 7:45 p.m. PST

Zombie (1968 Night of the Living Dead): shambling pace, unintelligent, only killed by head shot.

Rager(28 Days Later): fast pace, animal intellignce, killed as regular human (head, heart, suffocation, etc.)

Brain-eater (Return of the Living Dead): Shambling pace, near human intelligence, killed by electrocution or fire.

PistolPete14 Nov 2012 8:55 a.m. PST

is it more likely there's different stages of zombies? start with infection (resident evil), rager (28 days), brains (RLD), and final full on zombie (NLD). i suppose that if you're doing powerpoint presentations, you just begin at different starting stage – skip right to stage 3.

consectari Inactive Member14 Nov 2012 9:52 a.m. PST

I'd keep the line drawn at their having to be undead and only vulnerable to destruction of the brain.

I know this seems like common sense (if you're a fan of certain films and not others), but this is too narrow a definition.

The zombies in Return of the Living Dead were undead, but were not vulnurable to head shots.

The zombies in "Zombieland" were not undead, just infected. Zombieland has become a popular zombie setting, with Reaper even producing knock off minis for it. While not everyones idea of a zombie, I don't think you can discount them (it says zombie in the title).

Left 4 Dead is pretty commonly accepted as a zombie game, even though they are refered to as infected, aren't dead, don't require a head shot, and can have mutation induced special abilities. There are multiple producers of minis that make minis specifically to correspond to this game. The producers and wargamers almost always refer to these as zombies.

None of these are anything like voodoo zombies which were around long before the undead started using the name.

I think "zombie" needs to be accepted as a much broader term than it was pre- 28 Day, pre- Resident Evil, Pre- L4D, etc.

kreoseus214 Nov 2012 11:46 a.m. PST

Still no love for Triffids as zeds ?

jpattern2 Supporting Member of TMP14 Nov 2012 12:12 p.m. PST

Nope, none whatsoever.

kreoseus214 Nov 2012 3:21 p.m. PST

Just me so….

jpattern2 Supporting Member of TMP14 Nov 2012 3:47 p.m. PST

But, hey, it's your game. If you want to call triffids zeds, I certainly won't stop you.

Jemima Fawr27 Nov 2012 6:52 p.m. PST

A new sort of Zombie Apocalypse (tm) has recently begun in the UK: As soon as public figures die they become child molestors.

Kyn ell Inactive Member27 Nov 2012 9:24 p.m. PST

Jeezus, now I would be petrified of a Jimmy Saville zombie…Yikes!!

What about the reanimated dead from The Reanimator films, don't forget them. They aren't infected or spread disease, some have human intelligence, some insane, but I would reckon are still "Zombies"

Dario Argengo's movies Demons 1 & 2, these are humans demon infected by a scratch/bite that become homicidal killing "zombified" monsters. Quite similar, but I think falls into the catagory.

Krondorian Demons in the evil dead movies and games/comics are in a similar vein to the above, being reffered to as deadites etc. These qualify too I think.

Cronenbergs "Rabid" is another where the infected victims turn into psycho's from the main character spreading the disease with her weird "growth" under her arm etc.

A common theme with most of what we class as zombies, is the introduction of some kind of external pathogen or disease/agent that enters the human body and takes over the host body and allows a transformation to take place. Voodoo Zombies are Drugged and brainwashed, return of the living dead zombies are reanimated from the gas from a military experiment. In the Romero films its the crashed satallite with the disease, Resi it's the Tvirus, 28 days later its the rage Virus, Reanimator its the re-agent, Evildead and demons 1 &2 , its demonic possession (Even in the REC movies, the disease is derived from demonic possession)

So, I reckon its down to some kind of external thing entering and taking over.

I have seen stuff where the cause of the infection was plant based spores infecting creating a zombie alike,even worms and bugs controlling the body, but not triffids!
Do you mean body snatchers? They were alien plant clones quite similar to zombies in some of the movies based on that idea…

Personal logo flooglestreet Supporting Member of TMP28 Nov 2012 11:52 a.m. PST

The Zombies in Zombies of the Stratosphere are definitely Zombies, but not Zombies as we on earth understand the term. They are Zombies who are alive, are able to think, move quickly and don't need to feed on brains. This makes them very dangerous Zombies. YouTube link

Ark3nubis Inactive Member28 Nov 2012 8:16 p.m. PST

For me the whole thing with zombies is that they are relentless, mindless and insatiable. It is this uncompromising behaviour mixed with the fact that they are physically hard to put down due to effectively being 're-animated dead' that appeals to me and truly defines zombie. With that definition you end up at the Walking Dead as the exact model for a zombie. Intelligence has been removed, and replaced with single minded 'mindlessness'.

That said, I would then accept 28 days/weeks (and hopefully months) later where the above definition of a zombie would be stretched to include these living infected. The issue then of 'what makes a zombie?' would have, for me, to be one thing, and that's the uncompromising single mindedness again. It's that behaviour that underpins all zombie films IMO and puts them at odds with humans in the first place. If there's intelligence (in terms of self awareness, the ability to reason) then I don't see how they are zombies. This does leave the answer to the thread's question open to a larger pool of answers than just saying 'Walking Dead' zombies or whatever.

Cheers,

Ark3n

PistolPete30 Nov 2012 4:27 p.m. PST

Anyone who comes to destroy my brain. So anyone in middle management

Maxshadow Supporting Member of TMP30 Nov 2012 6:10 p.m. PST

they are relentless, mindless and insatiable

yes that pretty much describes middle managment

Personal logo Cacique Caribe Supporting Member of TMP30 Nov 2012 9:18 p.m. PST

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