"Best scale for 28mm Vehicles?" Topic

I have posed this question on another thread but seemed to have crossed some line or other so I hope no-one will be offended if I pose it again in a new thread…

With the release of Bolt Action, I detect a resurgence of interest in 28mm WW2 gaming, and being something of a tread head, although the rules are meant primarily for Infantry action, I can see 28mm AFVs in my future…

So what scale should I go for?

As I understand it the possiblities are 1/48, 1/50 or 1/56. What are the pros and cons please?

No Ralph,

Resist the temptation and save yourself from perpetual

purgatory……..

I think its a personal preference.
It is what YOU think looks right.

I have all three in my collection, but *I* believe that 1/50 looks the best. But its hard to get vehicles in that size.

I also got some 'smaller' 1/32s that look good and 'larger' 1/72 that mix in as well that look good too.

Its what YOUR eye likes.

Well, having all three scales my personal view is that 1/56 althoguh probably closer to "scale" can tend to LOOK ie visually on the table; they can look a little small. I think that thsi is a consequence of the basing of 28mm figures.

My 1/48 scale vehicles (PzIV, Hanomags, Shermans and Greyhounds) look good with the 28mm figures but look awful on a table with 1/56 vehicles.

I've only seen a handful of 1/50 scale models and depending on manufacture they can fit with 1/48 OK.

The biggest consideration these days I think are availability and cost. The range of 1/56 is growing fast and the ones I source are quite affordable resin kits.

The 1/48s seem to generally either be plastic kits (I'm mostly familiar with Tamiya) or die cast and QuarterKit in France do have a very good range but these can be VERY costly unless you strike the bargain sales.

Lastly, what are your gaming group using? 1/48 just don't on the same table as 1/56…….

Me 2 cents worth

No Ralph,

Resist the temptation and save yourself from perpetual

purgatory……..

Too late, Steve, I think that ship has sailed – I now have collections in 1/144,1/100,/1/72 so I'm sure another won't hurt….

Thanks for all the quick responses guys. So so far the consensus seems to be:

a. Its all in the eye of the beholder
b. Just don't mix the scales!

On an allied note, what do we think of Blitzkreig miniatures, who are 1/48th scale?

My personal taste is for 1/60th (WestWind) and 1/56th (various). I think they're much more in scale with the figures, and that the 1/48th and 1/50th stuff is too large. Just my opinion; if you love the bigger stuff – that's cool.

I think 1/56 offers the most availability of vehicles at the best price and are the easier to assemble and paint. By this point, there isn't much that is missing for all periods and theaters of the war as far as most common vehicles go. They look small only if you have thick bases and use the larger end of the spectrum of minis.

1/48 is growing but so much of what is out there are model kits.

Just my two cents. Someone will surely come along and say the complete opposite of course.

What period of the war, which theater, and which nations are you looking to do?

I'm firmly in the 1/48 camp, but that's mainly because so much of my vehicle collection is in the 1/48 – 1/50 range. Even so, I think I would have chose 1/48 and 1/50 over 1/56 anyway because of the disproportionate dimensions of my 28mm figures from Warlord, Artizan Designs and Crusader. These so-called 'heroic scale' figures are not proportionately correct, as they are quite bulky relative to their height.

However, if you go for the realistically proportioned 28mm figures like those from Wargames Factory or Offensive Miniatures, 1/56 might be more suitable.

My question is, how do you do early war in 1/48? I can't think of many options for French, Poles, or early war Germans. Gaso.line does some, but they are expensive and pretty fragile and detailed.

Late war is pretty covered. At one point I was collecting 1/48, but the availability put me off.

Also, to be honest, I think most 28mm minis look fine next to either 1/48 or 1/56 as long as the two aren't next to each other on the table.

It is a matter of choice, I prefer the 1:48th – 1:50th scale vehicles.

I have done a lot of research on this matter (spoke with many industry manufactures, scale experts, modelers, painters and so on) and it is conclusive for me, there is no true scale for 28mm miniatures because the 28mm miniature is not to scale in regards to proportions. Due to the 28mm miniatures girth issues, connected integral base and then added figure base (in most cases miniature or plastic base) I go with the 1:48th – 1:50th vehicles . 1:56th is just too darn small for me. Then of course there is "scale creep".

I am not sure what others are talking about when it comes to the availability of 1:48 – 50th scale vehicles, there are literally dozens of manufactures and secondary market sellers and hundreds of kits out there, Frontline Games is coming out with a SLEW of the larger wargame vehicles (Just released a lot of them and more to follow): frontline-games.com

Not to mention the prices are great ranging from as little as $6.00 USD (Classic Armor Diecast a few years ago released fully painted 1:50th armored vehicles for $6 USD! – many of us were all over that). There are Model kits and Wargaming kits alike out there.

Because 1:48th – 1:50th scales are "model" scales you will continue to see models come and go by various makers for this size – there will be no monopoly. It is a competitive market which generates competitive pricing (this is why you see Hobby Boss kits go for $10 USD – $15 USD a pop some times).

Take your time, look into it for your self and pick a scale and enjoy the game, but I am with the other fella – once you pick a scale stick with it as mixing them just does not look good – and again that is my humble opinion.

And above all enjoy the hobby!

Warlord

Seduced by the dark side…………

I went with the 1/56th scale (mostly Company B). At first I was thinking of going with 1/48th scale but I couldn't find a lot of the vehicles I wanted and I also suck at model building. I find that 1/56th scale works fine with the figures I'm using, they are easy to put together and there are a lot of models to choose from.

I am of the one scale crowd pick one and use that so the vehicle look consistent next to each other

Whatever you choose I have to stay with 1/50th and 1/48th for Late War. These are a mix of Corgi, Solido, and Tamiya Vehicles with some BlackTree and Verlinden Guns. There are also four Tony Ashcroft resin 251's.

link

link

I have some other US vehicles which I am painting right now and have to work my way through the pre-painted Tanks which look a bit odd.
I really need to paint more Infantry though.
Dan.

I prefer the first two (1/48th – 1/50th), since I think they offer the most availability of vehicles at the best price.

Plus, they still look okay with the minis, if you use those larger, thicker bases under your troops.

Dan, those look great! I have began to repaint my CAD models – the PzKpfw IVs are almost done and working on my US armor now – I have a WIP on my Blog for the M4A3 76mm:

link

Here is a shot of one of my German PzKpfw IIIM (bad lighting)I had a lot of fun doing the damaged fenders on this one:

And my Sherman M4A3:

Both models are Frontline Games. Working on 3 Sherman M4A3s (75mm) right now for some Kelly's Heros action. I have to paint more of my U.S. infantry, so I am with you with having to paint more troops – just really like painting the armor.

Warlord

Depends on the figs to go with them! I use Bolt Action figures and Pulp Figures. 1/56 seems a bit small with Pulp. Still, 1/56 is not bad.

Warlord, thanks. Here is my City terrain WIP still.

link

My figures are BlackTree, Artizan, BAM and Crusader mounted on washers which I think looks ok with 1/48th 1/50th vehicles.

My Early War figures are mainly Foundry Home Guard and German Paras with 1/56th scale vehicles.

Dan.

1:56th is correct, although the bases on figures tend to make the vehicles look small because the bases raise the figures higher than they should be.

See mainly28s.com

It is very easy. You can use either. First check what vehicles you want to get and look at the availability in the different scales. If 1:56 is best base the vehicles. If 1:48/50 is best don't base the vehicles. That way the figures will look right with the vehicles.
I use based 1:56 for my early war collection and unbiased 1:48/50 for late war, but Imuse the 1:48 figures from Corgi and Scarab miniatures for my late war anyway, but heroic 28mm figures will look fine with unbiased 1;48 tanks.

Here's the thing

I'm a lover of 1/56 but

really thinking about it the whole ‘what is right and wrong' is impossible.

After all we are comparing scale for vehicles to size for figures. With a scale you can say what size the figures should be for a given height, waist inside leg etc. But you cannot make the reverse argument i.e. what scale is 28mm?

They aren't to any scale. So what height does 28mm mean? It's about what you like.

1/56 – It's just one of those things that has crept in. If you assume that the human is 5' 10" (or approx. 1750mm) to head, and your scale is 1/56th then same height is 31.25mm: after allowing about 4"/100mm (scales @ 1.78mm) for eye to top of head the miniature should be 29.47mm eye-to-foot! But the model is actually 28mm over that distance.

Then the math suggests 1/56 is reasonably accurate, if anything a bit big.

What the heck? We then put our models onto bases. Slottas are say 5mm tall that's like wandering around on an 11" tall pedestal. No wonder they look out of size next to most unbased vehicles. So you buy bigger scale, because for ease on the eye it sits better with your collection and your style of basing or whatever. Maybe the 1/48th models are cheaper or more available. Let's be honest there's a huge choice out there now.

I say buy what you like the look of, base them how you want. Make them, paint them and roll the dice.

Ramble around Daily Mail island over 

John FoA – Off for my medication

Down side is that Front Range seems to be out of stock of nearly everything. Nuts!

I use the 1:48 vehicles and planes they used to sell at Walmart, like the PzIV, jeeps, and so on. They look better with my BTD figures. Basing 1/56 armor would raise it up, making it look more compatible with figures, but I dislike based armor.

Die cast 1/72 is really nice, cheap, and keeps calling to me to switch scales.

Dan:

Love your pics, I am going to have to bookmark you. The buildings are very nice. Really like the Big building on the side of your table in the rear of the photo – did you build that one?

This is a picture of my finished Stalingrad table I built a few years ago for a Frontline Command demo game:

Here is a link to my Stalingrad table start to finish WIP:
link

As far a scales go:
I am with most on here as far as the scale debate goes, be very leery when someone tells you there is a "true" scale for 28mm. I really like the 28mm miniatures a lot but there is NO SCALE of vehicle for those little chunky guys, they are a scale all to them selves.

You must consider the girth as well as the height when considering scale; armored vehicles have hatches, ports, openings and crew compartments the little chunky guys just could not get through – don't really matter to much if the miniature is the right height if he is 2-3 times the girth (chunkiness) of a average normal man proportionately. Miniatures manufactures further exasperate the problem by all making their own scales – not one truly fits with another – either a little bigger or a little smaller. That would be fine if it was just the miniatures but it caries over to the weapons, and weapons "should" be the same size no matter what as they are a constant – an MP40 will be the same size in a big guys hand as it is in a little guys hand.

Have a look at this article written about it here:
link

This is enough to give anyone a "Headache" pick one and have fun!

Warlord

Warlord, I saw your project awhile ago and was reminded when I checked your links above. I really like the amount of detail you have put into it.

Mines a bit rough and a mixture of different projects which seem to work together ok.
The big building a the back was made by me for a Stalingrad Demo game we put on at a convention about four years ago. I cannot find any photos of it. I'm still doing the rolling stock.

Did you see the Dads Army photos?

link

Dan.

save money and go with 1/48 scale you can find tanks for $20 USD to $29. USD

link

Thanks Dan, I did not and they are really cool!

I just bought a bunch of those brits on bikes too.

Your table looks great and that building is cool, it would be neat to see some WIPs as you add to it.

Warlord

Sparker,

I don't think anyone was offended or felt you had crossed a line on the thread I started. I was focusing on 1/56th as that is what I have in my collection and what I "think" is the best way to go. As others have pointed out, and I have as well, you go with what you like. The debate on what scale is correct for 28 mm is one of those that can take on a life of its own.

Thanks Whitemanticore, its all good!

Thanks all for the advice. Plenty to think about, but what has struck home is that a couple of you have pointed out that you can either use 1/56 and base the models, and I understand a lot of the resin stuff comes that way anyhow, or use 1/48th but don't base.

As I happen to not like basing my vehicles, I think that answers things for me! So thanks for all your thoughts and useful links.

You really don't have to base 1/56 stuff. It looks fine, especially if your models are on thin washers or bases already. Height is only one of the dimensions under consideration, and probably one of the less important. I think availability for your chosen theater and period is far more important. As it is now, you can't do all theaters, nations, and periods in any one scale yet.

Keith makes a very good point. I base my figures on fender washers so they are pretty flat on the table. I have a mix of vehicles that do and do not have bases. That part just does not bother me. The other point Keith makes is the availability of models related to the different theaters. The ETO is perhaps the best represented and next would be North Africa or the Russian Front.