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"Will we ever see another Arty Conliffe game?" Topic


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13 Jun 2012 3:21 p.m. PST
by Editor in Chief Bill

  • Changed title from "Will we ever see another Arty Confliffe game?" to "Will we ever see another Arty Conliffe game?"

2,041 hits since 12 Jun 2012
©1994-2014 Bill Armintrout
Comments or corrections?

Personal logo Midpoint Supporting Member of TMP13 Jun 2012 11:44 a.m. PST

Arty Conliffe has designed some good games, amongst which are:

Armati
Spearhead
Crossfire
Shako.

Those have all been influential, and some had genuinely innovative designs IMPO – Crossfire for example.

Will we ever see the publication of another one?

If we did, I'd be likely to buy it regardless of period or scope.

Alas – I don't think we'll ever see another Arty Conliffe game.

Personal logo ACWBill Supporting Member of TMP13 Jun 2012 11:52 a.m. PST

How about Spearhead V2? I would buy that.

Personal logo Midpoint Supporting Member of TMP13 Jun 2012 11:55 a.m. PST

And I'm sure you are not alone in that.
And I'm sure it would be true for Tactica 2 etc.

I'm increasingly sure we'll never see them published.

We MIGHT see semi-pro versions of sets developed/evolved by groups who've focused their gaming around them, but something with an ISBN and a barcode? Nope.

Checking on BGG, Armati 2 is 2004. I don't think there has been anything since then – Shako 2 being Dave Waxtel and co.

Il Condottiero13 Jun 2012 12:02 p.m. PST

I've been a member of the Tactica Yahoo group for years. As best I can tell, Tactica 2 has been promised for over a decade. Last word was that it was out to playtest groups and was going to be released in March of this year. Oh well. I hope it is worth the frustratingly long wait! laugh

Personal logo Midpoint Supporting Member of TMP13 Jun 2012 12:07 p.m. PST

There is a dedicated group of players of a draft of T2 at my local club. They have been 'playtesting' since at least 2004!

Absent evidence to the contrary – Tactica 2 ain't happening as a professional publication.

ancientsgamer Supporting Member of TMP13 Jun 2012 12:09 p.m. PST

Patriots and Loyalists was co-written with Scott Holder too.

Spreewaldgurken Inactive Member13 Jun 2012 12:14 p.m. PST

I have great reverence for Arty's skills as a game writer. He understood the importance of getting things down to the few, key elements and focusing on what mattered. He understood how hard it is, to make something simple.

Arty got really burned out. He got sick of dealing with a million requests for this and that scenario or variant, people arguing about paces and drill regulations, or demanding the umpteenth justification for why the Saxon Volunteer Fusilier Cuirassiers were a +1 modifier and not a +2….

I last spoke with him nearly a decade ago, and he told me, "I don't want to devote my life to this."

Who can blame him?

Personal logo Midpoint Supporting Member of TMP13 Jun 2012 12:20 p.m. PST

Sam,

In your opinion then – we've seen the last game from him?

A shame if that is the case.

I agree strongly wrt his skill at abstraction/simplification whilst retaining essence.

John Leahy Sponsoring Member of TMP13 Jun 2012 12:21 p.m. PST

Actually Tactica 2 started out as Tactica 2000. I agree that Arty is one of the BEST in the hobby. It's a shame he got burned out.

Thanks,

John

Yesthatphil13 Jun 2012 12:48 p.m. PST

Re your 2004, Midpoint … Don't forget A2 was Arty C _and Rob Wolsky (and with Rob in the driving seat, I believe) …

Personal logo Midpoint Supporting Member of TMP13 Jun 2012 12:51 p.m. PST

Phil – so in fact the last time Arty was in the driving seat was…Crossfire in the 90's? 1996?

I know you keep up with the Armati news – do you think we'll ever see Armati Renaissance or Tactica 2?

Steve W13 Jun 2012 12:54 p.m. PST

Well Great War Spearhead is getting close with final proof reading going on at the moment as I understand it from the yahoo group

Personal logo Midpoint Supporting Member of TMP13 Jun 2012 12:59 p.m. PST

Steve – will that be a 'fan-written' publication or a fully professional job?

greatwarspearhead.com suggests the former. That isn't meant as a criticism, but I note that Arty's name doesn't seem to be associated with it.

Steve W13 Jun 2012 1:28 p.m. PST

I am a member of the group and Arty is reading the stuff to proof read, maybe one of the owners of the group would like to confirm

This message was from the 4th January this year from one of the moderators of the group


'We are still waiting for final word from Arty on its publication and
release. Sorry but it does take a bit to get everything sorted out.'

From April this year Shawn Taylor wrote on the group

'Everything is with Arty and he is working his
magic to get things finished'

So I guess this means that Arty is involved in the process

doug redshirt Supporting Member of TMP13 Jun 2012 2:58 p.m. PST

Shame about Tactica 2. It was probably the best ancient ruleset I have ever played and that is going back to the 70s. It would have blown FOG out of the water. I was running convention games with people new to the rules in 2 to 3 hours from start to finish. It works as a fun game at home among friends or as a tournament game.

Yesthatphil13 Jun 2012 3:10 p.m. PST

I know you keep up with the Armati news – do you think we'll ever see Armati Renaissance or Tactica 2?

There is a lot of enthusiasm and 'pressure' on both projects for a fan-based synopsis/crystalisation … but I don't think Armati-Ren will otherwise emerge. The Glasgow connection will know more than me about Tactica 2, of course …

Spreewaldgurken Inactive Member13 Jun 2012 4:07 p.m. PST

Yes, Tactica was pure genius. You have to remember what wargame rules were like in the 1980s, to appreciate how revolutionary it was. I hate to abuse popular clichés, but it was a "game changer." (pun intended.)

MikeKT Inactive Member13 Jun 2012 5:04 p.m. PST

So two questions are whether Tactica 2 is the rule set of the future and whether it always will be.

Frothers Did It And Ran Away14 Jun 2012 1:58 a.m. PST

Crossfire 2 is another promised set which has failed to appear. IMO Arty ought to just reprint the original, having it OOP is a real shame as these awesome rules could be picking up a lot of new players.

Personal logo Midpoint Supporting Member of TMP14 Jun 2012 2:35 a.m. PST

I agree Alex.

Personal logo rampantlion Supporting Member of TMP14 Jun 2012 6:27 a.m. PST

I love Tactica Medieval and still run convention games using it due to the easy to use mechanics which have players up and running on their

own in a few short turns, whil still producing an exciting and fun game. I have made several modifications though. I am also a member of the Tactica yahoo group and still hope that the 2nd version is released some day. Maybe if Arty didn't want to fight the fight anymore he would be willing to let someone else pick up his ideas for T2 and run with them?? Just a thought.

Allen

Personal logo Midpoint Supporting Member of TMP14 Jun 2012 7:22 a.m. PST

Allen

Do you mean a semi-pro version like the Spearhead team mentioned above?

That seems more possible than a fully professional, Arty led publication, but still not very likely at all.

jefritrout Supporting Member of TMP14 Jun 2012 8:07 a.m. PST

I played tested Tactica 2 for the first year it came out, but then I moved to where the new gamers around me weren't interested in Ancient gaming so I left the loop.

Ancientgamer – Actually Patriots and Loyalists was a game written by Wally Simon. Scott played it with us in Wally's basement and loved it. He published it with some minor adjustments (changing Wally's terrain rule especially). I'm not sure how Arty's name came to be attached to it. Let me be clear though that Scott did NOT steal Wally's rules, they were friends and agreed to the publishing. Also Wally's rules were for 7YW and Scott cleaned it up and made it AWI specific.

Personal logo rampantlion Supporting Member of TMP14 Jun 2012 10:00 a.m. PST

Midpoint, I was thinking that maybe someone could "buy" the rules from Arty and market them with his permission and blessing. Take them to cons, get them in print, etc…But if they go to the expense and trouble they could get the reward of it. I hate seeing potentially great products not make it to market, a problem we see far to often in our "cottage industry" hobby.

Allen

Personal logo Midpoint Supporting Member of TMP14 Jun 2012 10:33 a.m. PST

Allen,

I have heard that this was attempted with Armati, but the offer turned down. I can't say I have/remember the details though.

Personal logo rampantlion Supporting Member of TMP14 Jun 2012 10:44 a.m. PST

That's a shame, but I cannot judge the decision if I don't know the details, so I will have to assume that he has a good reason for doing what he is doing (or not doing in this case).

Allen

lkmjbc314 Jun 2012 3:30 p.m. PST

Does anyone know how to get a play test copy of Tactica2?

Joe Collins

Il Condottiero14 Jun 2012 6:22 p.m. PST

Maybe contact Arty through the Tactica Yahho group:

link

Personal logo Midpoint Supporting Member of TMP15 Jun 2012 2:24 a.m. PST

I have been told that any contact with Arty is extremely rare and usually indirect. Related to the point Sam noted above I s'pose.

I was rather hoping that someone would come in and say something along the lines of 'Not at all! X is off to the printers next week and will be released blah, blah, blah'.

Alas, it seems not.

Il Condottiero15 Jun 2012 5:46 a.m. PST

I have been told that any contact with Arty is extremely rare and usually indirect.

He posted as recently as June 10 on the Tactica Yahoo group. Maybe he'd respond to questions about his rules? Who knows?

Personal logo Midpoint Supporting Member of TMP15 Jun 2012 6:04 a.m. PST

I've just scanned the group messages and can't find that posting.

I COULD find some questions from group members in March asking if T2 was going to be published. Those were unanswered alas.

I think there was a response from Arty in May 2011 stating it would be released last summer. And before that there is one from late 2010 describing it as imminent.

So…On the one hand it looks like there MIGHT be another Arty Conliffe game. On the other I won't hold my breath!

Personal logo Tango 2 3 Ditto Supporting Member of TMP15 Jun 2012 4:23 p.m. PST

Crossfire 2 is another promised set which has failed to appear. IMO Arty ought to just reprint the original, having it OOP is a real shame as these awesome rules could be picking up a lot of new players.

I have to agree with Alex.

My understanding is that Arty wanted to clarify a few points players new to CF sometimes have difficulty understanding. As well, some clarification on figure/gun/tank representation that was confusing in the rules. There were going to be possibly some new rules that were to be play tested.

I was a bit concerned about the last item as I was worried about the effects of some very good fellows on the CF Yahoo who I thought (my opinion and meaning no disrespect to these guys) were playing or interpreting things in odd ways. Ignoring pins doesn't affect the game? Hmmmm grin

I sometimes get inquiries via my web site as to where to obtain the rules (I refer them to last year's entry on this on the official CF site: link ) so I think a reprint would be more than enough to satisfy the demand and generate new interest.

Just my view grin
--
Tim

Personal logo Midpoint Supporting Member of TMP16 Jun 2012 1:03 a.m. PST

Do you think that is likely to happen Tim?

Il Condottiero16 Jun 2012 5:45 a.m. PST

Midpoint-I thought the question was whether Arty was able to be contacted. "Othello" (Arty's email name) appears as late as June 10 of this year. So, he is accessible. Whether he answers questions about the release of T2 is another matter. But, he's somewhat active on the Tsctica yahoo group.

Cheers.

John Leahy Sponsoring Member of TMP16 Jun 2012 5:24 p.m. PST

Yep, that's pretty much the only place you'll ever see Arty on the net. Creative as hell. Just not very active any longer.

Thanks,

John

By John 54 Supporting Member of TMP20 Jun 2012 8:31 a.m. PST

I think he should smush Crossfire, and Hit the Dirt, together, in one book, all you need. there. enjoy.

I agree it's a damn shame that Crossfire, the most innovative set of rules of the last 20 years, is OOP.

John

UnfortunateWound Inactive Member24 Aug 2012 10:22 a.m. PST

If they reprinted Crossfire, I'd buy half a dozen copies and spread them around. Seriously, it deserves more love and more play from the community than it gets.

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