"Napoleonic cannon crater size for 28mm. " Topic

Hello Folks,

What is the diameter of a Napoleonic cannon crater size in 28m? I plan to sculpt a few for my gaming table. I can not find any ready made online. If there is one, would you gents kindly provide a link or photo reference?

Thank you for your time,

VS

I don't know if I would expect a crater, the ball would either bury itself in the ground or graze the ground giving a tear in the grass and topsoil.

In soft soil the soil would "splash" and the mark would be larger than the size of the ball. I would expect a rabbit hole or for those in the US a Gopher sized hole

You might want to model a tear in the grassy turf with a ball pushing up soil in front of it, the graze would be a of a similar width to the ball.

Shells were intended to explode in the air above troops so again I have no expectation of World War one sized craters.

Happy to be proved wrong though

rabbit

VS, mine is a typical internet response. Nothing but opinion with the minimal facts upon which to base it. The only difference is that I am at least honest enough to say that.

So, here goes… British guns fired an exploding shell and so did Russian licorns. However, for others, only howitzers fired an exploding shell. The non-howitzers (guns) fired solid shot and cannister, neither of which would produce a crater. Generally, howitzers comprised 1/4 to 1/3 of the guns in a battery. Thus, there would be very few rounds capable of producing a crater, except for the British.

Next, my understanding is that the explosion was caused by a fuse burning in the round. For a atrget further away, cut the fuse longer. For a closer target, cut it shorter. It was not impact detonated. Thus, a certain percentage would explode in air, which was probably better anyway. Thus, even fewer craters.

But as to the size, I have no idea. In my reading of Vietnam bomb craters, it seems the size depended on a lot more than the size of the bomb. The soil itself made a big difference. All I can say is that I would expect a Napoleonic era crater to be pretty small, whatever size that is.

I do craters for my Vietnam games, but never considered it for Napoleonics.

A lot of help, I am sure.

Tom

Cannon craters? Have you been watching movies again, where all cannonballs explode?

The British exploding shell was invented by Lt. Shrapnel, which of course is why it is called that today.
Shrapnel shells do no really make a large hole in the ground as the explosive charge is not that big. The idea is to spread small balls and bits of outer case around an area hitting intended targets.

My advice would be to put BB's or small ball bearings painted black around the table to look like artillery ball shot that is spent.

The size of a shell crater depends very much on how deep the projectile buried itself before it exploded. The ammunition of the 20th Century had a much higher velocity than those of the early 19th century giving the shell holes we know so well. 100 years before, howitzer rounds tended to lie on the surface when they exploded so that what was left was usually shallow and relatively small with more of a scorch mark than anything else. Where the ground was soft and the round buried itself a bit more, the resulting low pressure explosion (gunpowder being so very less effective than modern high explosive) tended to be muffled leaving little behind. Accounts from the time tend to refer to the ground being 'ploughed up' by roundshot rather than being cratered by howitzers. Hope that helps.

Yes my perception of the cannon shots were from movies and video games. Now I know.

Thank you gentlemen for the valuable information. I learned alot!

VS

Here's an example, take Gettysburg. On 3 July you had the heaviest most concentrated artillery bombardment to that time. Hundreds of guns firing, number of craters zero, and here is why. The bursting charges were small, in addition it was the gunners intent to whenever a time fuse was use, to get an air-burst. In addition these were the days before high explosives. Now while you can get an impressive explosion with black powder (just ask the men at the Crater in Petersburg) you need a lot of it, certainly more than would be found in a 12 pound shell. BTW, interesting and cool username.

Stop watching movies as historical facts

VS,

Just know that you didn't ask a dumb question. And the only dumb question is the one that you don't ask. Thanks to all those above who gave thoughtful answers to VS' query.

And John, your response was my initial impression as well.

Jim

You might get furrows where a ball has ploughed through the soil.

Cannon craters? Have you been watching movies again, where all cannonballs explode?

Stop watching movies as historical facts

From what I've heard of the Napoleonics board, I expected more unhelpful answers like these so I'm pleasantly surprised that most responders treated the question seriously and gave informed answers to it.

Good stuff.

Doug

Sorry if anyone thought my answer was flippant. And I do believe any question is in order.

Now while you can get an impressive explosion with black powder (just ask the men at the Crater in Petersburg) you need a lot of it,

And even then, when I visited the above mentioned crater, it was suprisingly small……