"Defiance Games previews Germans for Alien War" Topic

The Bugs are getting close and the Germans are in the final stages of design before going to moldmaking. More news at the site:

defiancegames.com/index.php/news/item/next-sets-for-defiance

Thanks guys,

Tony

Tony Reidy
Defiance Games
defiancegames.com

It should be noted that these are Bundeswehr 2260, the soldiers of a democratic federal Germany rather than "Nazis in Spaaaace!" Several present and former members of the German armed forces have been consulted on this.

I like it.

Looking forward to getting my UAMC figures and bonus Gunny.

Well they should be out in 6-8 months if they follow their track record.

That looks very nice. Congratulations, Tony and crew.

I do wonder about the lunch box pattern groin protection. But I suppose Herr Pansy Grenz is wearing a fair amount of leather under there to smooth out any corners ;-)

I would like to give Tony a half-benefit of the doubt on these. Their new injection-molded-plastic caster appears to have gotten the bugs worked out of that system, so these should be quicker to the market.

First items through a production process are always a pain in the butt.

I'm not going to give Tony a pass on how he manages his customer expectations.

[edit]If these are going to be in the new spincast plastic/resin stuff, will there be separate guns available for converters?

. Their new injection-molded-plastic caster appears to have gotten the bugs worked out of that system, so these should be quicker to the market.

First items through a production process are always a pain in the butt.

I underderstand they ditched the folks that did the Marines which are no longer USMC and have started with a new contractor and a new process. So this WILL be a first time through the process.

Looks fierce, very well done.

Thanks everyone – these are shaping up quite nicely. We'll have more of the final pieces to show off over the next few days.

CPT Jake – we didn't "ditch" anyone. We are still working closely with the toolmaker who did the UAMC and have a project gearing up with them. Also, this WILL NOT be the first project with the new guys – this is the 3rd one.

I refuse to believe this thread is not a spoof – seriously Tony, tell me you have not started puffing your next product in May 2012 while the people who pre-ordered your first product in November 2011 have still not got their stuff?

No, I have to assume the poster calling himself 'Defiance Games' is Connard Sage, or some other merry prankster deliberately trying to cast ridicule on the real business.

Please tell me I am right, someone? Please?

Pat

looks nice than the marines so far.

From Neal at the warstore I can expect my marines today or tomarrow at the latest ….unfortunately I'm deployed, so I'll need verification from my wife! ;)
As far as late product….do I have to wait another year for the plastic veteran Confederate infantry!?….defiance Games is not the only manufacturer to have delays.

Nice – I'll buy some once they're released.

But not before.

@Tony: So these are not going to be injection-molded plastic, then?

I would like those guns available as bits, please!

I'll second the request for bits guns. The figs look pretty good.

But please, please, please no more leaf-blower SAWs with grenade launchers. Not ever 40K is that bad. Proper stock, GLs for the rifles.

Thanks guys – we've had a LOT of requests for separate weapon packs. We're going to sort that one out after we release these guys.

Here's the latest:

Dedicated grenade launcher – field cap. You will have enough helmets to do ALL in helmets. You'll have enough caps and bare heads to do all like that as well. You'll have enough female heads to do ALL female too if you so desire. ;-)

Thanks again,
Tony

Not bad. I quite like the renders in fact, so I'll probably bite, but only once they're shipped and in stock.

I'm more interested in the bugs (since I bought 100+ human infantry recently), but I'm tempted to pick up a few boxes of these when they are available in the UK……any news on a UK stockist?

Now THESE have my interest……

any news on a UK stockist?

Caliver Books has Defiance Games listed as one of the manufacturers they stock (though strangely enough, they are listed under historical rather than fantasy figures).

Good news on the helmeted head front, but I hope there's room on the sprue for some variety in leg options.

I don't like the helmet that much -- too busy, why does it have shot/shrapnel catchers? Smooth helmets, please!! Hopefully they'll also have a head option with an open-face helmet as well.

I'll buy these when I see them in the flesh (marines as well) but so we don't have more train wreck threads, get them out quick, it may be said "there's no such thing as bad publicity" but you've come damn close to proving it wrong.

any news on a UK stockist?

Caliver Books has Defiance Games listed as one of the manufacturers they stock (though strangely enough, they are listed under historical rather than fantasy figures).

Thanks, now I know where to go when the bugs come out.

I don't like the helmet that much -- too busy, why does it have shot/shrapnel catchers? Smooth helmets, please!! Hopefully they'll also have a head option with an open-face helmet as well.

Have you *seen* modern helmets with a gasmask worn under them? They're at least as bad as that helmet design.

Gotta admit, I'm actually waiting for the bugs. The Germans are not a priority item, I just need a weapon family that looks like a small arm ~200 years from now for some conversion work on Infinity minis.

any news on a UK stockist?

Caliver Books has Defiance Games listed as one of the manufacturers they stock (though strangely enough, they are listed under historical rather than fantasy figures).

Perhaps they're anticipating a long shipping time….?

Another pose – this one the advancing/at-the-ready arm pose from the artwork:

Mexican Jack Squint 01 May 2012 9:36 p.m. PST:

It should be noted that these are Bundeswehr 2260, the soldiers of a democratic federal Germany rather than "Nazis in Spaaaace!" Several present and former members of the German armed forces have been consulted on this

It's good to hear such renowned futurists have been consulted both on the technology and the projected politics front (-;)

But yes, making an attempt at something else than sciffying up WWI/WWII German uniforms is always welcome.

As to the render itself, it's a marked improvement over how the UAMC looked at this stage. Still suffers from the big head, long arms, short legs syndrome common in the business of course, but I'm well aware it doesn't bother most people. Not quite sure what all the indentations on the armour are for either. But generally it looks quite decent and above all more interesting than the UAMCs.

Since it is still at the render stage, some things you might want to consider:

All those holes in the armor make it look like a LARPer wearing his paintball armor or motorcross pads. I'm also afraid they won't come out in the actual mold as planned. I would simplify in places.

His shoulders look too low. The marines had the same problem. With those I thought that the people assembling them were just putting the arms on a little low, a common mistake with multi part minis. But now it seems a design flaw.

Why are the guns so big? I know that is also common in minis in general, but since you are trying for a more realistic future concept, it just seems more glaring. They would look a lot better scaled back to 70-80%.

Just my two cents.

Pretty sure those are speed holes. You know, makes the armour go faster?

Female heads on male bodies?? *blech* That seems like a poor design choice, unlikely to yield anything but unconvincing and confusing models. At best.

The holes add interest and character I like them and female heads just give you more choice, the fact it uses the same body shouldn't be a problem given it's full body armour, so womanly curves aren't going to show through anyway.

Female heads on male bodies?? *blech* That seems like a poor design choice, unlikely to yield anything but unconvincing and confusing models. At best.

Like you can quickly tell the difference between a 5'8", 140lb guy under 35lbs of body armor and a 5'8", 140lb girl under 35lbs of body armor

Well, in the case of Defiance, you're correct, they probably couldn't get the heights and waist to hip ratio correct. I'll be curious to see if the heads are identifiably female at all.

Look at HassleFree's scifi troopers and you'll see why you shouldn't use the same bodies, if you want to do it right.

I think there's room for both cute hasslefree (and Denizen) women* plus room for big, butch german women as Panzer Grenadiers.

Takes all sorts…

John T

*both of whom make little lead ladies I'm very very keen on

Most females are likely to be slightly smaller than most males, even 250 years from now so yes, there should be a difference even if the armour they wear isn't the "industry standard" of 'D-cup body armour and 4" heel combat boots' (-;)

Almost certainly this applies in a future where baseline human form looks to be, well, the baseline as it appears to be in Alien Wars (based on the renders released solely).

You didn't actually read what I'd written, did you?

Here, let me re-format that for you.

Like you could tell the difference between:
a 5'8", 140lb male wearing 35lbs of armor, and
a 5'8", 140lb female wearing 35lbs of armor.

Two people, same height and weight. One male, one female. Both wearing armor that's a quarter of their body weight.

I've done the math, a 28mm figure at 3 feet is the same apparent size as a real person 65 yards away. Can you tell the difference between a man and a woman 65 yards away when they're both dressed identically?

I did. Your application of fanboy logic just doesn't impress me much. Even if you do the math.

Sure you can find women who are as big as men (although I'm pretty sure you can find men who are bigger than any woman but that's beside the point really). You can even write in the background fiction of the army that there is a certain "butchness" requirement for female recruits and thus explain away why the same bodies go for both sexes.

But short of that, most women even in the army still aren't as big as men and thus just making a female head for the same body doesn't cut it with me – I want a separate body and no, it doesn't have have huge boobies, just look like a female body inside an armour (or not, as the case may be). You disagree obviously and that's your prerogative as always.

Lion in the Stars is obviously wrong.

Notice how obvious the female trooper in the middle stands out compared to her male colleagues.

Yep. And here's an almost-all-female shot for comparison purposes:

Lots of big girls there. And one small guy in the middle if I'm not much mistaken.

LOL, nice comparison shot. US soldiers are just humongous compared to just about everybody else. As for differences in physique… honestly in US uniforms, there's not much apart from the height.

I actually thought that picture was a female standing between two males… only realised when I opened the Google preview to full size.

Also she's about the same height as the the bloke 3rd from the left. Few figure makers do differing builds within a range, the ones that do spring to mind is Copplestone & EM4, otherwise it tends to be 1 build suits all, is this really a big problem?

No, it's not an issue. Pics speak to it pretty clearly. not much difference at all.

Thanks,

John

I'd go with not much difference at all, given, as Lardie points out, that most ranges don't take into account height and girth differences anyway. They could, certainly, do with two body types, but then if you take out the lady in the lower picture all those dudes aren't the same size anyway.

Basically it's just something we tend to ignore as gamers anyway. Now, are the extra heads wasted space for a third helmet type? IMHO, yes, but then I don't like bare heads in sci-fi anyway and would rather just have 2-3 helmet options to begin with.

I did. Your application of fanboy logic just doesn't impress me much. Even if you do the math.

You know, now I am actually offended.

Have you read my other posts, taking Tony to task over managing customer expectations?

About how I'm not going to buy *any* of his products because I am almost completely out of 28mm?

You, sir, are no longer worth listening to. [edit: And for the record, you are the very first person I have ever stifled on this or any other forum]

I like the poses and the weapons.

I don't like all the "bullet holes" in the armor. Looks like Citadel FineCast models that need to be fixed with liquid green stuff. I'm sure others like it I guess but to me those holes put me off to the point I'm sure I won't be buying them. If they had done the opposite and made them rivets I'd have the same negative response to. Keep it simple, keep it clean.

Thing is all the dents/holes make it look interesting and distinct from the marines which are smooth and clean. I'm sure all the factions will get their own look. I agree about the Mantic troopers, don't do rivets. The holes could be viewed as mounting points for add-on armour or pouches, but you'll never please everyone ;)
As for head choice the more the merrier.

5'8", 140lb male wearing 35lbs of armor, and
a 5'8", 140lb female wearing 35lbs of armor.
-----
though to be fussy, a 5' 8" 140lb woman is well larger than the average, a 5'8" man is probably below average – certainly in riots etc one, can almost always spot the female officers despite all the kit as their whole build is smaller – and the pic of the Aussie soldiers might just be that the girl in the middle is an even smaller than average female.

Caption for Lampyridae's ADF photo Corp.Amanda Wright, Corp.Cindy Veenman & Capt.Karin Cann

Those models are friggen amazing.