"Solo Gaming: How many solo and with what rules?" Topic

I have been reading several posts on several list and threads speak of solo gaming. I just finished reading Philip Sabin's Simulating War which is focused on board games. In the book he says that most board gamers play solo most of the time.

This stopped me. I have some board games specifically designed for solo play, or with solo play rules, but off hand, I can't think of a single miniature set with rules for solo play.

My questions are:

1. Do most of us solo play most of the time?

I know we all do it at least once-in-awhile, if only learning rules, but how many of us do it the majority of our gaming?

2. Are there some miniature rules that have specific solo rules or additions? I can think of some that lend themselves to solo play, but none that have rules or methods covering solo play.

3. What are some of the solo methods we miniature wargamers use?

4. Do you think miniature rules should include solo rules/mechanics the way they include lists, point systems, multi-player rules, etc?

Bill

1. I do as far as Computer Wargames.
2. Not sure?
3. N/A
4. It's an idea.

Try here as well:
TMP link
link

I don't play solo unless testing rules I have written. I hear Two Hour Wargames rules are well suited to solo play, as units can have a kind of a.i., but I have never played them. Even though I don't solo, it seems there are a fair number who do, so it might be a nice addition to a rule set. I just don't do it because it makes me feel sad, like seeing a movie alone. :)

i have just bought a set of rules by Two hour wargames and they indeed set up for not only solo but linked solo campigns as well. I was pleasantly surprised. They have a set aimed at the french and indian wars also which may be adaptable to other musket eras. I've been manfully resisting buying them but this thread has resolved me to buy them and find out.
Max

I use THW rules for solo zombies and imagi-nation play. I think they work better for solo or small groups than for large groups. I have several of their sets, including the WWII NUTS! and enjoy them quite a bit.

For WW2, I find the command system in Blitzkrieg Commander works quite well for solo gaming. The only thing I add to that is randomised reinforcement lists, point of entry, and time of entry.

I am going to try Stargrunt II solo here in the near future…

I have done solo board gaming. The set up is a map and I place counters on it. But I have never done solo miniatures. To go to all that trouble to paint figures and set up terrain just for myself?

With no one to share the experience with and enjoy all the work that has been done. It is a social event to share with friends.

If I had to do it solo then I wouldn't play. I would either store everything until I had opponents or if not, sell off everything and look for another hobby. For those that game solo and enjoy it, then that's great.

But I doubt I would ever attempt it. But it sure would cut down on any arguments over the rules.

Bill, I only game solo so I look for rules that accomodate this. Im painting ACW minis for use with Black Powder right now. I have found these to be perfectly suited for solo play.

1. Sometimes I play with others, but it's a rare occurrence. Usually if I want to play with someone else I have to play *their* games with *their* periods and *their* rules. I prefer playing with my stuff.

2.A fair number of rules have components that are conducive to solo play (all of the THW rules, especially ATZ). The Warmaster-style command systems also do this. Most of the USE ME rules have solo add-ons, but it's nothing to write home about.

3. For your third question I suggest checking out the Solo Wargamer's Yahoo group and Donald Featherstone's Solo Wargaming amongst other things. There are lots of mechanisms to automate or add additional fog of war to the tabletop (cards, decoys, tables, etc…)

4. All systems should include at least general solo guidelines if not alternative mechanisms for solo play. Design your rules and assume that groups will not adopt them but individuals will.

I play General de Brigade solo. I'm working overseas right now, but I have Black Powder with me. It seems that would work fine in a solo setting. Over the years I've used numerous 'horse & musket' rules, starting with The Wargame. All of them worked fine with solo games. From my experience, I had no need to find a rule set focused on solo game rules.

Paulie

1. Do most of us solo play most of the time?

Well, I certainly do.

2. Are there some miniature rules that have specific solo rules or additions? I can think of some that lend themselves to solo play, but none that have rules or methods covering solo play.

There may well be, but I don't have any that do.

3. What are some of the solo methods we miniature wargamers use?

I find there is no need for specific "solo rules". I tried a few but found them all to be contrived and "kludgy". I just play the game as both sides. Works for me and has done for over 30 years.

4. Do you think miniature rules should include solo rules/mechanics the way they include lists, point systems, multi-player rules, etc?

Unnecessary. See my answer to Q3.

1. I play solo most of the time…currently. I hadn't played much against opponents for ages due to a number of reasons so I tool up solo gaming a few years ago. I play in 15-30 minute increments spread out over several weeks. Cannot think of an opponent that would put up with that!. When I have more time, I will hopefully get in a lot more face to face gaming and cut back solo play a lot to likely only trying out rules.

2. THW rules are solo friendly, and have some solo rules within their rulesets. Some rule mechanisms lend themselves to solo play better than others. Dice bidding for instance is a bit harder solo.

3. I personally don't use any specific solo mechanisms. I just play each side to the best of my ability. I have fun seeing how the game plays out and making decisions rather than the outcome. However, there are plenty of solo mechanisms that can be used in gaming out there.

4. I do not think mini rules need to include solo rules mechanisms.

I play solo occasionally but not often.

Computer Strategies computer moderated wargames programs have a Solo module but it is not 'intelligent' and I find using the Battle module works just as well for solo play. I find most modern 'steam' rules either too simplistic, too complicated or unintelligible.

I do not use any solo-specific methods. There are some ideas in Featherstone's 'Solo Wargaming' though.

If somebody came up with a truly 'intelligent' program where you're taking on the computer as if it was a human opponent, that would be something.

I don't have statistics, but I suspect that a considerable percentage of miniature wargames (especially if aged 30+) play solo most of times, or even don't play at all, they just collect miniatures and read rulebooks.

Incidentally, I wrote some simple wargame rules that do include solo mechanism (WW2 aerial, WW2 naval, Colonial) panzer8.weebly.com

I think that almost all wargame rules can be adapted to solo playing, maybe with the exception of those that feature contemporary movement.

Wargame designers should include solo rules mechanisms in their rule books… there are so many people playing solo.

"1. Do most of us solo play most of the time?"

I prefer to play with others, but am tempted to use the newer card based games for self play

"2. Are there some miniature rules that have specific solo rules or additions?"

See above re card based

"3. What are some of the solo methods we miniature wargamers use?"

I think IGo-Ugo is better for solo play. you eed to try and put some structure in – eg orders, backstory context (ie objectives), and forced randomness in the game – carsd work well IMO

"4. Do you think miniature rules should include solo rules/mechanics the way they include lists, point systems, multi-player rules, etc?"

I think you could have a solo-play system that is over any one game system, for eg the 2Fat Lardies one in Sharpe Practice/Mud & Blood could easily be adapted for multiple periods

I solo with By the Left Flank! My homegrown set.

Play solo games more than face to face against a live opponent.

Why – mostly convenience.

Surprised this topic isn't cross-posted to TMP's solo wargaming board…..

1. I game solo mostly these days. Mostly it is a time thing. When I have free time, my friends don't and vice versa.

2. THW as mentioned above are perfect for solo play. I've played Rally Round the King for massed Ancient Combat.

3. The simpler the better. You do have to run both sides after all. So more simple games are better for solo gaming IMHO. I generally just play out both sides and do my best to win with both.

4. Not required. I can solo anything. I often play historical scenarios and those are easy to setup.

Surprised this topic isn't cross-posted to TMP's solo wargaming board…..

Well, I knew if I asked how many solo game on the Solo Wargaming board, all of them would say they do… ;-7

I wanted to get a sense of how many *in general* solo and what the general response would be, that's all. I can read the threads and posts from the Solo board and get a good sense of the answers there to my questions, but I was hoping to cast a wider net of opinions here.

I hadn't realized that Featherstone had a solo gaming book out.

I do think that the internet has allowed folks who solo to share their experiences, beautiful tables, and figures effectively where they couldn't in the past.

Bill H.

I hadn't realized that Featherstone had a solo gaming book out.

Originally published in 1973!!
And republished in 2009.

1. Do most of us solo play most of the time?

I play mostly solo.

2. Are there some miniature rules that have specific solo rules or additions?

There are some rules on the Polemos Yahoo group for playing solo. They work reasonably well. Chain Reaction works fine solo. Ambush Alley 1st Ed. was designed for solo play. Laserburn had a solo module. Advanced Heroquest had solo rules – it is a very long time since I played it but I remember enjoying it more as a solo game. There were was a good simple solitaire WW2 game about commandos in an early issue of WI. The air warfare games I have point out that playing solo bomber-destroying and ground-attack missions work solo with no extra rules anyway. Pony Wars could be played solo with the existing rules (because the Native Americans are controlled by the system).

3. What are some of the solo methods we miniature wargamers use?

Just playing both sides seems to be most popular. What I normally do is think of 3 options for both sides at points which seem to require it, then assign the most likely option 4-6, next most likely 2-3, least likely 1 for what each side will adopt. I roll simultaneously then do my best to carry out that plan, until the next point where it becomes clear that that plan isn't going to work – then I do the process again.

The Polemos rules (based on tempo points) use their normal systems but basically give the 'non-active' side a boost, (but they are really relying on you to play both sides). The same methods should work in any PIP/tempo point/command point type game.

Pony Wars used a comprehensive reaction table.

Other games use automatic reaction rules (i.e. what they do is a function of the games rules IIRC)

Anything which randomizes move order and command & control seems to work okay, like rolling for initiative (Fighting Wings mainly in my case) or using card-activation (TFL rules) in games that I play.

4. Do you think miniature rules should include solo rules/mechanics the way they include lists, point systems, multi-player rules, etc?

I think they should. I also think they are an untapped area for designing new games. Designed solo games – fighting against the system – are really good fun. I think that my favourite gaming experiences have all been with solitaire systems. I've experienced immersion in the game beyond anything I've ever managed in either head-to-head wargames or multi-player games.

Regards

I have a copy of Featherstone's solo wargaming that I'd part with if anyone is interested.
It's the 2009 edition paperback from Lulu press.

PM me or email at
twohourwargames@yahoo.com

I play a lot of solo, testing rules & scenarios. I also do so for fun, just playing both sides.

Just about any game/rules system can be played solitaire. No need for special rules, especially since they usually don't work too well anyway.

Featherstone's Solo gaming book is one of the best he ever wrote, but it's not for everyone. Even AI today can't substitute for a real human opponent. However not all games have to be a battle and not all of them have to have soldiers as a medium.

One of the major parts of Solo gaming in Featherstone is composing the narrative and writing battle reports of battles that took place. After a while you realize that Featherstone completely accepts the "jiggery-pokery" that can come with Solo games where you fafor one side, but that, to Featherstone is OK., as the real intent is to createa narrative or campaign history. Interestingly enough if you've done too much fiddlin it's like "Truth Rising from Her Well," and you know you've done it, and -- you get a crappy narrative.

I prefer to play with an opponent, but I've had to do a lot of gaming solo. It's an excellent exercise for testing new rules, concepts,and principles for a game.

The real problem is as others have pointed out-- the rampant cheating that goes on.

I rarely play solo because of time – I have a lot of non-solo commitments, and when I'm not playing, research design and painting swallow up the time. When I do play solo it is mostly testing, and I play both sides normally. I'm not sure any special mechanisms are necessary.

So … No/No/Play both sides/No

"…the rampant cheating…

thanks – that brought an "isn't it so true" chuckle…

Solo about half my games.

Rules are, "General de Brigade, Deluxe."

Good rules for solo as it is turn based. Therefore when solo, one plays one side then the other. Works okay.

Solo play is better than no play at all!

God bless,
John

Geeze Ditto/Tim – Had I known, you could have gamed with us – as long as you were into micro armour. ;)

I am fortunate enough to have a local club and a long time gaming partner. If needed or If I a figuring out new rules, I will game solo.

Unless your opponent is mindless (zombies for example) the inevitable problem is how to fool yourself?

I've never gamed solo, though I do occasionally push around blank counters to figure out how rules work. I have a small bag of colored tiles and felt cut outs just to try a couple different game situations and see how they work.

1. "Do most of us solo play most of the time"?

I doubt it, for "most of the time", but suspect most do at least some of the time.

2. "Are there some miniature rules that have specific solo rules or additions? I can think of some that lend themselves to solo play, but none that have rules or methods covering solo play".

Yes, there are some rules that are designed specifically to aid solo play, and take that into consideration, but I think they are in the minority.

3. "What are some of the solo methods we miniature wargamers use"?

Chits to represent individual figures, and/or units of troops, vehicles, etc. Also dummies too. I prefer at least a 2:1 ratio of dummies to real troops, at a minimum, to make things interesting. All of these are placed face down, and the solo player has to move his units into sighting range, before he can flip them over, after they have been detected.

That may throw off his attack plan, assuming he is the aggressor. Similarly, the same can be done with the attacking units, if the solo player wants to be the defender.

The solo player must deploy his/her forces on the tabletop, before the game commences, based upon the strategy chosen to accomplishing the scenario.

Charts are also used frequently, and the solo player rolls on them to discover various things, e.g. number of forces and types arrayed against him, whether they plan to attack/defend/avoid battle, etc.

4. "Do you think miniature rules should include solo rules/mechanics the way they include lists, point systems, multi-player rules, etc"?

It would be nice if they did, but I suspect a lot of people are capable of coming up with their own home-brew rules, if they don't.

I never play solo because:

1. The social aspect of playing with my toys is important to me.

2.I like the challenge of playing against a human opponent.

3. Solo wargaming would seem to remove the uncertainty from the game as I would always know what my opponent is planning.

4. My mum told me that playing with yourself is wrong.

I find that Two Hour Wargames products give a good game and produce a reasonable fog of war. It is very nice to have a solo system which also allows for same side gaming with a buddy vs the "system" controlled foe. THW has recently been working on more larger scale black powder games. ACW and Napoleonics are in the works. Colonial and FIW are already available.

@John Tyson. Bumped into you before on here. I solo GDBDe also, as stated earlier in the thread. Where are you from, and do you game 28MM or 15MM?

Paulie/Houston (currently in Iraq)

@pbishop12.

Paulie, I live in Huntsville, Alabama. I game with 15mm Napoleonic miniatures. Most of my 2600 figures are 2nd generation MiniFigs.

Here are a couple of my battle reports posted over on the GdB forum using my figures (see links below). Both of these battles were solo played. One, I wanted to see what an overwhelming, greatly outnumbered attack would be like. I didn't think my wargaming buddy would care to be either the French or Austrian with such lopsided odds. It was interesting to see.

link

link

God bless,
John

Unless your opponent is mindless (zombies for example) the inevitable problem is how to fool yourself?

Easy. I'm very gullible. :o)
Max

Featherstone's book is 'Solo Wargaming, Kaye and Ward Ltd, London, 1973, ISBN 0-7182 0921'

link

link

There is also this one.

link

Gullibility and uncertainty or not, I haved solo gamed in the past mainly when 'proving' a set of rules. I'll take a historical action and game it as the original to see if the results are similar.

Of course one can't replicate luck, good or bad, but it can be useful to see if results are consistently different from the historical, and the process is entertaining in its own right anyway.

On the whole though, I prefer human opponents though there I know of gamers who prefer the solo game.

Featherstone's book is 'Solo Wargaming, Kaye and Ward Ltd, London, 1973, ISBN 0-7182 0921'

Indeed. However both of the links you give are to the 2009 edition.

I think solo is very useful for gaming out scenarios that you would struggle to interest another gamer in. Vastly outnumbered, playing as iraqis in 1991, etc.

Hi

1. Do most of us solo play most of the time?
Not most of the time but quite frequently especially to put armies on manoeuvres (ie learn a rule set).
I do play board wargames solo more often than with miniatures.

2. Are there some miniature rules that have specific solo rules or additions? I can think of some that lend themselves to solo play, but none that have rules or methods covering solo play.
None that I can think of but card driven types such as Piquet/Field of Battle lend themselves to solo play quite readily

3. What are some of the solo methods we miniature wargamers use?
Split personality mostly :-)

4. Do you think miniature rules should include solo rules/mechanics the way they include lists, point systems, multi-player rules, etc?
Nice as an option.

Interesting discussion

Hi

'I just finished reading Philip Sabin's Simulating War'

McLaddie, can you give your thought on this book – I was considering having a look at it myself.

Thanks.

For the computer, "Combat Mission" is pretty good for solo play. I'd recommend it for anyone. Quick build a scenario or pick one of the many scenarios included with the game. I play 2 or 3 games a week.

Interesting discussion.
1. I prefer to play solo. For me it is all escapism and the way I do that is through the story. When other people play they want to win. If I want to socialize I will go to the pub with my friends. That is not to say it is wrong; just not my cup of tea.

That is why I created Platoon Forward. It was the way I generate my stories. It just happens to be a good 2 player scenario generator.
2-4 have been discussed. Agree THWs have mechanisms. I think TFL games and Piquet with the card mechanisms also work well solitaire.

Combat Mission is a great computer game.

Thanks

Joe

I too have found all the posts interesting. Some great insights, ideas and rules suggestions. Thanks.

Flipper:
I appreciated the book. It is focused almost entirely on board games, but a number of things are equally applicable to miniature game design.

Simulating War is in some ways far better than Dunnigan's book "Wargame Handbook" because Sabin faces the technical issues straight on, gives a decent background on the history of different design mechanisms, and then provides not only explicit examples, but then a commentary on actually designing and playtesting the games included in the book. There are several fairly simple games with counters and boards.

Sabin is primarily designing teaching tools, but recognizes what I found designing simulation games as training platforms: if they aren't simple enough and fun, no one will play them, so the designs will fail to teach and train.

Sabin does some mildly strange things though. One of his first chapters is entitled "Accuracy vs Playability" where he basically reframes that as "Complexity vs Simplicity", which I disagree with in some ways… simulation accuracy is not dependent on the design complexity. However, in a later chapter on "Integration and Testing" he then basically notes that the accuracy [now synonymous with quality] of a simulation isn't dependent on the complexity or quantity of details. So, that left me a little confused.

He is also obviously greatly influenced by the Simulations Publications, Inc gang of designers [a number of whom were graduates of his military college]for a good many of his design viewpoints and they are heavily quoted. Of course, any number of them have continued to design wargames to this day and a few went on like Dunnigan to consult with the military.

That influence, like most things, has it's definite benefits and some down-sides. The one I noticed the most was an SPI view of possibilities that amounted to tunnel vision in a few spots.

However, the bulk of the book is clear, insightful and when it comes to actually taking the history he wants to expose his college students to with a game design, it is fascinating. He even taught a simulation design course, finding that having the students design a simulation made them work with the historical information in very different ways from typical history classes.

Having used and designed historical simulations for the classroom [both at the high school and college level, it was a fun read and I learned some things.

So, overall I can recommend it if you enjoy the design aspects of wargaming, particularly if you play board games too.

Best Regards,

Bill

Don't play solo much EXCEPT we recently have taken to playing THW Muskets & Mohawks with all players on one side vs. the game system enemy. It's quite a change from playing against each other.

At first the game system was getting beaten regularly but since we figured it out, the games are about 50/50.

Hi

'I appreciated the book. It is focused almost entirely on board games, but a number of things are equally applicable to miniature game design.'

Thanks – I may pick it up.

We used to play all our Colonial games in the all on one side style, ie two or three of us each with a command v the system. Home made rules for the Zulu or Sudan. We won about 50/50 but were on the wrong end of some very complete massacres as well.
The system was very simple. It allowed for the chance arrival of enemy units at terrain pieces that might hide them, each turn. This chance was dependent on the size (points) of the players army. So bigger our army more chance for the enemy to show. These terrain pieces could be turned off by recon. Suddenly mounted scouts had a wargame job to do. Enemy behavior was very simple. They would advance towards the nearest enemy. Melee fighters would attempt to close and those armed with firearms or cannon would advance till they were in range.
The results were nearly always surprising and unpredictable.
Sometimes what appeared to be an easy victory would suddenly turn into somthing resembling Cannae.
My favourite example played length ways on a 6 ft table. We had attempted to capture this particular Zulu village and failed twice before. The new plan was for the cavalry (Natal mounted police, volunteers and sqdn of Lancers)to race ahead and capture this village while the infantry and the guns would follow and provide support should things go wrong. My final words to Dan the cavalry commander were "Don't worry. I'll support you." The mounted took off leaving the infantry trailing and no sign of the enemy until they reached the village itself. With a 1% chance two impis appeared there in the same turn this forced the cavalry to wheel to create a firing line. The next turn yet another impi appeared in the village behind the first two that were attempting to advance against Dans force that was firing mounted, while yet another appeared behind their right flank. This was becoming too much for the cavalry and they continued their wheel and headed towards the left flank in an attempt to rejoin the rest of the army. Against the odds yet another two impis appeared this turn one luckily enough close enough to the infantry that he headed towards them but the other blocked the flank escape route for the cavalry who then had to turn their march column on it self and attempt to escape straight back. The next turn saw one more Impi appear and it blocked the last way out. Attempts by the Lancers to open up a corridor failed and the rest dismounted and fought a last stand in a sad little group. The infantry got away unscathed.
As you can see this simple system could provide unpredictable games that often seemed like they were planned.
Max

Tony Bath's Solo Wargaming

It randomly generates your opponent by a few dice rolls from pregenerated lists.

The terrain is generated by a few rolls of the dice putting different layouts together based on your rolls.

Rules for subcommanders included and their personalties ranging from cowardly to imeptous.

Pregenerated rsponses to changing tactical situations. (i.e. When your forces reach XYZ the OPFOR will… 1. Withdraw, 2. Commit Reserve, 3. Hold Ground, 4 Attempt flank attack etc…)

On a side not I will solo play test a scenario for game balance before I present it to other gamers.

Solo Gaming: How many solo

One, surely?

Tony Bath's Solo Wargaming

Hi DragonGunner, I've never heard of this book before, but it sounds like a very good system. Can't find it through google either.
Max