"6mm comparison Napoleonic" Topic

I'm considering Adler minis, as they are distributed in the USA, and likely easier for me to get (at the least likely faster), but most of my potential opponents seem to favour Baccus.

How do these two ranges compare size-wise?

Close enough?
The same? (give or take style)
Okay on the same table, but not so good in the same army?
Avoid using the two as the differences are too easy to notice?
Other?

I had been resisting 6mm until I met some guys at a local(ish) gaming store today who roped me into a game of Black Powder using 6mm (Civil War). I think I am sold on the idea and willing to give it a try, but want to make sure my first attempt is worth it.

I'm considering Adler minis, as they are distributed in the USA, and likely easier for me to get (at the least likely faster), but most of my potential opponents seem to favour Baccus.

Actually TMP link it looks like few would be quicker than Baccus.

Adler and Baccus definitely are "close enough". Baccus is only very slightly smaller and I find it completely unnoticeable on the table. My 6mm armies are 95% Adler and 5% Baccus. Baccus I get through Scale Creep Miniatures, but Adler I get directly from the company. Leon is a delight to deal with and the service is speedy!

Adler are really nearer to 8mm. The detail is exquisite, if you want it, or good enough for a quick paint job if you are more of an "impressionis" style advocate! :o)

Heroics and Ros!!!!…True 6mm!!

Heroics and Ros are it for me. A true 6mm.
Adler and Baccus have a problem with body proportions, "Heads are very large".
But that is just my opinion and others.

I have been buying Adler from Leon in UK for shipping to Australia for 10+ years. Never had any issue and they are always here within 2 weeks from order.

I sell Baccus here in the US. I am happy to send you some Baccus samples (randomly selected from across the ranges). Just e-mail me your address.

Mark "Extra Crispy" Severin
ScaleCreep.com
FlagshipGames.com
DeepFriedHappyMice.com

I got some Baccus samples and found them a bit too weedy and prone to bend/break at the ankles with little provocation. Wasn't keen on the lesser detailing. I've decided to go with Adler at 8mm. They just look dang good! We'll see how that goes.

You know, I don't see the 'big head' problem with Adler. OTOH, I do see the big head, porker bodies, thunder-thighs, and ham-hands in 28mm figures but that doesn't seem to bother most people except those gaming in 1/72.

Adler's have enlarged heads. I don't find this to be as true for Baccus. Adler look bigger because of the heads. Baccus are really 8mm figures. I would mix the two ranges on the same table. Frankly, I would even mix Irregular and Ros as well; just not in the same units.

You will find that you will have to mix ranges to get special units, etc. If I were starting from scratch, I would start with Baccus and fill in with other ranges. Their newest figures are quite nice.

Ros are nice but there is more detail with Baccus and Adler.
Even Ros compromises in some areas due to scale.

Having said all this, I am moving to 10mm and 15mm only. 10mm because of some other gaming buddies. 15mm because of Lasalle and Napoleon at War (chiefly the latter). I find 10mm to be the smallest that allows me to get the details I want. I know Angel Barracks will chime in and say 6mm works fine as well but my eyes have crossed the hump now and 6mm has become too small for me.

Go 10mm it's the best Jerry.

I have had both figures for many years, and here are the pros and cons of each.

Adler. Without doubt far more detailed and significantly larger with regards to cavalry. In fact, the cavalry seem almost out of proportion with the infantry. But then again, almost all figures down play the size of the horses, so it is nice to see it the other way around. Adler has a larger and more diverse Napoleonic range, however continue to change their sculpts. So if you plan to collect the range over the next few years, there is a change the sculpts may change. And finally, Adlers demand the kind of detailed painting you are tempted to do if you are as meticulous about painting as I am. The large head debate is valid, however, in the small scale the large heads some how work. Kind of a "cute" look if you will and works will the small, and mass effect with bright colours.

Baccus. Their range extends far beyond napoleonics, and although they continue to improve their moulds, the sculpting design does not tend to change so often. In fact I purchased the new Russian sculpts because of the reviews from others. They are a great improvement upon what they had previously, but do not have the same "crisp" detail as Adler. However, in Baccus's defense, the figures are smaller, and the nature of their simplified sculpts make it easier to paint and base. Even though both companies make infantry in strips of 4, the frontage of Baccus's take up less space. This may be important depending on how you want to base them. In short, it is my opinion Peter Berry of Baccus created a system of miniatures which are good sculpts, easier to paint, and base as well as game with. It depends on what you want. If you are after really nice detail and lots of variation, Adler is the way to go. However, if you want miniatures painted more quickly, based and ready to game more quickly, Baccus might be a better choice. Stone Mountain Miniatures, the only U.S. distributor for Adlers, is phasing out that line becuase they cannot keep up with the new sculps Adler keeps releasing. If you order with S.M.M., expect to wait about 2 weeks for your figures which are at least several years behind the newer sculpts from Adler. However, I have ordered from S.M.M. many times, and they have NEVER messed up an order. Now I just order directly from Adler, and they are here in the East Coast in about 5-7 days.

ilodic

Hello there michaelsbagley,
Oh dear you have been tempted by the Devil into Napoleonics prepare to loose large chunks of your life! lol
Our ranges are not now available in the States only direct from us.
I wont get into the 'true 6mm' debate ( 300th is 6.4 to eye level) its all a question of what your trying to acheive. If whacking an army on the table in the quickest time is the most important thing to you then go for the range you can paint fastest, if the look of things is more important then go for the range that you think looks best.
More detail ( however thats defined) doesnt nessecarily mean slower painting just different techniques.
Supplier being in US is no certainty of being faster or cheaper to get.
L

What GROSSMAN said.

I really wanted to do Napoleonics again in 6mm but none of figures from Heroics though Adler really cut the mustard for a variety of reasons.

I have never worried about what my prospective opponents favour. I don't suppose they are concerned much about my preferences.

michaelsbagley

You will hear all sorts of comments from those who wargame in 6mm scale. I liked and started with Heroic and Ros, but eventually sold them and then had a good look at the ranges of other 6mm miniatures available. I obtained some samples, painted and based them up and Adler won out quite easily.

I think the so called Adler head problem which some people spout is only a problem for those who do not collect Adler miniatures. The other miniatures failed to get my vote due to a number of reasons, including poor quality and detail. All the manufactuers of the miniatures offered a good service, although again, Adler came out top in that aspect.

My advice, which I think would go for any scale, is to take your time, get some samples from all the 6mm ranges, paint and base them up. You will soon find the right ones for you.

link

Adler Naps at their best – can't take pride in painting them I had them done proffessionally but they are totally gorgeous

link

Baccus Romans at their best

I myself pefer Alder for Naps

Baccus and Adler work fine in the same army, I wouldn't put them in the same unit but that is about the limit. I prefer Baccus generally but I have plenty of Adler too, and they are both very nice.

Regards

"More detail ( however thats defined) doesnt nessecarily mean slower painting just different techniques."

I can attest to that Leon! In fact, i would add that in my case, greater detail allows me to go faster with a certain technique.

link

Ditto Gazzola- and for myself I would add that if you have a superbly painted Adler & Bacchus side by side, my eye will favor Adler from 3-4 feet away to 1 inch away. Roughly painted side by side, it doesn't really matter much at any distance.
Best,

Okay, after much thought… I went with Baccus. Thanks for all the suggestions and feedback.

A hopefully easy follow up question… And please temper responses with the thought that Napoleonics will be a tertiary thing for me (as I am way too vested in other time frames to care too much).

I will be gaming with guys who do occasionally do historic battles, but from my brief meeting with them seem to enjoy more "generic" scenario battles, so I am going to need some reference book(s) on how to paint these things. Are there enough web references that I shouldn't worry, or is there a book or two or a few that I can get to cover most of what I will need?

I don't mind spending some money on decent references (I am a long time re-enactor), but I don't want to get too crazy, as this is not a period I don't want to seriously invest in. Thanks again for all the help and suggestions.

Unless you are a compulsive rive3t counter, I would say that you could get all ytour painting needs off the web.

The French are particularly well documented.

Interesting read. I thought long and hard about the choice between Baccus and Adler. I'd seen both and painted a few of both. Both are excellent in their own styles, but I decided to go with Baccus as being true 6mm figures with good overall proportion. Detail might not be quite as sharp as Adler, but I'm pleased at what can be achieved with a careful paint job.

Here are some of my Napoleonic Baccus bases for comparison with Adler shots linked above. Both make great figures.