"Ship model suggestions" Topic

Hi,

I'm looking for some advice/recommendations from people that know more about this period than I do, but I'm aware that to ask this might be to invite ridicule!

I'm a roleplayer, rather than a wargamer and I'm gearing up for some Hollywood-style piratical roleplaying. I'm looking for a few ship miniatures to use for ship combat; they don't have to be a specific ships, but things like a single-masted sloop, a frigate, maybe a two-masted merchantman; a small selection.

In the past I have used 1/1200 GHQ ships and while they're attractive enough, even with careful handling they seem a little fragile. Additionally, as our combats are only likely to include two or three vessels at a time, I'd be quite happy to move up to larger scale ships. Ideally, I'd love something where a frigate was maybe 2"-3" in length and other ships commensurately smaller. As a child I remember small 'series 1' Airfix kits of sailing ships but they don't seem to be around any more. Also, they probably weren't constant scale. Does anyone know of anything I could consider using. I don't mind metal, resin, plastic; pretty much anything if it fits the bill. While I wouldn't say money is not object, as I'm not fitting out an entire fleet of them an extra couple of quid (or a few dollars) here and there is of no consequence.

If it makes any difference, I'm in the UK (but will happily order from anywhere if they have the right products and postage isn't ludicrous).

Thanks for your time,
Mike

For your purposes I think the 1/900 Portsmouth Miniatures stuff might work out best. portsmouthminiatures.com

Depending what era you're keen on (as you cross-posted to Napoleonic they may be too early for you) Peter Pig's 1/450 stuff might be just the ticket:

peterpig.co.uk/range18.htm

Both of those seem like great suggestions (although I wish the Peter Pig one had better photos!). Thanks very much for useful ideas (and so quickly). I'm intrigued now as to what else might get suggested!

Thanks again,
Mike

You could also take a look at Thoroughbred's line of 15mm sailing ships. They are meant for War of 1812, but would work in a pinch and you could actually put crews on them!

link

Cheers, but I think 15mm is getting a bit big for my purposes. And I already have half a dozen 25/28mm ships! Thanks for the suggestion, anyway.

If you want to go on the cheap, have you lookede at the old (Wiz Kids?)pirate ships? You can generally pick them up on ebay for a buck or two apiece.

Personally, I've got an itch to build these: warartisan.com/ships

79thPA is on it.
The Pirates of the Spanish Main will fit the bill and be cheap to boot.

Actually, I have a load of the old Wizkids ships as I was a Pirates tournament ref! I was looking for soemthing a bit more 'showy' (and durable) though!

I like the Peter Pig ships for smaller scale vessels.

For 15mm minis, there are several manufacturers, e.g. Thoroughbred, Sailpower, and Old Glory.

The Ainsty vessels are superb for 25mm/28mm ships.

Sloops were used most of the time by the pirates, but they also used a lot of two-masted brigs as well. Occasionally, they were lucky enough to capture a larger, three masted vessel for their use, which made them quite formidable.

There were occasional naval battles between the pirates and merchants, but most of the latter surrendered rather quickly instead.

There's also the occasional battle between a government warship and pirates – in those, the pirates usually ended up on the short end of the stick, but not always (especially in the later 1600's against the Spanish).

I'm not looking for anything other than smaller ships at this time. My prefered scale for man to man is 28mm ish and I have pretty much the entire Black Scorpion (human) range. For ships to use with them I have a mix of Ainsty and Old Glory (5 with more on the way, I hope). Right now I just need to settle on miniatures for the ship to ship action.

You could check out Warrior Miniatures "1/1200th" range:

link

They're probably closer to 1/900: For example, their French corvette has a ~5cm long hull. They're sturdy, with a decent if not outstanding level of detail. Reasonable money they're asking too. There are a few pics on their website and also here:

link

link

There are precious few pics of Peter Pig ships on the net, but there are a few nice ones here:

link

Have to say I love that range – the separate guns with crew give a nice "feel" to pirate gaming.

The Warrior ones do look rather nice and rather sturdy too. All that said, I confess the Peter Pig ones do appeal, although I wish there was a little more variety in the range. It's possible I might get up for the York show on Sunday, so if I do I'll have to give Peter Pig a shout in advance and see if they'll be taking them with them.

Thanks (to everyone) for the help.

I concur, a few more vessel options for the Peter Pig vessels would be nice.

Not sure if you have any of the Pirateology vessels still in circulation where you live, but they work reasonably well with the PP ships. You can sometimes find them on eBay, and once they are cut down to the waterline with a razor saw, they look pretty good.

Doesn't Old Glory have a 1/300 scale resin line? Perhaps that might do the job? Would be bigger and more "showy" to fit that part of Gangrel's objective. And some 6mm figures could be put on the ship to make it look more alive in action.

Then again, a friend of mine scratbuilt a 1/300 scale French ship of the line in almost no time at all. A bit of balsa wood, a hobby knife, some wooden bits, some paper for sails, a bit of glue, some paint, and voila'!!! Should be even easier to do sloops and other small ships.

Yes, they do.

Both War of 1812, and Armada vessels, if I recall correctly.

I to use Peter Pigs ships I wish they made more of them but with the gun packs you can arm them as merchants or men of war and make each one a little different.

for 15mm I made my own ships with foam board, balsa wood, card stock, and some wooden dowels.

Thanks Mako and Warren. At $35 USD-45 per ship, the Old Glory ones are a little rich for what I want to use them for (I think if I was buying 6 or 8 of them I'd just buy their 25mm 'Pirate Hunter' instead!). I did a quick eBay search for Pirateology and did find 'book with model ship' listed, but I have no idea what this is or whether it's what you meant or if it's useable.

Thanks again for your input.

I will be posting a few pics of my new ships on my blog next week. You might want to check it out at about $10 USD a ship. You might be interested as they could work for you.
sky

Cool, thanks. What are they? Alternatively if you want to drop an email with any details to gangrel AT goth DOT net then that would be great.

They also made some small 2" – 3" long, rubberized plastic vessels too, sold separately from the book, but they are getting harder to find now.

I've found them online thanks. With prices as high as $20 USD, unseen, I'm not ready to take a risk on them, but thaks all the same.

Ouch, that is a bit high.

When I got them, they were much more reasonable.

One of the local retailers was discounting some for a couple bucks each, but selection was rather poor, since I found out about it late, and most were already gone.

They are worth a look, if you can find them for $5.00 USD, or so.

Looking forward to more info and pics, on Skyking20's new ships.

Me too. In the meantime I've put a toe in the metaphorical water and just ordered a couple of the Peter Pig ones. I'll let you know how they turn out.

Grumble… They are coming. Normally when I do smaller scale ships I just do standing rigging. I have got the standing rigging done. I thought I would try a couple of pieces of running rigging. And as is usually the last few touches take the longest. I am not sure if I like the overall look of the extra rigging. I will be interested to hear your comments. So the last step id the anchor which I should get to tonight.

I learned a lot from this experience so the next ship should go smoother and faster. I am planning a fleet of 8-10 ships.

sky

Looking forward to the pics, and/or just a listing of the types of vessels, and the scale you'll be doing them in.

Whilst faffing about on the net I found these rather nicely painted Peter Pig models:

link

I particularly like the first one, which I think is the large merchant vessel. Kinda wish I hadn't seen this as it's made my credit card itch.

Ah the universal itch! Nice models & paint jobs but a few pieces of rigging would make them even nicer.
sky

Thanks for sharing that link.

I was wondering what the PP Large Ship looked like, since there's no photo of it on their website.

Here's an image of the Pirateology ships:

I cut some down to waterline level with a razorsaw. They look a lot better that way.

As always, thanks to everyone fo your contributions; much appreciated. I have to say that after seeing those Peter Pig ships, I'm really looking forward to my order turning up! They look great. And while I'm sure they would look better rigged, not al of us are up to doing that! The Pirateology ships look fun, but are hard (and expensive!) for me to get hold of.

One of the best options that I've seen for little ships is the plastic ones in the boardgame Merchants & Marauders from Z-Man Games, many photos on the BoardGameGeek page:

link

Lots of people are painting these up, as you can see from the huge gallery of images on BoardGameGeek. The game comes with 4 fluytes (merchant ships), 5 sloops, several frigates, and several galleons. These would be more than enough for pirate fleet actions. I don't know if anybody has asked Z-Man Games to sell them just the plastic ships. But the game itself is worth buying, as it is very fun to play, and has a fabulous map to use for pirate campaigns.

I've seen some of those vessels painted up, from M&M, and they do look quite nice.

Anyone know how long they are, e.g. the sloops, and fluyts, especially?

There are lots of sets of these on ebay so it is easy to build a fleet. I would also like to know the size and rough scale.

Also I have my first ship conversion done. I think it is too large for what we started talking about but I should get the pictures posted by midweek. Maybe someone can be inspired!

sky

More of the Peter Pig models here.
There are nice.
peterpig.co.uk/range18.htm

I have a few around 30 of the Pirateology ships. To bad there not made anymore.

The one that is hard to find is the 1/600th of HMS Victory by Airfix. I picked up about 100 of them for about $1.50 USD each a few years ago and cut them down to waterline and converted them from 1 to 4 deckers and shortened and lengthen them.

Pictures of the HMS Victory by Airfix and the Pirateology ships can be found on the link site.

Picture doing Trafalgar in 1/600th scale.

Here is a comparison of the Pirateology Ships with the Airfix HMS Victory.

And here is a comparison of the Pirateology, Barbary Pirate's jumping HMS Victory.

Battle off of Tripoli.

Battle of Trafalgar: 1/600 game of the Battle of Trafalgar played on the 200th anniversary. (This was gamed in my two car wide driveway)

Building a 1/600 scale fleet.

I originally got the idea from "Virtual Scratch Builder site virtualscratchbuilder.com Using the Airfix HMS Victory in 1/600 scale you can make just about any ship from a 28 – 130.

After getting your ship, first assemble parts 1, 2 and 3. This is the two sections of the hull and the deck. Use a few rubber bands to give some pressure so it set up tight. Using standard plastic model glue, let it set for a few hours to become hard.

Then take a fine tip marker and mark were you will make your cuts. Once marked make all of your cuts. You may use a hobby knife, or as like me I use a "DREMEL Motor-Tool."

Bringing the ship down to water line is the easy part. Simply cut below the gun ports that are closest to the water line leaving about 1/16th of an inch space. This is done if you are building a 1 2 or 3 Decker.

In the area of the stern of the ship you will make a cutout of the hull were the rudder would be. I take piece #16 the (nameplate) for the stand and cut it and place it in that location so you have the area below the stern windows filled. You do not have to do this on a 3 Decker as it cuts perfectly as per the original kit.

To make a ship shorter or longer then the original kit you must remove or add a section from the hull. These changes are best made before the ship is cut to water line.

To make a ship shorter remove the section between the Cargo Hold and the Middle Mast. Then glue the two sections back together.

To make a ship longer insert a section from a ship that was made shorter by putting it behind the Middle Mast. Then glue the three sections back together.

Below is a list of different numbered gunned ships and what you need to make them.

1. 28 – 38 gun Frigate, 1 deck and remove a section.

2. 44 – 50 gun Frigate, 1 deck.

3. 64 – gun ship of the line, 2 decks and remove a section.

4. 74 – gun ship of the line, 2 decks.

5. 80 – gun ship of the line, 2 decks, add a section.

6. 98 – 100 gun ship of the line, 3 decks.
7. 110-120 gun ship of the line, 3 decks, add a section.

8. 130 gun ship of the line, 3 decks, add a section, add a 4th deck from a
previous ships 3rd deck being removed.

9. Merchantman, 1 deck, and remove a section, sand down gun port if you like.

Once the ship is reassembled give it a good primer coat then finish assembling, painting, rigging, flags and mounting your ship on base.

For Frigates and Merchantman you may wish to reduce the height of the masts and reduce the number of sails per mast by removing the bottom section of sail.

The Pirateology ships are made with a rubbery type of plastic and the masts and sails are cast as one piece with the hull.

It just takes longer to bring them down to waterline as the hull is almost solid plastic.

As per painting and rigging your ships there are many good references out there.

On the "Yahoo groups" "WoodenWalls" in the files section there is a very good article NAVAL.xls Napoleonic Ships Painting Guide by Roy Trochim

That is impressive!!!! I have always wanted to do this but where can you still find those ships, especially at that price? I would want at least 30-40 ships. Got any leftovers? To Sell?
sky

Sorry no leftovers.

There was a Hobby Co on the Internet about 8 to 10 years ago that had bought all of Airfix's HMS Victory in 1/600 scale of Airfix Europe's production. There were around 3,000 listed in stock.

I got around 100 of them.

I wish I had around 25 more to finish up the project.

I would still like to get about 20 of the Pirateology, Barbary Pirate's and build a Russian and Swedish Army Fleets. I think they were about $3 USD or $4 USD appease when they were in Target stores about three years ago.

You can find most of the ships on Ebay.

Looks like the Airfix Victory is making a return

link

(I've also seen it listed elsewhere as a non-gift set item).

In other news I have my Peter Pig order (very quick, guys). Once I've had chance to open it I'll give my thoughts.

I saw they were coming out once more a year or two ago.
I would love to get my paws on about 25 or more of those, but not at $12.69 USD each. I guess I got spoiled at $1.50 USD each. I don't need the paints or the brush. Maybe I could just get a gross shipment of the kit? I did not think so.

I have a friend with one each of the Peter Pig ships, I have put them next to my ships and they work ok. Not perfect, but will do in a pinch.

Now that i have thought about it for a while didn't Airfix have other ships in this line?
sky

They had other ships in there 1/600 scale line but they were WW-II.

Example:
link

ebay
auction

Lindberg made a H.M.S VICTORY in 1/500
auction

Good huntting!

As I said, the Victory is also to be released as a non-gift set.

I've opened up the Peter Pig ships. They're rather nice and JUST what I was looking for. I'll certainly be getting more of them. A special thanks to Dom for pointing me in their direction. :-)

Nice one :-)

I appreciate the help. I'd probably never have found them otherwise!

ACR,
Thanks for the ebay link but $19 USD for 1 ship and $15 USD postage? Times how many ships? I'll pass and wait for the new release.
sky

Well I finally got some pictures of that conversion up on my blog. Please check it out at:

ryderscalm0508.blogspot.com

I am going to start another post with info for those not in this conversation.
sky