"Fog of War in Force on Force" Topic

What do you think of the Fog of War system in Force on Force?

* it's great
* it's pretty good
* it's OK
* I don't like it
* it's awful
* not familiar with Force on Force

I don't like it / it's OK. Some of the cards are OK, but I think some are just ridiculously overpowered.

it's great!

I enjoy the unpredictability it provides. Ensures that no two playings of the same scenario will play out the same way.

Full discosure: I'm the lead author on an upcoming FoF supplement so I'm a bit biased. ;-)

I like them for the most part as they add a little more unpredictability to the game. That being said, they do have to be used with care. Some of the cards in the basic deck are not appropriate to all conflicts covered by FoF. (the more recent releases have had a custom genre specific card deck included, so that solves much of that problem) Also a handful of the cards are real game changers that will derail some scenarios. I tend to pull those. In fact I always encourage folks to custom make the Fog of War Deck for the specific scenario they are playing. Just because the basic deck includes a card does not mean you have to use it.

In all honesty, the biggest problem I have with the Fog of War system is that half the time I forget to use it! I ran three demo games at a convention recently and in one of the sessions the deck sat on the table unused, simply because I forgot about it! Oops!

Martin

it's great

I love it for all the reasons mentioned….Mikey

One of the most positive features of a great game!

It's pretty good…

I love it. Really adds character.

It's ok but sometimes unbalanced. Balance some of thr results so they add color without being overwhelming and they'd be pretty good.

Remember, as Martin said, you can pull cards out of the deck that you don't think are appropriate to the scenario at hand or that you just don't like!

The ability to tailor the deck to meet your needs is one of the advantages of the cards.

Best,

Shawn.

* it's pretty good

I like them but you would be wise to either a) tailor the cards used to the scenario or b) have a neutral GM toss out inappropriate cards on the fly.

Like it a lot.

I can't figure out the rules, so I have no idea if even more chaos is good or not.

The fog of war adds some randomness to the games. Sometimes, this can be a good thing. But sometimes it can be bad, and spoil a game.

It can also be completely un-realistic. You have to with some mission, remove some of the FOG cards, to remove unrealistic or unsuitable cards.

Some cards like the gas, gas, gas cards can really change instantly the nature of a game. If you like the random risk of change, then you probably won't mind them. If you don't like un-historical or less likley factors to hit, then you might not like them.

Ditto! Fun, but they can really mix things up. My last game opened with a card that blew up my only tank! Instantly changed the game, but then again, that's the way it works in real life so keep the card going!

Love the cards. When is the World War Two supplement coming out? I enjoy the Vietnam supplement. But still waiting on WW2.

Love them!

I've made suggestions of a few FoW/Quirk of Fate cards for Ambush Z on the Ambush Alley boards--the trick is to make them up in pairs, each having about the opposite effect or negation of a card's effect, thereby lending not only a random quality without losing balance.

I first encountered the cards at an Ambush Z game at Fall-In a few years ago, and they really sparked my imagination. I think they are a great option to have in the game.

I can't figure out the rules, so I have no idea if even more chaos is good or not.

Mate I know how you feel, they can be hard to 'access' on your own – but I highly recommend trying to get someone more experienced with them to help you out – they are cracking rules once you've played a couple of games – exciting and seem realistic.

A good video tutorial on the rules would be helpful, going through the action/reaction process in detail.

We played our first game a couple weeks back and messed up everything – we read through the rules again to prepare for our next game and now it makes much more sense.

"The fog of war adds some randomness to the games."

I think that's why the cards need to be customized to the scenario as Shawn suggests or perhaps made more generic. The unexpected and the random are not the same thing. The unexpected can be explained but utterly random can feel dissatisfying in a game.

It's a spectrum of results that must be carefully managed. If completely random events become decisive in a game's result the player feels useless. Why bother playing if a card draw drives the result? OTOH, an event that feels like it's both appropriate for the situation, even if unexpected, and which can be exploited or mitigated through player decision making, adds color to the game.

Monopoly is like that. The cards don't automatically determine winner/loser and, since the "scenario" is tightly controlled, the results feel reasonable.

I really like the Fog of War cards. They exist to represent the fact that your forces aren't alone on the battlefield, there's other things happening all around you!

Remember, they're only drawn when a unit rolls a '1' on a Reaction Test. They generally don't happen very often.

We seem to generate enough Fog of our own without having it supplied to us.

>>Remember, they're only drawn when a unit rolls a '1' on a Reaction Test. They generally don't happen very often.

Heh.
Well, there certainly are exceptions to that rule. A couple of weeks ago I ran several scenarios from the upcoming "African Bush Wars" book at a local convention. One of these was a night engagement that took place in 1978 during a Rhodesian cross-border raid into Mozambique. The nature of night fighting in FoF and a scenario specific rule requiring a successful TW test to move a vehicle in the dark caused alot more troop quality tests than occur in a normal game. The result was that in a 10 turn game we went through about a quarter of the Fog of War deck.

Despite the amazing number of cards drawn, most seemed to fit the scenario and my players had a ball as a result. A unit ran low on ammo, another had a man go missing in the dark, yet another stepped on a landmine, etc. But once again before the game I went through the deck and took out all the big game changers and packed it with cards that were appriate to the scenario.

Martin

We seem to generate enough Fog of our own without having it supplied to us.

If you're drinking that much during the game, how do you tell who won? Last man standing? [evil grin]

But once again before the game I went through the deck and took out all the big game changers and packed it with cards that were appriate to the scenario.

And that's the secret to the Fog of War system. Notice that every era pretty much needs it's own set of cards, or at least a dozen era-specific cards added to the standard mix.