"A truly unique (and revolutionary?) wargames product" Topic

Well, I am happy to see it advertised even without supporting membership. Bill is a big boy so I am sure he will stop this thread if he does not like it.

As to painted figures – yep, the painting etc of figures to actually play is a key issue these days. I know us old pharts will say that all that prep is the joy of the hobby, but the world has moved on. If kids/newbies can pick up and play, then a great idea. As they progress, if they enjoy the hobby then they can pick up metals in 10mm and expand their forces.

Is it a rule on TMP that we have to rain on all possible parades?

Pre painted also useful for us old timers who have busy lives and jobs where painting time is almost non existant.

The availability of these in UK [depending on price] may enable me to actually start ACW

Hey, Sane Max? The producer didn't post the announcement, Lord Ashram did. As far as I can tell, Lord A doesn't have a commercial stake in the venture.

I wish the man luck with his sales, and really hope he has sufficient capitalization (in the business sense). I would hate to see this business model go under.

Has anyone moaned because they are the "wrong" scale yet? Is the button count wrong? Surely there is something left for me to complain about.

Yes, Lion, it's handy having a friend post it for him. Maybe I should start metioning all my friend's great deals on ebay every time I post?

I just thunk it's rude.

Pat

I'm with Pat; it's an ad, ads should't be posted on the discussion boards without supporting membership. And why ancients?

Simon

I really like that the product is avaiable at release and the next cival war units to be releseasd already announced as well as the next two periods = AWI and WW1 they would like to concentrate on!!
People who may never have picked up the wargame or start another period should be attracted to this product it would seem? Possibly good for everyone -- "A rising tide lifts all boats".
looks great !!
Regards
Russ Dunaway

I'm with Pat

>Giggle giggle, scuffs toe on floor<

Pat

So no products may be discussed on these boards by anyone without a supporting membership less it be construed as adverstising.

Arrah, c,mon, you seriously think the OP is 'discussion?'

Anyhow, not my website, not my business.

Pat

Well, I think it's just a case of an enthusiastic hobbyist ( link ) sharing news about his friend's product.

These are a bit pricey, but pretty nice looking overall. I already have lots of 28mm ACW, but a new scale never hurt anybody, did it (except in the wallet)?

He has lowered the prices on the armies a few dollars today.

I think a flag sheet should come in the box – they aren't really ready-to-play.

I wonder how many he had to contract for to have them manufactured? I have thought of something similar to this (no kidding) but am sure I don't have the capital to pursue it.

Love that a non paying member is whining about someone being a non paying member. You know you have arrived when the keyboard warriors come out of their holes!

I, for one, am glad for the information, as I probably would not have heard about it otherwise.

Overpriced crap.

Hey all!

Okay, a few things…

First off… no, I have no connection to the product or anything. Never met the guy who started the company… never talked to him… we just exchanged email, and he said he liked my blog and would love for me to take some photos. So I did, for free, because I am happy to help anyone who is into our hobby and who is trying to do something for it.

And yeah, he is trying to do something for it. The kid behind it is in his early 20s and has been not only working on it for years, but as far as I know has sunk all of his savings into it. Now, he doesn't have anyone else investing so he is sucking up all the costs right up front, which is not only brutal but ballsy. However he loves toy soldiers, just like all of us, and wanted to do something really cool to help get more people into our hobby.

To be frank, I am a bit taken aback by the tone of a FEW of the posters here. Listen, I understand the interwebz is faceless, and I understand there is a certain class of people on the interwebz (and, from what I can tell, on TMP) who revel in being nasty schmucks who cannot bother to be polite or nice or respectful or *gasp* even helpful to a young guy who is trying to do something cool in our hobby. But if you ask me there is absolutely no place for it, and I, like I am sure many others, think a lot less of those faceless cool guys after reading their posts.

Oh, and no, I didn't think of it as advertising, although I totally get your point. I've posted about my blog when I've discussed Scott M's books, a CD from the Camp Chase guys, Sam Mustafa's rules, and a bunch of other products. I post about them because I think they are cool. I'm sorry if a few people feel like I am trying to get around paying for a membership; I most certainly am not. And the guy who is starting the whole thing has about 30 posts on TMP total and I know he certainly isn't trying to get around a membership; he wasn't even planning to post here, but I asked if I could post about it on my blog.

Anyway… really a bit disgusted at some of the attitudes of a few posters. If you have some constructive criticisms for a young kid who is trying something in our hobby, then go for it! I know I've emailed him ideas before and he is ALL EARS; he loves "talking" about toy soldiers and is completely open to any and all ideas to make a cooler and more useful product. So go ahead; but there is no call for being a dick about it.

Anyway… certainly don't want to drag this off topic and into a thread about manners (although maybe I am by accident!)

You know one thing I'd love to see? A pack in the $100 USD-1 range with a small battleforce from EACH side. The starter set has something like eight units of infantry and cav and the rest… would love something slightly smaller, but still with a little of everything… that way you could buy multiple sets to get to whatever size you want.

Oh… and some 10mm plastic snakerail would be lovely;)

Oh, and the reason I crossposted to Ancients was the owner had discussed wanting to maybe expand to the Crusades or something similar if he can!:)

Hmmm, for a minute there I was worried….

laugh!

Can't quite match the cost effectiveness of the Paper Terrain products:)

Derek, the FOW guys aren't giving you enough negative attention?

This isn't really the place, but the kid needs to find some venture capitalists to help fund this. Seriously. Funding things purely out of pocket is setting him up for a lot of personal liability down the road.

I do not want to see this particular idea/business model fail simply because one person ran out of money before it could take off.

Frankly, this product is almost enough to get me to start ACW.

Pre-painted? Heresy!

Really guys? The haters need to get a life. You do not like the product do no buy it. It is that simple.

VR
James Mattes

Personally I'm not interested in the product, but then I'm not interested in ACW, or 10mm. Which would have been great places to post this.

Ancients board is my front room. What peeves me most is that it that the original poster, cross posted it on the Ancients boards on the basis of a rumour that, at some unspecified point in the future, there might be a medieval-related product (that should, if ever developed, be on the medieval board!).

On this basis we can comfortably crosspost anything, anywhere on TMP. Everyone can look forward to my proposed future series of postings on the subject of Roman subligaria, or underpants for those on the ACW boards, who will be reading this due to Lord Ashram's original cross posting. I'll no doubt cross post them to 19th Century Naval and Science Fiction gaming…

Simon

I'm with Simon here … I was genuinely annoyed when I came across this thread originally … _Because it was posted to 'ancients discusion' and lengthy – so I had to plough through it before eventually deciding it was somewhere between a fanboy gush and an advert and had just a single word (Crusades) even to link it to ancients ..

As for the title? Totally misleading: nothing new about prepainted plastic or 10mm or start up sets.

Phil
soawargamesteam.blogspot.com

These are the first 10mm plastics I've heard of in ACW. I'd like to see them for sale unpainted, but also curious how they will fit in with other 10mm figure lines.
I don't know why some of you feel the need to be mean and why you get angry about the way this was posted! Economy sucks, doesn't it, but let's have some fun with our soldiers!

It would only make matters WORSE that I didn't know there was a difference between Medieval and Ancients, right?

:)

Didn't mean to clutter anyones forums… I honestly thought people would be interested to see a product that might figure into their side of the hobby. Please do feel free to ignore this thread from now on.

I did see these guys in person when I took the photos; I don't think they would fit in with other 10s. They are very much their own thing.

Just an FYI, I was just looking at the Gordon and Hague page again and it looks like he dropped his prices a pretty steep amount since yesterday. The combo packs don't seem to have dropped though… maybe just an oversight?

Oh; I'd love to hear when someone has a chance to knock a game out with his rules. I've never given them a try. They look nice, but nice is as nice plays:)

@ Firezouave …
> I don't know why some of you feel the need to be mean and why you get angry about the way this was posted!

I guess you don't know why TMP has topic divisions either?

I am President and Press Officer of the Society of Ancients so when something sits on the top line of TMP's 'ancients discussion board', with over 70 contributions to the thread, I have to read through it.

In this case I have to plough through it to clarify that there is precisely no ancients content at all – and a fair number of the contributions are either people pointing that out or people like you criticising people for pointing that out.

Ashram should just come clean and apologise for posting this to the wrong part of the forum and maybe ask the Editor if it is possible to have it deleted from here so it sits on ACW etc. boards where it belongs and where I'm sure it is of a great deal of interest.

I've no idea what your last comment is meant to mean.

Phil

Ashram should just come clean and apologise for posting this to the wrong part of the forum …

I think he just did.

Yesthatphil, I do understand what you are talking about as far as the topic divisions, and I agree with you to some extent. I don't like having to weed through stuff that doesn't normally apply to the period I'm interested in, and I can fully appreciate your feelings. I was talking more about the fact that he is a non-supporting member who was informing us of someone else's product. As far as the nasty comments made, maybe they shouldn't be posted here, but instead, send a complaint to the editor and let him deal with it!
My comment about the economy, was only to say that some people seem to get testy when the economy isn't so good. I understand that too, since I just saw layoff and had my hours cut at work. It may or may not apply to any of this. Just wondering why people get nasty?

"but there is no call for being a dick about it."

That would reduce a lot of post counts all across TMP.

cause they are anal, mean little men who have nothing better to do?

"Yes, Lion, it's handy having a friend post it for him. Maybe I should start metioning all my friend's great deals on ebay every time I post?"

Wow! You have friends, Pat?

:o)

Why smeg a guy just because he's taking an initiative? I wish him well. I already have a load of 15mm ACW so these wont be for me, but I wish him well. You dont want it? Then dont buy em. End of.

Who knows Rodney, this time next year they could both be millionaires…….

I was genuinely annoyed when I came across this thread originally … _Because it was posted to 'ancients discusion' and lengthy – so I had to plough through it before eventually deciding it was somewhere between a fanboy gush and an advert and had just a single word (Crusades) even to link it to ancients ..

Really? The prominent pictures of nothing but ACW stuff didn't tip you off? "Genuinely annoyed" at a misguided crosspost to the ancients board?

Ancients board is my front room.

Mine, too. I never look at ACW, I'm glad I saw this.

I am President and Press Officer of the Society of Ancients

And giving SoA some bad press right now with your harping posts.

In this case I have to plough through it to clarify that there is precisely no ancients content at all

Oh, as President and Press Officer of SoA you are somehow gatekeeper/approver of the content of the TMP Ancients boards?

I think he just did.

You have to forgive him, he is too busy ploughing through the content of messages to grasp their meaning.

I'm an elementary school teacher; no chance of me being a millionaire anytime soon, much to my chagrin:)

As for the guy who started Gordon and Hague… well, I for one certainly hope he becomes a millionaire, because if he somehow DID become a millionaire it would mean there are a LOT of kids everywhere (and adults too) who have gotten into wargaming. That's a positive for everyone, no matter what period you play:)

EDIT: Holy cow… some of you have like 50 and 60 stifles? How is that even possible? So that means there are that many people who cannot see your posts? That is nuts. I guess I never really looked at stifle counts before. Crazy!

Someone must have stole their lollypops Lord Ashram. I let everyone know about the sets at the games club today and I'll post it on some other local forums as well.

Maybe he should look seriously at Napoleonics instead of WW1, Crusades sound good too though.

Anyone ever heard of scrolling past posts you have no interest in? I am sure I will get a few more stifles over this. So what? Grow up and learn how to use the computer. Really? Lame to the max.

VR
James Mattes

@ Caesar ..

I was just explaining why I read the original post

> (Phil:) In this case I have to plough through it to clarify that there is precisely no ancients content at all

> (Caesar:) Oh, as President and Press Officer of SoA you are somehow gatekeeper/approver of the content of the TMP Ancients boards?

I think you may have misread that, Caesar: I am not suggesting that I am or have any role whatsoever … the person I was clarifying the content to was myself (of course, like all of us). I'm sorry if my agreeing with Simon, then explaining myself when attacked is harping – that is not the intention.

Let's leave it there. I'm sorry if responding to the comments directed at me was, for others, just adding fuel to the fire.

Phil

Pint on me.

I'm off: goodbye, and thanks for all the fish.

Simon

"Maybe he should look seriously at Napoleonics instead of WW1"

He's maximising his chance of success with ACW. ACW is a reasonable market size, the same figure moulds can be used to field both sides, and simple colour schemes that allow self-coloured plastic for most of the figure with a bit of a dab or two here and there to finish it all off.

WW1 would give many of the same benefits re uniform colouring, with just one or two bits to dab onto a self coloured figure; no AFVs etc to worry about as per later wars.

Naps would definitely be a major paint job unless he did campaign dress……

Why isn't Australia offered as a postage option?
UnZud is listed and across the ditch isn't…

Lord Ashram,

Congrats to you for calling on the carpet the unruly members of the TMP class – long past time it was done without the doer getting Dawghoused by the editor (and congrats to the editor for letting him roll). There is much good about TMP and it is unfortunate that a small and overly vocal (or should I say "loud mouthed louts") minority that so often reduces it to churlish childishness. If they were the true representatives of this community advertisers would run for the hills. I wonder why they don't get dawghoused more often (and don't ply me with freedom of speech – I volunteered to wear my countries military uniform to protect that right) to protect the ad revenue. Darn certain a hard copy magazine publisher wouldn't let them be so vocal.

As to the product, I join Lord Ashram in wishing the kid into the ranks of millionaires – and I ain't no fan of plastics but, like others, see the benefit to us all.

Double good job Teach, thanks for sharing, and keep on working in those trenches.

Well, well, well, that's not bad; over half the posts have nothing to do with the product and instead involve tit-for-tat or sniping. I could almost lose sight of the fact this was about a wargaming product…..

Not my cup of tea ideally, but a great idea and good luck for having the guts to do it. I wish him well and I am almost tempted, almost to get some to have a look.

I don't quite get the reference to genius, or all the Hail Marys that followed, but good luck to someone trying to make money out of something he clearly has enthusiasm for.

Not wanting to fuel aything, but I have to say that I only saw this because it was posted on the Ancients forum, and am disappointed that there's nowt here to interest me. That said, I'd rate this only as an inconvenience, not an assault on my sensibilities.

Leigh

As an old grognard the figures in question don't interest me. Like many here I'm fussy about how they're painted (by me) and I'm not fond of pre-paints full stop.

However.. if these had been available when I was a kid I would've been all over them! Quite simply, we're not the market for these pre-painted figures. As an example, my nephews are massively into 'Clix figures and they are more than happy with the paintjobs on those to play the games because they want to play games without the hassle of painting.

Good luck to the person behind this range.

An excellent idea – I agree with BugStomper – and good luck to the proprietor. I wish such things had existed in my youth!

I like this idea, and I do hope it finds a market with people who are just getting into miniature gaming. Or if it can get on store shelves, I hope it will introduce more people into miniature gaming.

I am not personally going to get any, since I am interested enough in ACW to want to paint the miniatures myself to as high a standard as I am able. And also, since I don't really know many other historical gamers, doing the research and painting the miniatures pretty much is the entire hobby for me. So even though I have a backlog of 10mm ACW stuff sitting around waiting to be painted, if I bought these I'd just have a bunch of 10mm ACW stuff sitting around already painted by someone else, which would defeat the purpose.

But, I could certainly see this being nice for new gamers to get started quickly, or who are more into the playing of the games than the painting aspects of the hobby. Or even for a side project. There are definitely periods that I am somewhat interested in, but could never have the time to devote to a side project to get a painted army. For something like that, these would be pretty nice. And you could always go and touch up the paint jobs if you ended up having time or it became a more primary gaming period for you.

Personally, I've been looking at branching out my hobby involvement and have been vacillating on which scale/ruleset to tackle next. The box set really works for me.

Someone else mentioned the $100 price point. I think that is a real sweet spot for the most part. There is a reason why GW tries to keep their starter sets under $100 USDusd Frankly, the reason I got into Nappys was because of the bundle that Angel Barracks provided. Still, I'm probably going to jump at the chance to get my feet wet this easily in ACW. Now to convince my friend to split the army with me….

I really like this initiative and the only reason I'm not buying any of his stuff is that I'm already collecting ACW in 6mm and 28mm. Site bookmarked for future reference, though.

The childishness and bad manners displayed in this discussion, frankly, astounds me.

I think this is a great idea.

If you don't like it, pass it by. Get a life, and lay off kicking someone who is trying to make a living in this small hobby of ours.

Incredible.