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"Review of Attack Vector: Tactical (long and rambling)" Topic


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5,014 hits since 17 Jun 2004
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Thomas Pope17 Jun 2004 9:22 a.m. PST

Warning: this is somewhat of a incomplete review since I’ve only played the solitaire tutorial games and read the manual. It's also quite long and rambling, which is just how I tend to write these things...

About a month ago I saw the announcement that Ad Astra Games was going to release an Honor Harrington wargame. Being my favorite source of space opera and a project that I’ve toyed with on and off for years I was quite excited.

After reading through the message board post on the topic (and earlier posts about their flagship game, Attack Vector: Tactical) I decided to plunk down my money sight unseen. I don’t often do things this way, but the stated design concept (make a 3D, true vector space combat game that is both playable and fun) was too close to what I’ve always wanted to see in a wargame.

I ordered via the website and set about waiting (im)patiently for the game to arrive. There was a bit of a delay as they got the pre-orders shipped but it still arrived within two weeks.

The game comes in a sturdy 3” deep black cardboard box with a slip cover. The box is nice enough, and will make a good transport for game parts, but the slip cover is going to get mighty beat up in no time. I’d have preferred if they went the Grendel Miniatures route and just glued color panels onto the box.

Inside the box was the main rulebook, ship book, sourcebook, 2 double sided paper maps, a few bags of stacking tiles and tilt blocks, dice, 6 sheets of punch out game pieces, dice and a bunch of laminated play aids. There’s no much room left inside the box, which does become a bit of a problem now that I have some ships punched out and assembled.

The main rulebook isn’t going to win any design awards with a color laser printed cover and inside printing that looks like a print-on-demand job. The ship book and sourcebook, while staple bound, are of similar quality, with some very nice pictures in the ship book (each ship page is accompanied by a very nice 3d rendered ‘vanity shot’ of the ship in question). I certainly get the impression that this is a ‘function over form’ product, which is just fine with me, as long as they hold up the function end of the bargain.

The maps are one of my only nitpicks with the included components. They are fine maps, double sided with .9” hexes on one side and 1.5” hexes (just big enough to hold 2 ships) on the other, with direction rosettes printed on each (hex sides have a direction from A to F). The only problem is that they’re printed in light blue on one side, white on another. An odd choice, but I’ve got enough black paper hex maps from various other games to not make it one worth fussing over. They do offer a 1.5” hex felt mat, which I might pick up eventually.

The stacking tiles and tilt blocks are smaller than I imagined from the pictures I’ve seen on the web. Without a ruler handy I’d say they were about .9” on a side. The tiles click together nicely, just enough to not scatted on an errant bump. I was a bit confused by the choice of red and green for the stacking blocks until I saw the matching ship control cards (more on this in a bit).

It’s nice to see that they obviously knew where to spend their money with the game pieces. The printing is very high quality, with punch out blocks (of three sizes) and counters, including embossed fold lines. Now, you’ll have to assemble the boxes yourself with tape or glue, but that’s not so bad. There are at least six sheets with ships from the different power factions and assorted utility counters (end of segment and end of turn markers) for enough ships to run a pretty good sized game. Each ship is rendered in 6 views, obviously from the same 3D models they used for the books. The boxes are a little light once assembled, and they recommend putting a BB inside each one to help it balance better inside a tilt block.

The play aids are also very high quality printing and nicely laminated. They include two reference cards (movement on one side, combat on another) and 6-8 ship control cards. The control cards come in red and green varieties. Coupled with the tilt blocks and the fact that the red ones are oriented 180 degrees from the green it means that if you set the map out in one direction, each sit at one end of the table, not only will your cards match the orientation of the map but your blocks will match your cards. Pretty clever.

Speaking just on the physical quality, I think they did a nice job of prioritizing where the money should be spent. All of the stuff you’ll actually play with (and admire on the table) is well made, sturdy and attractive. The book is less attractive, but there’s enough on the cards that it won’t be used much as a reference source (I think) once you know the rules. So far so good…

Warning 2: I read the rules in a few sittings, mostly with a sleeping baby in my lap, so my perceptions might be skewed a bit towards confusion. :-)

The main rulebook is arranged in what I consider the Avalon Hill style. Everything has a number, section 1.34 would be the 4th subsubsection in the 3rd subsection of the 1st section. Easy enough really, though not as “stylish” as seems to be the trend these days. However, for a middle aged curmudgeon like myself it’s kind of refreshing. Also, combined with the headers, it makes it really easy to find cross referenced rules.

The sections on movement are very well written, very clear and contain a good set of examples and sample scenarios to really get the hang of what most will consider the major hurdle of the game.

As mentioned elsewhere, movement is true vector and in 3 dimensions (though you can toss out 3D easily enough if you like). A game turn is divided into 8 segments (Car Wars style) with movement and weapon fire occurring on each segment. The ship control card (SCC) is used to keep track of the ship’s vector in terms of hex sides (and up or down). So a ship might be moving 3A, 2B, 1+ meaning that each turn it will have moved 3 hexes in direction A, 2 in direction B and 1 up. As I mentioned above, if you sit on the ‘green’ side of the table, A is on the top of the card, while if you sit on the ‘red’ side of the table, D is on the top, making it easy to orient yourself.

Since each turn is divided into segments, each ship has a movement chart that tells it how far to move in each direction each segment. A ship can pivot or roll to face any direction (facing is also indicated on the SCC) while continuing to move along the same vector.

Thrusting is a bit more tricky than I had expected, having dealt with pseudo vector systems such as that used in Full Thrust. Instead of magically reaching your new velocity with no change in position, during your acceleration you may move small amounts as you gradually gain velocity (or gradually change your vector, as the case may be). It’s all encapsulated in a tidy little chart, so each segment of thrust you know how much velocity you are accumulating and whether or not you get bumped a hex in the new direction. Accumulated velocity is added to your regular A-F and +/- vectors as appropriate and then you recalculate your movement chart.

Nothing difficult so far, though there is a bit of record keeping involved, as is to be expected. Being used to both Car Wars and Champions I was a bit surprised to find that if you’re moving, say, 4 hexes in direction A you don’t always move on the same 4 segments. It took me a while to figure out that you need to juggle the movements a bit to draw as close as possible to a straight line from your start point to end point. So, once you know your final vector, you need to do a chart lookup to fill out your movement chart correctly.

All told, it took maybe 30 minutes to read through the movement section, and I was fully comfortable with moving, pivoting and applying thrust inside of another 30 minutes playing the sample scenarios. It will take a bit more practice to be able to pick a point and fly to it with accuracy, but that’s the nature of the game.

Overall, I’m really impressed with the movement system. They’ve taken a very complex problem space and distilled it into something that retains the accuracy (as close as possible with discrete time units and hex sizes) while still making it a playable system.

Yes, it is a lot of recordkeeping, and you’re going to be erasing and rewriting on your sheet a lot of times during the combat, but as I’ve said before, that’s the nature of the beast. Nothing here is difficult (though I have to add the caveat that this is my kind of game) but there’s just so much of it that it can seem overwhelming. That said, I don’t think I’d want to run more than 2 ships at a time. Luckily the game is designed with that in mind.

The next big chunk of rules covers combat, which falls into three major types; beam weapons, coilguns and missiles.

Beam weapons are pretty easy overall. There is a pretty simple procedure to find out “where in the sky” the other ship is, whether or not one of your batteries can ‘see’ it and then take the shot. As far as I can tell, they don’t “miss” per se (ranges are short, ships are slow and predictable and light is fast) though the effectiveness of a shot can be low enough that it might as well be a miss.

Coilguns (railguns with semi-guided projectiles) are a really interesting concept but I’m afraid that I’ll just have to play to really figure out how they work. I’m not sure that the rules are really unclear, but without going through the procedure to figure out where the enemy ship will be (it’s a ballistic weapon) and where you want to fire in relation to them is more than I can internalize just from reading the rules (baby was waking up, so I was skimming at this point as well). The entire back side of the reference card is dedicated to developing a firing solution, and like the rest of the game it’s more recordkeeping than difficult math.

Interestingly, once the shells are fired, they don’t appear on the map at all. Instead, the targeted ship is given a card that basically tells it that X projectiles are coming in from Y direction and will arrive in Z segments, unless they maneuver out of the way and/or shoot them down.

Since the coilgun fires so many projectiles, one of the tactics seems to be to fire them in an arc, forcing the enemy to move in a certain direction, thus bringing them closer to your beam weapons. This is certainly an appealing concept, though I haven’t experienced it firsthand to know how well it works in practice. If the enemy figures out what you’re doing, they can decide to maneuver into the shells and hope to shoot as many down ad possible before they arrive.

The final weapon type is the missile, a slow (but still faser than a starship) seeking weapon. I was REALLY skimming at this point and can’t comment past the point that I think it works kind of like a coilgun but rarely misses unless shot down.

Once a weapon hits it does damage, using a system that I can’t really tell if I like or dislike. Again, I haven’t playtested this part, so I can’t comment on how it plays, only on how it reads.

Basically, a weapon does X points of damage, determined usually by a roll and quick chart lookup. The target ship needs to figure out where it gets hit (the same “where in the sky is it” calculation) which determines which components can get hit as well as the armor protecting them. Once a weapon penetrates the armor +d10, then each system it hits “soaks up” another d10 of it’s damage pool until it’s got nothing left. So if 20 damage impacts a section with armor 5, the outer armor takes off 9 points with a roll of 4, leaving 11 to hit the first system (fuel), which takes off 6 points with a roll of 6, leaving 5 to hit the next system. I think I’ve got this right, give or take a die roll.

There are also rules to cover so much damage that it goes through to the core of the ship and even out the other side, but I remember them even less clearly than the above so I should probably stop while I’m ahead.

I really can’t give an objective comment on the combat or damage system until I play a few games. What I can say with some certainty is that the rulebook is not as streamlined in this section as in the movement section. However, even that might simply be that I knew what to expect with the movement system and not what to expect for either of the others.

Anyway, the rulebook covers other topics such as power management, fuel management, ECM, damage control, crew types, radiation and a myriad of other details. Each is as well organized into topics and subtopics as the previous sections, allowing you to skip to bits of interest as necessary (since these parts will be the most referenced in-game, having no quick reference charts).

The shipbook has a couple dozen ships all told, representing a range from gunboats to heave cruisers. Each ship has one page with the aforementioned vanity shot and lots of technical data and a one page sheet for use in the game. Everything here is well organized and nicely put together, but since I was only maneuvering and not shooting I didn’t get to use the ship sheets much.

I only paged through the sourcebook briefly, since I’m not (at the moment) all that interested in the backstory. Rest assured that there IS a backstory, and a pretty well developed one at that. Even if you ignore the rest, there is a nice collection of ‘historical’ scenarios in the back of the book.

Overall I think the designers have accomplished what they set out to do. Once you assemble everything together and wrap your mind around the paradigm what you have is a starship combat game that makes a 1 on 1 battle truly interesting. This is a game of maneuver and counter maneuver, made all the more challenging by the fact that you’re stuck with Newton’s laws in the process. This isn’t a fleet game and doesn’t pretend to be one. I could see playing with 2 ships on a side, even 3 once I got really comfortable with the system but that’s about the limit.

I might change my mind once I play a few games and actually start trading coherent light with my opponents, but I don’t expect that to happen. Honesty compels me to admit that I’m much more interested in seeing this translated to the Honorverse, but that’s more of a background preference than game preference.

I’ve skipped big chunks of the rules here, including the use of the tilt blocks, pivots, rolls, and a myriad of other things, but I’ve probably also lost all but 2 of the readers by this point anyway. I know it’s a rather long ramble, but hopefully it’ll be of use to anyone considering this game.

I’m happy to answer any questions or requests for clarification, and I’m sure the designer will chime in at some point to correct all the mistakes I’ve made.

jizbrand17 Jun 2004 9:35 a.m. PST

Well, you kept this reader right up to the very end. Thanks for taking the time to post such a useful review. The game sounds like something I'd be very interested in.

PeteMurray17 Jun 2004 9:42 a.m. PST

The game sounds less like Full Thrust and more like a capital-ship version of Aerotech, replete with crazy vectorization and record keeping. Your description of the damage system sounds intriguing, what with shots penetrating through multiple systems--I can't think of any extant games that do that. It sounds like they took the punishing mathematics and did most of it for you with the charts, which is decidedly helpful. If it's on the next con program, I'd seriously consider sitting in for a game.

Excellent review. I give it two meta-thumbs up.

elsyrsyn17 Jun 2004 10:27 a.m. PST

Thanks for the excellent review!

Interestingly enough, when I started fiddling with alternative vector movement system (in 2-D) for Starmada, I chose to use a hexagonal vector component system. Of course, it's a pretty obvious solution to the problem.

Doug

headzombie17 Jun 2004 10:28 a.m. PST

I'm still waiting on my final copy but I have read a bunch of the early and recent playtest reports. And have played early versions of the game.
What has always struck me is that reading a report of an AV game is like reading a sci-fi space combat novel.

Instead of: I moved up six hexes, rolled three sixes and blew him away.

You get: I went full thrust and tried to pivot up and to my left as he cut thrust and rolled his undamged side to me hoping to soak up whatever punishment I threw at him on his pristine armor. I sprayed a cone of coilgun rounds covering his front 60 degrees forcing him to turn back to me and momentum carried his damaged port side right into my waiting lasers just as they recharged.

Thomas Pope17 Jun 2004 10:29 a.m. PST

They should be at Origins next weekend, which is where I hope to clarify all of my confusion about the actual blowing stuff up part of the game.

AdAstraGames17 Jun 2004 10:46 a.m. PST

Bocada, if you ordered from me directly, please email me. I've got a couple of orders waiting on felt maps to arrive and one overseas order that's waiting on additional postage.

I want to make sure that I have your order in my queue and can give you a status report.

Being proactive about customer service is the only way small companies like mine stay in business.

AdAstraGames17 Jun 2004 10:53 a.m. PST

The only corrections I have are these:

There are only 4 sheets of box minis, not 6.

There are 8 SCCs,

The shipbook has 15 SSDs.

The maps are printed double sided; there are two of them, one is on white paper, the other one is on blue. They're 1.33" hexes on the large hex side, and 0.96" hexes on the small hex side.

They were done this way because they're true double sided geomorphic hex maps, with hex numbers -- each map has the same numbering scheme. So, blue-1502 is different from white-1502 for setting up (or storing the status of) a game. Since you can arrange the maps in any configuration you'd like (or, if you have a friend with another copy, set up 4 maps for a very large playing surface), this doesn't give you a "fighting in a fishbowl" problem.

One interesting bit that we never anticipated is that the record makes it easy to save a game-state: Put the SCCs in a plastic baggie without wiping them off, write down the hex number, altitude and current turn/segment number and you're done.

The tilt blocks and stacking tiles are 0.94" along the base (24 mm).

The damage allocation system is close to what you describe, but works like this:

A soak roll is 2d10- (where you take 2 ten sided dice, roll them, and subtract the smaller one from the larger), which gives a range of 0 to 9, with a 9 being 1 in 50 odds.

The soak roll is "virtual hull boxes" -- rather than marking off hull boxes on a track that are "free hits", the soak roll represents "how much stuff was in the way before than 8 cm wide beam path destroyed that system?" Even the crew quarters and cargo hits have meaning in the game. (If your crew quarters don't get repaired, your ship drops in grade due to overcrowding. If you lose too much cargo, your crew may starve before getting home...)

We found that the best way to speed of damage allocation is for the attacker to keep a running tally of how many hits remain, while rolling 1d10 for hit locations and the defender rolls 2d10- for soak, taking his die roll and whatever component armor is on the system hit and adding them together. If the attacker and defender roll color coded batches (red, blue, green and so on.) it goes like this:

"OK, red, hit location 1." "Reactor, 3 off."
"OK, blue, hit location 2" "Battery, 2 off, no explosion."
"green, location 7" "Fuel, 5 off."

...

and so on.

Unfortunately, the damage allocation (and scenario setup rules) were still undergoing last minute tweaks (as were some of the rules for missiles...) as we went to press, so there are going to be places where a "huh" response is all too appropriate. The movement rules (and 3-D movement) have had concrete poured on them for close to 2 years now, and the tutorial in section A is basically my demo at conventions, which I've done a few hundred (or more...) times.

I have someone out there assembling an errata page from the Q&A topic at the web site -- it will be freely downloadable from the web site when done.

elsyrsyn17 Jun 2004 11:12 a.m. PST

Ad Astra - can you give us some details on your felt hex maps? Are they any different from the ones produced by Monday Knight? I've been looking for one with 1.5 or 2 inch hexes, with a black background, but with as small hex lines and numbers as possible. I'd like the hexes to be as unobtrusive as possible.

Thanks,
Doug

AdAstraGames17 Jun 2004 11:49 a.m. PST

Doug, they're the same as the ones MKP produces, with my logo on them, and with the addition of the two rosettes that I print on my paper maps. (One has A-F with cardinal compass points printed in a ring around it, one has 1-6 with a "clock face" printed around it; both compass points and clock faces are lined up with a hex spine (rotated 90 degrees) to facilitate use with naval and air combat gaming.

They don't have the resolution in screen printing to make fine line (or even fine print, like hex numbers) work. I've been trying to find a way to recreate my paper maps in felt with no luck.

elsyrsyn17 Jun 2004 12:28 p.m. PST

Drat. Guess I'll have to keep usign paper hex mats or buy one of the Chessex vinyl ones. I just don't like those big dotted hexagons.

Doug

William17 Jun 2004 2:50 p.m. PST

Thanks for the review Tom. The likelyhood of anyone agreeing to play said game with me is slim and none, but hey it sounds cool, and hopefully one of these days I can make it back to a big Con and play a game in the Honorverse.

Nyrath19 Jun 2004 6:00 a.m. PST

I'll add my two bits as another review:


First full disclosure: I've done some work with the game designer (as a matter of fact I generated the 3-D starmap and jump route map used in the background story).

I am in awe about the movement system of this game. Since I first got a copy of the legendary Triplanetary game back in 1972 I have been a fan of vector movement. StarForce and Battlefleet Mars made me a fan of 3-D wargames. Over the decades I've tried to combine the two (in a more intuitive way that Battlefleet Mars)

I had basically come to the conclusion that there wasn't any graceful way to do it.

But Attack Vector found a way. It just blows my mind that the movement system is vector, three-dimensional, and easy to play!

And the 3-dimensional firing arcs are just as big a breakthrough. If you compare StarFire to Star Fleet Battles you will see that weapon firing arcs are almost required. Making the arcs in 3-D is a non-trivial operation, and making them easy to use is almost impossible. But Attack Vector did it.

The rule book is arranged in what Mr. Pope calls "Avalon Hill" style, the designer calls "Star Fleet Battles" style, and I call "Simulations Publications" style. In any event, it makes it easy to find the rule in question. I enjoy the vivid images in the sidebars. Inflicting damage on a starship is described as "peeling an onion", the card used to track a coilgun burst is described as "a duck's-eye view of a shotgun blast".

The game is also based on hard science. The weapons parameters were determined according to the laws of physics, as were the propulsion, power supply, and detection equipment. I ensured that the starmaps were accurate, based on the solar neighborhood out to 15 parsecs. The designer is busy on a grand fleet version, an interstellar trading version, and an RPG all based on the future history (though of course all the excitement is over creating a version based in the Honor Harrington universe).

The designer has mentioned that he would like to include a ship design system, but it has to be tamed first. Currently designing ships involves using multiple interlocking computer spreadsheets with arcane variables and confusing equations.

Sure the game is pricy, but I believe it is worth evey penny.

Fabe 200420 Jun 2004 2:39 p.m. PST

The more reviews of AV:T I read the more reasured I become the I made a good choice in ordering this game. Hopefuly it'll arive at my local comic store soon so I can get my fellow gamers together and start playing.P.S are there and plans to and non-military ships such as freighters to the game? scenarios involving defending a freighter as it makes a run for a jump point sounds like it maybe interesting

AdAstraGames20 Jun 2004 6:39 p.m. PST

Fabe:

Unfortunately, due to internal choices made in the setting, if a freighter is on the same tactical map as an opposing warship, it's time for it to surrender and accept boarders.

The "combat mode" thrust of the ships is roughly 50x higher than the cruise mode thrust that everyone uses for in-system travel...or more.

Cruise mode runs at 5 milligees.

Combat Thrust 1 (1/4 gee) is 250 milligees.

Most warships can pull thrust 3 or higher, and need to in order to dodge seeking weapons. This just isn't an option for a freighter. If it's on the map, you salvo seekers at it and ignore the escort until the freighter is dead.

Basically, on this scale, a freighter is a fixed point, and the ability of warships to do it harm extends to ranges far beyond those playable on a map.

Fabe 200421 Jun 2004 2:23 p.m. PST

I started thinking along those lines after I posted that question I guess the old "Raid the convoy" scenario is more for the space opera type games like Starmada or perhapes the Honor Harrington game.

Brian Trotter21 Jun 2004 3:47 p.m. PST

I thought there was a limited zone defense available, so that escorts would have some ability to defend their charges from seekers. That leaves no good defense against directed energy weapons, but at least you have a short period of time to wear the raiders down before they enter energy range.

AdAstraGames21 Jun 2004 6:35 p.m. PST

Brian, there is some limited zone defense fire by escorts. But the best way for an escort to defend a convoy is to go out and engage the raiders from far enough away that the raider can't hit the convoy.

(And I owe you an apology -- we're still packing for Origins, so your game probably won't get shipped until after the show.)

Fabe 200422 Jun 2004 3:18 p.m. PST

Sorry if I'm getting way ahead of my self by planing out scenarios before I even have a copy of the game but could that work as a convoy type scenario?
The escort has engaged the raider far out side the raider's weapons range from the target, to win the riding ship has to make it off the far end of the map or destroy the defending ship before a set number of turns have past at which time the freightet has made it to safty.
or would all the attack have to do is set their ship engine at full and zip past the escort before they can even have time to aim their weapons?

AdAstraGames22 Jun 2004 6:59 p.m. PST

Fabe - there are rules for disengaging. The introductory scenario is, in fact, a classic convoy raid.

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