" Vietnam- what scale and company would you use? Why?" Topic

If you were to start on a Vietnam collection what scale would you go and why? What manufacturer and why?

FM

Eureka 25mm because they are the most accurate Australians on the market. In fact they are pretty much the only accurate Australians on the market.

28mm as I like that size of figure.
TAG, FOA and West Wind for figures. Lots of other makes for everything else.
I think next time I'd just stick to FOA for vehicles and Tanks. I have also thought of using 1/72nd scale Helicopters on flight stands and Monogram Helicopters for landed versions.

Problem is two Corgi Hueys and a Cobra were my first purchase on starting the project along with some M48's from Corgi which take up lots of space on the table.

28mm.. firstly because I love 28mm (see link )

But also because I like platoon/squad sized games, even upto a company. But in 28mm, unless you are fabulously wealthy, or don't want 1-1 representation, then usually bigger than that, you are into 20mm, 15mm, 10mm or 6mm etc.

If i was going to get into battalion sized gaming, I would probably go with 10 or 15mm.

In 28mm, you have the choices
Baker Company,
Force of Arms
The Assault Group
Westwind
Eureka (25mm)
Parkfield minis

and a lot of tall grass and trees..

20mm.

I see Vietnam as a conflict screaming for skirmish type games with individually mounted figures, this limits the scale to 15mm or larger.

Much of the conflict takes place in heavy jungle, and requires representing/modeling the jungle. This is easier in larger scale than in smaller scale. Also, managing the figures in a jungle is easier if they are larger, favoring 20-28mm scales.

Airmobile units were heavily involved in Vietnam and the widest range of in-scale equipment is available in 1/72 scale/20mm. (Scales are close) 1/48 scale aircraft are sometimes used with 28mm figs, but the differece in scale between 1/48 and 28mm is much greater/more obvious than that of 20mm-1/76-1/72, thus less favorable. Additionally, 1/48 scale models are more cumbersome, and the range available is a little more limited.

Riverine warfare was a big part of the conflict, and options for riverine craft are pretty much limited to 15 and 20mm scale.

20mm figures are available and manageable, and they allow larger units on a given table top, thus allowing the largest range of battles to be played.

Between 1/72 scale and 20mm, pretty much every vehicles used in Vietnam is available.

So, my first choice is 20mm, 28mm would be second, 15mm a distant third. Smaller scales are out, because you simly lose what appeals to me about gaming the Vietnam War. All of this is based on my own preferences.

I currently have a large 20mm collection, next i would go for 10mm to do the larger games.

28mm for skirmish, & 15mm for company/battalion level games.

I already game it in 10/12mm.

It is the one range/scale I have never had any misgivings about the choice. Plenty of others I have had misgivings (20mm ww2, 15/20mm ACW).

Started with Wild Geese (the range has gone through brengun and is now with the square).

Mainly use Pendraken/Minifigs these days as the Wild Geese vehicles are tiny (more skytrex 1/200th) but the figures are OK.

What else is available?
In short, the gangs all here!

Figures, the above. Plus paint job cvonversions.
Vehicles (millitary and civilian) are available from a wide range of manufacturers. 2CVs and other old vehicles a plenty form model railway suppliers.
Buildings. Timecast and the old Kennington range provide all the rurual buildings we need. Urban, plenty of n guage stuff about.
Aircraft. Furtuta choco eggs have provided me with all the aircover I could wish for. Their Hueys are worth looking out for (approx 1:180 so not embarassingly small when on the ground, are hogs, but the weapons packs can be taken of/left off giving you a slick).
Kennington did a good range of riverine vehicles. Others ranges developing.

we base up fire teams/squads, 3-5 figures a base or a heavy weapon + crew. So can easliy do platoon to company sized actions (approximately 1:1 scale organisation, 1 figure = 1 person in real life)

Takes up not a lot of space when packed up.

No arms pulled out of sockets when lugging kit to a game.

I have recently decided to convert entirely to just two sizes: 6mm and 15mm. Will be selling off all my 20mm, 25mm and other odds and ends this fall.

This cuts down on cost, storage space, and allows keeps my terrain needs to a minimum. That way my 15mm Nam terrain can also be 15mm pulp and 15mm WW2…..

I use Flashpoint infantry and QRF vehicles.

28mm – for the figure choice. While I have heard WWII called the company commanders war, Vietnam was called the platoon commanders war. I have seen some 15mm games with tons of troops on the table and had to think of one of the issues about Vietnam, that we attempted to fight the big battles of WWII there and it did not work.

So, for me, individual 28mm figures (hopefully with no two alike within a squad and very few alike within a platoon). A quick hint, if you have two of the same figures make one white and the other black.

Vince

Talking about Force of Arms – as I might, is this a good time to draw your attention to our New figure Range in the Operation Series – this time Australians

Op Hammer, 5RAR at Binh Ba 1969
RAR01 Infantry Squad (8): 1@ M16, M60 & M79; 8 x SLR £8.00 GBP
RAR02 Pl HQ (4): 2 x M16 – 1 w/PRC25, 2 x SLR at £5.00 GBP
RAR-Pl Platoon Pack: 3 x RAR01, 1x RAR02 + 2 special figures(Mortar Fire Controller w/Owen SMG and Scout w/M16) for £29.00 GBP

Updated list just on site – photos will follow, when I get the camera back!

All best John FoA

Oh yes and we've a great range of Australian armour too

Classic ooops – I didn't indicate scales, which are – 28mm figures 1/56 vehicles.

I think these are extremely accurate models and all different poses

More to follow, but not yet.

Cheers JohnFoA

hurrahbro,

Which set of rules o you use for 10mm gaming?

Cheers

Jim

I would go with 28mm also, for many of the reasons already covered. I am not familiar with FOA figures though. Does anyone have any pics of those available?

10/12mm. I guess it is a carry over from my WWII, just keeping with the same scale. I like the bigger battles. Cold War Commander rules. See hurrahbro above for manufacturers.

20mm becoause I have scads of Britannia ,SHQ and Elhiem and terain.
And 6mm 1/285th for the same reasons I use Ambush Valley and From the Delta to the DMZ….Mikey

20mm. All the detail of 28, but virtually every vehicle you could ever want is available and at reasonable prices.

I also have 15mm simply because it looks cool.

I have a fairly large 20mm (Brittania), and also 6mm (Irregular). The 20's are all painted, but the 6mm is mostly still in the bag.

With these 2 scales, I'd be loathe to move to another scale, although I do prefer 28mm. I went with 20mm at the time because of Brittania's range, but for the longest time it was quite difficult to obtain them from the US distributor.

I still need 20mm NVA, so one day that will need to be tacked on.

I aim to use Ambush Valley.

So, to answer your question, I'd go with 20mm – assuming of course that the ranges you want to purchase are easily obtained.

GregS

JohnFoA, how about coming out with some huey helicopters in 1/56? Definitely needed and no one does them. Also will there be an additional US armor coming out to go with your M48 and how about some more gun trucks.

Great news about the FOA Australians. I expect that they will scale well with TAG. The Eureka version is just to true 25mm to match with WW/BC/TAG.

Vince

I have a platoon each of Baker Company NVA and US Airborne (not all of them painted yet though). Very happy with the sculpts and the quality of the castings. I like small squad on squad up to platoon sized actions for Vietnam, so 28mm minis work fine for me. Throw out the occasional vehicle and you can still keep the game manageable.

Not all of Vietnam was jungle, so deciduous trees, open grassy fields, and rocky areas you would find in most scenery collections still works for lots of different areas of the country. Thinking central highlands here. I might work on a few termite mounds to round it out.

Also 20mm

15mm. That's the smallest that reasonable detail is possible for me.

That way, I mount various troops in different positions individually, which is how I do small-scale skirmish/patrol games. Each character has several figures, thereby showing whether he is walking, prone, etc., using my Paddy Mud rules.

Leftover figures from infantry packs get mounted 2 per stand for larger games.

That way, I can put any game up to a brigade per side (Command Decision) on a reasonable board, and the vehicles are used for each type. Reduced cost and a lot of game potential.

I have Paddy Mud rules and tables (Word and Excel files), as well as material on patrolling, for anyone who wants the same. Just e-mail me with the shopping list.

Bob Bailey

omemin@aol.com

I have started using Jungle Rot figures in 25mm for the era.
VR
James Mattes

Iron Ivan Keith – Makes a very good point. Vietnam as a country has a very diverse terrain range, depending where abouts in it you want your battle based. It is easy to get caught up in the "Jungle mindset", when infact, you have the delta, mostly grass land and reeds with low laying hills and lots of river/channels/canals.
Rolling hills of the IIcorps and then more mountainous and hills in the border regions and I corps, as a rough guide. So you can play with differing forces.

@JohnFoA – your centurian is a stunning model. If anyone has not seen it, its worth taking a look at. This lot should just about tip one of my club mates into 28mm vietnam.. having sold me all his baker company US.. his exuce was he only fancied anzacs.. now he can have em..lol

I plan to do a review on my blog in the near future on the various figure ranges with a few comparrison shots. This guide is a little old now but still handy for anyone looking to get into 28mm. It is just missing one of the latest figure lines. link

………………….
My Blog – 28mm Heaven – 28mmheaven.blogspot.com

I have 15mm, If I were starting over I'd go 20mm instead.

I started with 6mm, but peopel had to much trouble identifying weapons teams, so I have switched to 15mm. As I play up to company sized fights, 28mm crowds the board to much. And the vehiclkes are expensive huge and hard to find, at least they where when I started.

15mm all the way for me now.

Owen

Probably 15mm, but the odds that I'll ever do it are very low.

Not to mention the urban areas with lots of concrete buildings, modern industrial areas, French architecture and shacks with tin roofs, also lots of courtyards and walls.

15mm, maybe 1/87

15 is the smallest size I'd want to use and still be able to distinguish figures and weapons, and be able to deploy riverine boats and helicopters on the table. Terrain could do double duty with medieval Khmer and Cham armies.

Possibly 1/87 vehicles and 1/76 figures at the larger end, but sadly lacking in riverine options.

20mm or 1/72 for me!

I am 20-25 mm equipped, but like a lot of the 28s I've seen.

Peter Pig for PBR's and a nice overall 15mm range:
peterpig.co.uk/range1.htm

Gomi to add some of the larger 15mm riverine craft:
gomidesigns.co.uk

I'll be the freak – I'm doing company scale (each side = one company) at 3mm. I had originally planned 6mm since GHQ has a pretty complete line, but then Oddzial Osmy came out with their line. Since it's a sidebar project, the low cost (about $40 USD for US, VC, NVA infantry, armour, copters and boats) and playing area appealed to me.

Chris

20mm metals,1/72 plastics(Revell) and I am only interested in doing small firefights w/ Flying Lead or similar rules.Maybe a stray vehicle,but not a priority.

Battlefront Vietnam figures – 15mm with 1/100 scale vehicles. The helicopters are extremely nice, come with plenty options, decals, etc. The infantry are decent – they aren't "master works" quality, but they are nicely done and they come with a good variety of weapons. The unit sizes make for good skirmish gaming.

Depends. If you want to recreate a world where grunts rarely see the enemy, calling air support in a firefight is risky and friendly fire aint, them I'd go 28mm. TAG first choice.

I forgot to add that I also have some 1/285 GHQ vehicles and figures that I think would be good for combined actions on a grand scale. I just have trouble visualising how to make decent looking terrain.

20mm….its the only way to be sure

It depends on the game size you want and what you are trying to achieve. In the defs I use below, I am tlaking about what one player can control in a muti-player game before being cumbersome.

28mm is great for squad against squad or up to platooon sized but still skirmish. One player plays one guy or a couple players each have a squad.

20mm is where skirmish meets squad level. Players control squads but each individual fig can be something different.

15mm is where squad meets platoons… etc…

I currently play 20mm but I am swapping out for 15mm. I want flights of helicopters on the table and 20mm is too big for me.

I have played some truly excellent Vietnam games using 6mm and the CWC rules. The first was a small scale infantry skirmish getting US grunts to an evac point through ambush ally, the second an Australian bunker busting exercise with centurions etc.. all worked really well.

One tip was that in the first game we used a green sheet and put down 'areas' of open ground, rather than the more usual – put down open ground and then add terrain features, soi the assumption was that anything not marked otherwise was pretty dense terrain.

15mm…using Battlefront Vietnam line…Flashpoint Miniatures…always good QRF line..Eureka French Foreign Legion infantry…might not be the detail of 28mm, but lots of choice here.

15mm and Peter Pig get my vote.
Lots of cheap diecast aircraft available too.

I just noted that you also want how makes the figs you use. I use mostly battlefront, even though I dont like the Vietnam game. I feel thier hueys are the best on the market. Once I get a cobra, I can comment on that as well. For infantry I use a mix of BF and OG. And plan to get a few things from Peter Pig that others dont make.

For vehicles, mostly OG, with BF covering what OG doesnt make. I like BF, but just cant afford to do a full force in thier stuff.

Owen

I think the Cold War in the mid 50s has been completely overlooked

I have a lot of Peter Pig in 15mm from Mick's Metal Model in Adelaide and would recommend. Flashpoint Miniatures in Brisbane look nice but I have not used them, am considering their M113 mortar car. QRF from Olympian Games in Canberra are very slow anywhere from 3 up to 12 months from order to delivery. Landscape from Miniature ModelMakers in Adelaide "very nice". Finally "Bump in the Boonies" by Cliff Mitchell Company level rules for Vietnam from Napoleon's Bookshop in Brisbane. If you would like me to send you a photocopy let me know.

QRF from Olympian Games in Canberra are very slow anywhere from 3 up to 12 months from order to delivery

If you have a local store you want to stock QRF, get them to contact us. We supply to Dean and as when he places an order.

I think the Cold War in the mid 50s has been completely overlooked

Most of the focus was towards Korea and the Chinese Civil War, but we do produce a few nice western front beasites: