"German use of soviet SMGs?" Topic

I know the German's captured piles of soviet submachine guns, and converted plenty of them to German pistol ammunition.

What I am wondering is if there are any particular considerations for how they were (re)issued?

Did just they replace MP40's here and there?
Volksgrenadier machine pistol platoons?
Guards and sentries ?
Something else entirely?

Inquiring minds wants to know

drat.. posted to the wrong board at first. Sorry

I think it was several issues. I think that it was part of every soldier's curiousity at the other guy's weapons, the PPSH is cool, so to speak. Also, with only one SMG in the German rifle squad, the additional SMGs would be nice to have in close quarters fighting. Then there is the need for more weapontry for the German military and the use of other countries weapons to fill gaps in the invantory for second line, police, and other units.

In front line units, you might see men spontaneously (with squad/platoon leaders permission) arming themselves with captured weapons here and there, and then keeping on using them as long as they can get ammo (or somebody from upper HQ decides to try collecting all the captured weapons of type X).

At the higher level, captured weapons collected in depots would be more likely to be assigned to whole units, rather than in penny-packets here and there. This would make training and logistics simpler.

That makes sense. Reason I am asking though is that PPSH41,s were rechambered to German 9mm ammo, so logistics presumably would be pretty simple. Training of course is a concern.

It does make sense that a unit would likely be given one or the other, not a mix.

"Training of course is a concern."

My old Army unit in Korea had a Ppsh, it was the simplest weapon I've ever seen. I could figure it out in 30 seconds, so must have been easy for the Germans.

The Germans had specific units at Corps level, moving rapidly behind the advancing forces, to review and catalog enemy equipment for German exploitation. I guess the question would be whether these units tried to catalog Soviet small arms and re-issue them, or whether it was strictly a low-level, "pick it up if you want to" type of thing…

James Coburn had one in 'Cross of Iron'. That's good enough for me.

so logistics presumably would be pretty simple. Training of course is a concern.

On larger level, there is also the issue of providing armorers with the appropriate training and spares for the guns. In case you can be bothered to do that.

I guess the question would be whether these units tried to catalog Soviet small arms and re-issue them

Considering the German thoroughness, I would be quite surprised if they would not have produced warehouses full of nicely stockpiled Soviet guns. Germans did not really have reputation for throwing away what they captured.

Of course the logistics of actually transporting those guns to somewhere else could be another issue, and might take up time.

Soldiers always like trying out enemy weapons – Allied troops tried out MP-40s, but one thing about the PPsH, in addition to having no ammo problems and being dead simple it is nearly impossible to break – so would last a long, long time

Captured PPsH were the second most commonly issued SMG among Axis forces after the MP40, both the uncoverted ones and the ones which had been fiddled with to take MP40 mags.

The designations escape me, MP717(r)???

The issued ones were issued on a similar scale to other SMGs. They were most commonly found on the Eastern Front, for obvious reasons.

Most of the million+ captured SVT40 rifles were also re-issued to units on the Eastern Front.

On a related note, did Germany actually manufacture ammunition for the weaponry it captured?

Probably not, but when you're capturing entire supply trains you don't need to.

It seems that instead of making ammo, when they cared to keep the weapons in service they'd re-chamber or rebarrel. What was that Russian gun that the germans rechambered for PaK40 ammo?

>>>On a related note, did Germany actually manufacture ammunition for the weaponry it captured?
<<<

A lot of PPSH41's were rechambered for 9mm German pistol ammunition, as the MP41(r) (if memory serves right)

Here's a link on Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PPSh-41

we're having a TV series on various Red Army WWII weapons and equipment. One thing about PPSH that I wasn't aware of, is that disks were "tuned" for each of the SMG. It was a common thing that a disk from one was not fit for another SMG, especially made at different location. Each SMG had their own "tuned" disks shipped together. Later that was a problem of field technicians. The issue was a downside of extremely robust design, that mainly used stamped details…

If issued, they would probably go to second line units. The problem of fratricide is real. You can tell who is out there by te sound of the weapon. And the PPSh41 is very noticeable.
It is extremely fast firing [ca700 rpm]. The sound would draw fire. It is a fun shot tho.
Weaselhoffen.