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"Flags, Fanions and historical accuracy" Topic


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Peoples Champ04 Jul 2010 5:52 p.m. PST

I am playing Lasalle assembling my French Peninsula 28mm army at present and am in the process of ordering some flags. Just wanted to get my head around a few things.
Am I correct in stating each unit in lasalle is a battalion not a regiment? I am only learning about napoleonic history etc so correct me if I am wrong but after 1808 only one eagle was carried per regiment so if I am formimg my list based around the forces at Salamanca 1812 I would have say the 39th Line Regiment as my conscript unit with one unit carrying the eagle and say the other 3 units carrying fanions?
How many units in Lasalle would make up a regiment do you think?
I have to field 4 conscript and 3 veteran for the core peninsula list. I understand the 39th and 59th were conscript infantry but as to veteran am I safe to put any other line regiments from Salamanca down as my veteran regiments like the 69th from 1st division under Foy?
How do you tell what was a veteran regiment and what was a conscript? I have come across a very good site given to me by Stuart at Maverick Models which gives excellent info on Orders of battle
cgsc.edu/carl/nafziger.htm

JCBJCB04 Jul 2010 8:38 p.m. PST

A few helps, though it's impossible to answer all your questions as fully as I'd like. I'm sure some folks can recommend some good reading for you.

1. Yes, units are battalions. One battalion can carry the eagle, and the other three fanions. I'm not sure what list you're using, and I don't have the Salamanca OOB in front of me here, but you could also divide your four battalions into two regiments of two battalions apiece, with each regiment having an eagle-bearing battalion and a fanion-bearing battalion.

2. As for how many battalions LaSalle specifies per regiment, you won't find that in there. That could vary by campaign and theater. Some French units in 1812 went into Russia with four or five battalions; French units in 1815 took the field with as few as two (if memory serves correctly). If you're going by an historical OOB, then you can follow that. If I have a LaSalle list with six core battalions, I can build one regiment of four battalions and one of two, or two regiments with three battalions, or even two regiments with two battalions and two regiments with only one battalion apiece. In Spain, especially, battalions often served far away from their parent regiments. Single-battalion "regiments" were not uncommon.

3. I don't usually build specific OOBs. I field a regiment I like, and "plug" it in to a scenario if I need it. If I have painted the 45th Ligne with three battalions, and I play a scenario calling for the 39th Ligne with three battalions, I just plug the 45th in and rate them as necessary. A battalion is a battalion is a battalion, in my eyes.

4. Veteran vs. conscript? That knowledge will be based on your understanding of the historical battle being portrayed (if you're sold on portraying a specific battle, that is). If you're interested in Salamanca, only doing some thorough reading on that battle will answer those questions. And once you've answered them, you'll run into gamers who have their own opinions. You'll soon see that opinions are like – well, you-know-what – everyone has one.

Peoples Champ04 Jul 2010 10:17 p.m. PST

I like the idea of using 2 units for one regiment with one regiment carrying the eagle and the other fanion. Cheers.
The reason I am searching units from Salamanca is really to source what regiments were in the Peninsular War in the later periods.
Have just got Charles Esdaile's book 'The Peninsular War' out from the local library so that should be a good source of info re veteran vs conscript.

Peoples Champ04 Jul 2010 10:26 p.m. PST

Looking at the OOB from The Nafziger Collection of Orders of Battle cgsc.edu/carl/nafziger.htm just trying to decipher what it means. Excerpt below:

1st Division: Général de division Foy
Brigade: Général de brigade Chemineau
6th Légère Regiment (2)(46/1,055)
69th Line Regiment (2)(50/1,408)
Brigade: Général de brigade Desgraviers-Berthelot
39th Line Regiment (2)(49/918)
76th Line Regiment (2)(56/1,351)

What are the numbers in brackets after the regiments?

von Winterfeldt04 Jul 2010 10:35 p.m. PST

I would say

2 Battalions, 46 officers, 1055 rank and file and NCOs for
6e légèr

Peoples Champ04 Jul 2010 10:39 p.m. PST

That makes sense.
Thanks von Winterfeldt.

JCBJCB05 Jul 2010 1:19 a.m. PST

Yep. Battalions, followed by officers and other ranks.

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