"Napoleon is a Villain because..." Topic

Well?

He caused the deaths of hundreds of thousands of people in his attempt to force his will on Europe.

No one knew what his hand was doing in his greatcoat

He smelled bad, was short, and anti-British. That's enough for me. Pretty uniforms though.

he worked for france

I think I took the other thread too seriously…

Lessee,

-He pretended to be Muslim (blasphemy)
-Slaughtered entire french cities that had already surrendered to ensure he appeared strong
-He stole Hanover and gave it away
-He fooled around on his wives
-If I'm not mistaken he started several wars

I'm sorry, Bill. This is a ridiculous premise.

He was fighting against all of the other European Powers from forming the European Union 200 years early and having to file for bankruptcy!

Sorry is that to political?

He lost.

The winners write the history books.

I think he may have kicked a dog once, apart from that he was a good egg.

"-If I'm not mistaken he started several wars"

well you are completely mistaken… he might have had very disturbing policies for European powers (continental blockade being one of them, making Kings as in Spain, and many others, mainly economical), but technically he only started the Russian war. Even then, that is slightly arguable as Russia had joined a coalition with England and Napoleon decided to strike first.

one can only be happy that Imperialist France didn't rule Europe any longer. Having said that, European powers made Napoleon's military fame by initiating war against France again and again and again, from the Revolutionary days till the 100 days.

A villain for:
- placing his relatives at the head of new states.
- imposing a ruler to Spain that lead to the Guerilla.
- economically transform neighbour countries into satellites.
- forcing everyone into continental blockade (though that was his only weapon to weaken Britain, Britain that would not make peace in any circumstance).

Conscription of children into the army.

He was an ogre and ate children.

Didn't he?

He not only reestablished slavery within the French Empire, but reenslaved those blacks who had been freed by the Revolution.

He was an ogre from Corsica.

There is nothing more galling for the Brits than having a marvellous heroic defeat ruined by the Germans turning up (late! no trains then clearly) & winning the battle for them.

Its all HIS fault.

Well there are the revolutionary points:

Betrayed the Revolution by becoming a dictator, some would say "Emperor".
Betrayed the Revolution by the Concordat of 1801 with the Pope.
Restored the Gregorian Calander; today is 6 Messidor CXVIII after all.

There are the international angle:

Was incapable of international compromise, see Charles Esdaile "Napoleon's Wars: An International History 1803-15"
Did not respect interantional law, for example the kidnap and murder of the duc d'Enghein.

He is labeled evil because the British won the war and labeled him as such!

If he was anti-British, he must have been evil!

Bill, you are being a trouble maker.

Wasn't he the one responsible for the Deepwater Horizon spill?

He had a really stupid hat.

He was short.

John, John, John – he wasn't short – he just made the mistake of getting painted beside Old Guard Grenadiers all the time!

He really, really screwed up a golden opportunity to make France into a modern nation state by being at war all the time – he needed to use those skills he had early on and stop treating every problem like a nail

Also, he introduced the Bardin drummers jackets – I find them hard to paint

The stupid "hand in coat" trend. picture

What was he reaching for?

His tambourine? (reference to animated depiction of N.B.on "Histeria!")

He lost! (if you are French)

He won a lot of battles! (if you are not French)

"Well there are the revolutionary points:"

Thank you for noting these! So many people will forgive any enormity, or just look the other way, so long as the bully mouths what they believe is the correct ideology.

I really don't think we can make a value judgment for historical figures in cases like this.

Also, he apparently inspires lame polls.

He makes ordinarily normal people work themselves into irrational frenzies on Naploeniic History and Napoleonic Discussion.

Nay, not just frenzies. Tizzies too!

His army chefs invented margarine!!!

What the OFM didn't say. Obviously the fact that the OFM is a relic of Napoleonic times himself has clouded his judgement in these matters.

Sorry my mistake!

"He was fighting against all of the other European Powers from forming the European Union 200 years early and having to file for bankruptcy!"

I woke up this AM and it hit me, I had it halfassedbackwards.

Napoleon "Continental System" was like the "European Union" just 200 years early.

Sorry all, see what a decent night sleep will do for you.

Robert Henry

He dressed his troops in a variety of uniforms with the deliberate intention that 200 years later anally retentive people would point at wargames figures and say 'I don't believe that that is the correct shade of green for those dragoons…'.
Somewhere in the Invalides is the sound of (evil) ghostly laughter…

A selection of 'historians' – who cannot bear to use his imperial title, apparently because self-improvement is a mortal sin to them – need him to be to justify btheir relentlessly pintless meanderings and hand wringing.

He is Des-pot

I think these two threads are just a clever ploy by Bill to populate the doghouse with more people, knowing that such a premise will bring out the worst in people. Nasty, wicked editor! <grin>

Better a Des-pot than a Tea-pot

Because he said "What are the lives of a million men to one such as I"

On the other hand he did allow the British Army to win one of its most prestigious battle honours which still resonates today…

That this prestige has remained is proven by the fact that it is clearly STILL getting the goat of numerous people who have to invent a dialogue where the Brits tried not to share the credit with the Germans…(I refer to JeffSaysHi comment above…)

Jeff – do yourself a favour and:

1. Google the Waterloo despatch
2. Read it

Kind Regards,

Sparker

Because he said "What are the lives of a million men to one such as I"

Wasn't half stuck on himself was he?

Yes I think we can agree he had a healthy ego! His bladder however…

because he gave his name to a period i enjoy gaming and have spent far too much cash on…..plus he probably took a dive once in soccer!!!

he invented 'briccole with cheese' in an attempt to pander to farmers pushing certain vegetables NOT popular with kids, while 'beefing' up relations with dairy industry for cheese and ice-cream confectionaries at the same time…(which sorta undoes the positive 'veggie' angle)….

People don't like him.
-Kle.

He spoke French with an Italian accent? Maybe in the movie 'Waterloo' Rod Steiger should have played him sounding like he came Hoboken. New Jersey…..

He was a megalomaniac who hijacked the revolution.

… people need to have a nice simplistic view of history with clearcut good guys and bad guys, which lends itself to highly entertaining opinion-based "history" that glosses over the confusing facts and complexities. N is a villain because some people need him to be one.

… people need to have a nice simplistic view of history with clearcut good guys and bad guys, which lends itself to highly entertaining opinion-based "history" that glosses over the confusing facts and complexities. N is a villain because some people need him to be one.

Hmmm…sounds familiar…

He was a megalomaniac who hijacked this forum.