Help support TMP


"Brunswickers at Waterloo" Topic


7 Posts

All members in good standing are free to post here. Opinions expressed here are solely those of the posters, and have not been cleared with nor are they endorsed by The Miniatures Page.

Please remember that some of our members are children, and act appropriately.

For more information, see the TMP FAQ.


Back to the Napoleonic Discussion Message Board


Areas of Interest

Napoleonic

Featured Hobby News Article


Featured Link


Top-Rated Ruleset

Volley & Bayonet


Rating: gold star gold star gold star gold star gold star gold star gold star 


Featured Profile Article

First Look: 1:700 Scale USS Constitution

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian looks at the new U.S.S. Constitution for Black Seas.


Current Poll


Featured Book Review


1,686 hits since 15 Jun 2010
©1994-2026 Bill Armintrout
Comments or corrections?


TMP logo

Membership

Please sign in to your membership account, or, if you are not yet a member, please sign up for your free membership account.
John Franklin15 Jun 2010 9:10 a.m. PST

Having been responsible for placing a subject on the forum concerning the possibility of the Duke of Wellington being killed at Les Quatre Bras, and the ramifications for the Allied army, I wanted to provide some content, which I have taken from the extant Brunswick Order Books (and translated as best as one can), showing the difficulties facing the troops from Braunschweig following the death of their beloved Duke. The Order Books (there are two) provide a fascinating insight into the concentration of the Brunswick Corps (and to my knowledge the details have never been published), but the entries for the 18th June 1815 are the most revealing. Please note that there are no entries for either the 16th or 17th June. The details are as follows:

Order of the day, nr.169, on the battlefield near Jenappes [sic], in the morning of the 17th, from Colonel and Brigadier E. Olfermann:

1. Major von Wolffrath is named commander of the Line Brigade in the absence of Lt-Col von Specht.

2. The commanding officers order that if the Duke of Wellington's Chief of staff enquires after the whereabouts of the said Lt-Col or any other officers, he is to be referred to the battalion commanders, who will answer: 'I do not know'. The gentlemen and commanders will have to see that the whereabout of the Lt-Col. are looked into.

3. Promotions:

Captain von Bülow of the 1st Jäger [Light] Battalion is appointed acting Major with the Avantgarde, and is to serve in this capacity until the appointment is confirmed by the government.

[A whole host of similar appointments follow, which I will leave for the present, but which I am happy to add, if required.]

Order of the day, nr.170, on the battlefield near Jenappes, dated midday on the 18th, from Colonel and Brigadier E. Olfermann:

1. Despite the strict orders which were issued two hours ago, many individuals and parties have left the corps and set about marauding in the neighbouring villages, which has been reported to the colonel and will also be reported to the Duke of Wellington. The battalion commanders must hold a rollcall at once. The names of all absent culprits will be noted and they are to be punished severely.

2. An officer from every battalion is to be sent to Brussels to find all of the men from their battalions who have left the corps and to bring them back immediately.

3. The cattle and spirits of every kind which belong to the various battalions are to be sent to the 2nd Line Battalion immediately. When this has been done sufficient animals will be slaughtered and the meat distributed to the men. This order is to be followed to the letter.

4. The various battalion commanders will read this order to their individual companies at once and to the letter. If an individual commander cannot supply his battalion with adequate rations in time, he must contact his superiors immediately, who will ensure that the requests receive the utmost attention. The commissionary general was instructed to investigate this matter yesterday. However, as three separate messages have been sent in relation to this subject, and as the cuprits continue to maraude, the most severe punishment should be issued.

End

It is clear from the above that the men in the various Brunswick battalions were hungry, and that order was a problem. Lt-Col. von Specht had deserted under the cover of the retreat from Les Quatre Bras, but returned two days' later. However, none of the officers would serve with him from that moment.

The question arises: how do you think the British would have acted if Wellington had been killed at Les Quatre Bras?

I am going to add the details from the Brunswick Order Books to the 1815 Limited on-line archive shortly. Please forgive the plug but I have a number of previously unpublished Brunswick items that I am now working on. If you have any questions I am always happy to help, if I can

John Franklin


P.S. Please forgive any typos!

jammy four Sponsoring Member of TMP15 Jun 2010 9:29 a.m. PST

John

fascinating insight into the machinations of the brunswick
Corp ,The Duke appeared too be the glue that held the Corp
together so i guess its understandble there was a degree
of panic ,loss of order in essence with no overall commander
immediately in charge. So i guess its to the ordinary line
troops credit they performed so well at Waterloo.

as for Wellington being killed,now thats a different case
would we have had another Albuera? heaven knows.Waterloo
would have been a lot different i summise,the prince of
orange was second in charge if im not mistaken. Mon dieux!!!

regards
Ged
gjm.figurines.co.uk

138SquadronRAF15 Jun 2010 10:35 a.m. PST

Wonderful stuff John, thank you.

Sparker15 Jun 2010 8:12 p.m. PST

Interesting that the link is made between marauding and the supply of victuals. I guess serving in the modern military one tends to take having professional and reliable logs chain for granted.

I would find it difficult to severely punish a soldier for taking food if I couldn't ensure he was properly fed myself…

Then again in relatively recent times the Para Bde at Arnhem were down to a boiled sweet a day for several days, with no loss of discipline.

I have heard an anecdote about a RN SSN crew at the height of the COld war who stumbled on the tail of a Soviet SSBN just at the scheduled end of their 4 month patrol up in the GIUK gap. They were told to hang on to the bomber's tail for as long as possible. Unfortunately the bomber was transitting from Murmansk to Vladiovostock….

For the last few months the diet consisted entirely of tinned potatoes – boiled, mashed or cold. Towards the end of the patrol mealtimes got a little tense…

Kind Regards,

Sparker

Field Marshal24 Jun 2010 8:34 p.m. PST

List the other promotions please!!!!

John Franklin23 Aug 2010 11:21 a.m. PST

Dear Field Marshal,

I apologise for not having posted the Brunswick list as yet, but certain other pressing items have taken president. However, I will complete this in the next couple of days and you will have a full list very soon. John Franklin

Supercilius Maximus24 Aug 2010 6:56 a.m. PST

<<For the last few months the diet consisted entirely of tinned potatoes – boiled, mashed or cold. Towards the end of the patrol mealtimes got a little tense… >>

Sparker – When my brother was doing his dissertation for his history degree, he told me he came across evidence that during WW1 the British Army got groups of volunteers to live on just one or two types of food, to establish the optimum contents of front line rations. Every group showed a considerable deterioration in physical and mental performance, except for the group fed entirely on potatoes, who remained physically capable, and only showed a slight, but noticeable, deterioration in mental response time.

[Sorry for hijacking the thread….]

Sorry - only verified members can post on the forums.