"Favourite ancients movie?" Topic

"Wasn't there a "Jason & the Argonauts" movie from the 60s? Atrocius special effects by modern standards…"

Aiyeeee. Ray Harryhausen's special effects -- stop action animation directly descended from the original King Kong -- are to my eye still very acceptable (if somewhat herky jerky). In the remake of The Clash of the Titans, I would judge the Medusa segment the only part of the film that clearly exceeds Harryhausen's original. Otherwise the remake is pretty bad, as the story is almost cut to incomprehensible ribbons.

And I agree with JJartist on Troy. The O'Toole/Priam scene retrieving the body of Hektor is terrific, but the movie otherwise seems to be utterly clueless re: basic themes of the Trojan War story (granted it appears to be in the Medieval/Latin tradition overall).

JJ surprises me somewhat on Alexander, if only because you were more positive about this film when first you saw it (if memory serves me). I like the scale of the movie and the spectacle, especially the reconstruction of Babylon. The battles, if somewhat abstracted, with a kind of all rolled into one quality (definitely elements of the Granikos and Gaugamela are combined), are well worth a watch, even the crazy scene of Bucephalus charging the elephant.

I remember thoroughly enjoying the miniseries 'Masada', but I haven't seen it in years… don't even know if it's ever had a DVD release.

For Swords 'n sandals cheesey fun, though:

link

Scythed chariots. They are real.

Life of Brian.

Jason and the Argonauts (liked this movie so much I named my son Jason)
300
Ben Hur (the battle at sea scenes – where fantastic but too short)
Troy (just OK)

Speaking of Battle Scenes, 300 seamed to last so long with the sword and spear fighting that I began to laugh how it was going on and on and on. Then near the end of the movie, the fight scenes were really starting to get booaaaring…..

"Unfortunately by not coming up with an angle, good or evil for Alexander, we are left with too much gray area and psycho-anal-ness, and that is simply not what an audience wants…."

If you want to make a popular ancient "war movie", do "The Afghan Campaign" (which if you ask me--and you didn't--is the only Pressfield novel that should be allowed near celluloid, or whatever they use nowadays…).

Do a film that stays true to that novel, and you'll see praise and popularity like you did for "The Hurt Locker". But it's grim…

If you haven't read it, read it:

link

Allen

300 Spartans
The Warlord
Cleopatra
Jason & the Argonauts (Harryhausen)
Eaters of the Dead

"JJ surprises me somewhat on Alexander, if only because you were more positive about this film when first you saw it (if memory serves me)."

---> Yes.. when it first came out it was being so universally panned for unfair reasons (mostly homo-phobic ones), that I felt I had to stick up for at least the battle scenes and attempt to impart a historical story in a historical way…. I have the DVD but I'd rather watch Rome when I'm sick or Band of Brothers or Deadwood… the last time I watched it I fast forwarded cause I just couldn't take the banality of the characters… the lack of any charisma anywhere…

So over time I like it less. There is a new book written by historians about the problems of Stone's Alexander and historical films in general, that may be an interesting read. In the long run it is more a movie that promotes discussion of issues with movies more than history, as Mulopwepaul points out.

Just the other day a colleague was saying how 300 inspired him to read all about Thermopylae on Wikipedia and that just about made me feel warm all over. Western civilization is safe in the next generation due to wikipedia rather than his edumacation which left out the Greeks because they had those other religions. Oh, now I'm sounding like Allen. Fartmeister thanks for the back.
JJ

With due respect, it wasn't observant Christians who campaigned to strip Latin and Greek from the core curriculum…

Cocoon.
Great Ancients movie.

No wonder: Hume Cronyn was in Cleopatra…and had known her personally before…

300 Spartans
Spartacus
parts of both "Alexander" films
the non-religious parts of "Ben Hur."

I disagree with the negative opinions cited above in relation to Alexandros III of Macedon, "the Invincible," "the Great."

Yes, to argue that it was observant religious people to blame for the lack of Western Civ in current curriculums is a bit silly.

The 300 Spartans
Jason and the Argonauts (1963 Harryhausen version, of course)
Spartacus
Ben Hur
Cleopatra (1964 Taylor/Burton, natch)
Troy
Quo Vadis
The Trojan Women

Land of the Pharaohs is highly entertaining although not terribly "good" -- honorable mention to the TV series' "Masada" and "I, Claudius" -- and hey, Shag, welcome back from the DH!!!

PS: If I had the means, the production I'd make of "Eagle in the Snow" (based on the Wallace Breem novel) would be on all of y'all's lists.

"Yes, to argue that it was observant religious people to blame for the lack of Western Civ in current curriculums is a bit silly."

------> If anybody had said that.

"With due respect, it wasn't observant Christians who campaigned to strip Latin and Greek from the core curriculum…"

-------> Huh? My sister-in-law teaches Mythology as part of her classes in the LA school system.. every semester some parent(s) wants to withdraw their kids from that portion of the teaching… more power to them to remove a chance to learn something about their world… like Sunday, Moon day, Tiw's day, Wodin's day, Thor's day, Frigga's Day, Saturn's day…..
JJ

Parents attempting to control their children's religious education does not amount to an attempt to smother classical studies…Mediaeval studies are somehow taught in government schools without rehearsing the miracles of St. Francis and St. Anthony…please find another scapegoat.

300- great film if taken as the film the Spartan's would have made. A bit pants if you're looking for historical accuracy. Having said that, the overall story is accurate, just the details (rhino's, costumes, fighting style) that irritates. My wife hated it as she saw it as a slur on the men who fought and died there and she's not remotely interested in history before the 1700s usually.
Gladiator- as already said for the period feel rather than accuracy.
Troy- I really liked this. While not the greatest historical epic it was certainly no worse than many Hollywood blockbusters and better most. I could never understand the bile this generated.

Only one mention of "Carry On Cleo" so far!

Should be at number one on anyone's list just for Caesar's line "Infamy! Infamy! They've all got it in for me!"

Troy
Carry on Cleo
Gladiator – went to a Radio 1 free premiere so got to see it weeks before everyone else!!!
Passion of the Christ
TimeLife Joseph
Joseph King of Dreams (animation)

What, no mention of Caligula?

An exciting recommendation, Allen, I have just purchased the Pressfield book.

I liked Stone's movie much more than most despite all of its flaws. Sure, a hardcore war movie would have fulfilled my dreams but it wasn't to be. Maybe Iranian cinema could offer more of a Persian perspective (maybe it has!).

Anyone seen the French film Vercengetorix? Don't bother…

I Claudius….

The warlord
Troy
Gladiator
The Bruce

Hi

"I come hotfoot from rome…" Loved all the Carry On Movies.

That said, I would remind John that we are not the audience for these things. I consider it wonderful if there is some bit that lets me see things on screen that I have imagined.

Loved seeing phalanx in the Stone movie, for instance.

Loved seeing the toppless towers of illim, "priam's treasure" being worn on greek looking women, even like the "posing" of the battle scenes taken of famous to me greek art.

Most of these movies have SOMETHING. And we are not the audience.

Rocky

"Go Tell the Spartians" with Burt Lancaster. Okay it is Vietnam but to some that is ancient history. Or so I have been told. The others for the most part are a bunch of crud. HBO's Rome on the other hand I miss.
VR
James Mattes

The final cut version of Alexander is a good deal more coherent than the theatrical release. It actually provides some chronology so things hang together a good deal more coherently. At least in that version I think it does count as a decent Ancient movie although Colin Ferrell just doesn't have the charisma that the historical Alexander seems to have had.

The uncut version is also worthwhile for scenes that were cut from the theatrical release as well as for having a number of useful extras on the making of the movie and some discussion by Stone of what his intentions were.

Both of the later versions are distinctly better than the theatrical release.

Chris

"Anyone seen the French film Vercengetorix? "

The one with Christopher Lambert as V.? Laughable!

Aired here as "Druids".

link

YouTube link

Allen

I thought that Alexander was ok; it was pretty Hollywood, but who doesn't like to see a good phalanx? Then I got the final version and I had a head smacking moment. It wasn't supposed to be linear, it's a bunch of in medius res flashbacks as Alexander campaigns.

I thought the intended movie was excellent and I always wonder if the many many detractors have seen the movie that the Director made before it was cut to shreds by movie executives.

Lord Assur Reborn,

I got the first DVD of Alexander then I bought the Directers "The Final Cut"

Loved the last version because of all the added slaughter.

Clietus cuts a persians head off and flails it like a club.Theres even an elephant stomping on a Macedonian…

Hey Allen, Vercengetorix was a Highlander?

Lol Christopher Lamber speaking french.

A film version of Nicholas Guild's THE ASSYRIAN would be pretty kewl