"Lasalle and Black Powder basing question" Topic

I want to know if Black Powder and Lasalle will work with my 'generic' 15mm basing. I believe that 3/4" wide by 1" deep (infantry) bases [3-4 bases per unit] and 1" wide by 2" deep (cavalry) [just 2 bases per unit] will work for many systems including Shako and Napoleon's Battles.

I haven't based (or bought) my 15mm troops yet since I need to know quantities of figures per unit before ordering.

I misunderstood the basing for Black Powder and Lasalle. I thought they had one unit per base. Digging a little deeper..

I got this from a review of Lasalle on TMP

"Lasalle is a tactical level game, or petit tactical as the author says. Armies are comprised of units, being battalions, regiments etc, of 4 or 6 stands for horse and foot (ie ‘small' and ‘large' units) and mostly 4-base artillery units with armies totalling perhaps 12-18 units."

Would Lasalle work with my 3-4 bases per stand infantry and 2 bases per stand cavalry units? Or would I want to double up units to beef them up to Lasalle spec? How about my base sizes (see first para)?

I read a TMP review of Black Powder which said it would work for any basing. But can someone with experiene of the system tell me if it will work with my basing?

Each unit in lasalle is minimum 4 bases big, each base can be as big or small as you want, the rules recomend 40x30mm bases but I use 30x30 and works just fine

So basicly you need to find out if you got enough bases to make 10-12 4 base units pr. side.

No, the bases cannot be "as big or small as you want" because they need to be the SAME AS THE PERSON YOU PLAY. If a player is interested in pickup games and tournaments, then there needs to be a single standard.

And we are definitely not there yet.

The Lasalle basing pages are available here:

PDF link

It includes provisions for your basing system. You should be fine.

But can someone with experiene of the system tell me if it will work with my basing?

Black powder (as written) wants a unit with 240mm total frontage, be played in inches on some 6x18 foot monstrosity table.

What I PLAN ON DOING is playing in centimeters on a 4x6 table with about 120mm frontage (that would be 6 of your 3/4" bases). This makes sense since Black Powder is basically "Warmaster in 28mm" and by going to centimeters you've gone back to Warmaster's original measuring.

Black Powder works just fine with NB/shako basing. Use either cms or 2/3 ranges with 15mm. There are some fine QRef sheets available out there (the Yahoo group for example) for the 2/3 and 1/2 ranges.

6 bases could be a medium sized infantry unit (4 small, 2 tiny, 7 or 8 large).

No, the bases cannot be "as big or small as you want" because they need to be the SAME AS THE PERSON YOU PLAY

for a minute I thought you meant something around 1.7/1.8 meter, unless you play Napoleon, where 1.45m is enough… ;)

they need to be the SAME AS THE PERSON YOU PLAY

In Black Powder, as long as the units have the same frontage you would be OK. So 24 figures on 20mm frontage could fight 36 figures on 15mm frontage or some such.

Thanks for the info.

Stinky – I see from your PDF (thanks for that) my base sizes would be doubled (infantry 3/4" by 1" and cavalry 1" x 2"). Does that mean I would need eight infantry bases or eight cavalry bases per unit?

I would suggest 8 infantry bases and 6 cavalry bases per unit. You would then be able to have the correct frontage for all formations except cavalry march column.

PDF link

8 bases per infantry unit? Here I was trying to get away from large numbers of figures per unit

"Just when I thought I was out… they pull me back in"

I think I can make this work. I want a generic basing system that will work for Napoleon's Battles (and Napoleon's Bricoles), Shako, and now looking for Lasalle and Black powder compatibility.

For the first two I can easily get away with 3 or 4 base units for infantry. I want to have more for Lasalle and Black powder.

So lets say I paint an army which works for Lasalle and Black powder, but has extra command bases. That way I can make smaller units when I need them. I can even paint multiple units which have the same facing color. Of course for French line that isn't an issue anyway. I can number units in pairs, so that it is clear which "brigade" together in the big games.

Thanks for the help. Will ponder.

You can use fewer bases for BP if you also scale down the move
distances.
The rules assume 30 (ish) infantry per unit.
So if you have 12 or 16, units are halfd the forntage – so halve all movemement and ranges (6" move for infantry instead of 12") and play on a smaller table.

Are there any mention of how many companies a battalion has in BP and is the British "extended line" catered for? Oh and is it any good for Naps???

BP doesn't treat a battalion as anything but a battalion. There is no thought to companies. When a battalion forms 'mixed formation' and puts out skirmishers, a third of all stands are placed in skirmish mode in front of the battalion.

Likewise, there is no direct difference between 2 or 3 rank formations or frontage.

If you want to make a battalion wider, make it a large battalion.

A third of all stands seems a lot to put out as skirmishers, or is that just light infantry battalions? Quite like the large and small units for ACW but not sure about Naps, I'm not sure about having some battalions of 4 bases and others of 6+ of the same troop type.
I know these rules cover a large period in history but I'm wondering if they may be like Piquet Field of Battle which work great for AWI, ACW, FPW but they don't seem to work for Napoleonic battles……..thoughts?

It is supposed to be a third but it functionally makes zero difference if you do less, since it is only to mark a different formation.

I'm personally basing my French up as 'companies' and I'm basing my voltigeurs for potential skirmish duty. My grenadiers won't be similarly based so it will just be 1/6th of my bases deployed when skirmishing.

They generally work just fine for light-weight Napoleonic battles. That said, I'm looking at doing central Waterloo next month and, when we get to the cavalry vs squares phase, I'm having a hard time seeing why, if the French knew the rulebook they were using, they'd have launched those numerous charges. I think I'll need to create a houserule to make it a reasoonable fight.

Thanks for the info Malcolm, I'm thinking of trying "The Sound of the Guns" rules from The Jackson Gamers ( only because I already have them ), another light-weight set that seems to use the same basing system with optional skirmishers. As with BP they will need tweeking but they seem to be a good quick play starting point!
Have you ever tried Big Battalions or In the Grand Manner? I'm an ex GdB player but found it toooo slooow!

Not I. I am shackled by a play-group that wants little to do with simulationist or 'realistic' rules.