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"Star Wars as an Icelandic Saga" Topic


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Wyatt the Odd Fezian12 Mar 2010 12:29 p.m. PST

A long time ago, in a North Atlantic far, far, away…

link

Wyatt

RavenscraftCybernetics12 Mar 2010 1:35 p.m. PST

Boy, You just cant make this stuff up!

NoLongerAMember12 Mar 2010 2:00 p.m. PST

Well Star Wars (the original first film) is just a sci-fi'ed western anyway.

lugal hdan12 Mar 2010 2:15 p.m. PST

That's a fun link. Makes me wish my Old Norse was better. I could just puzzle out the one or two lines of Old English.

Personal logo mmitchell Sponsoring Member of TMP12 Mar 2010 2:36 p.m. PST

The nice thing about Star Wars is that you can project MANY things on to it because it draws from so many archetypal sources. As for a Western… It has a Western feeling, but it's more like an old fantasy novel.

You've got the Pirate and the Princess, a Wizard who mentors a young farmboy (whose father turns out to be the evil Black Knight) and a pair of jesters.

SECURITY MINISTER CRITTER12 Mar 2010 3:08 p.m. PST

Wyatt you have a call on line two. A Kenny Klein, he wants his guitar and dress back.???????????????

Personal logo McKinstry Supporting Member of TMP Fezian12 Mar 2010 4:00 p.m. PST

You'd have to have at least one character named Snorri Vaderrson and ideally, he'd solve all problems by hitting them with a lightsaber.

Daffy Doug12 Mar 2010 4:26 p.m. PST

Star Wars is unoriginal in every aspect except (for the time) special effects. I liked the story anyway. I like the Icelandic Sagas too (even though wading through all those alike sounding/looking names is confusing as heck)….

Richard196712 Mar 2010 4:44 p.m. PST

Sklar Vars

Hrothgar Berserk12 Mar 2010 4:59 p.m. PST

I prefer the Norse Sagas to Star Wars, but I do concur with Doom…. that the long drawn out lines of geneaology and lots of guys with slightly different names gets confusing.

Anyhow, Star Wars was inspired by 'The Hidden Fortress'-a Kurasawa film.

Wyatt the Odd Fezian12 Mar 2010 7:39 p.m. PST

Lucas borrowed a lot from Greek mythology, the Arthurian legends and other sources. Part of what made it so good was that certain mythological tropes still resonate after 3,000 years. The other part, of course, was the universe he developed to package those themes in a way that hadn't been seen before. If you look at the original script, it's even more blatant. Thank the Force that he re-wrote a fair chunk before filming began.

I suggest reading Joseph Campbell's "The Hero with a Thousand Faces." link Lucas did consult with him while writing Star Wars – and Campbell quipped after seeing the movie that Lucas was his best student.

Wyatt

Cog Comp12 Mar 2010 11:37 p.m. PST

Well, Duh! Did no one read Man, Myth and Magic by Joseph Campbell?

Westerns are just a modernized version of old heroic sagas. The Icelandic Sagas were some of the original heroic tales, along with other ancient myths for that matter, but the Norse and Icelandic Sagas are probably the best known for high drama and tragedy, and for memorable heroes and villains. The Greek would be equally well known of course, at least in the western world.

Of course the Eastern Myths are just as moving and dramatic in their context, it's just that Star Wars was not based upon an Eastern Myth. It was based upon good old Western Heroic Opera: The Greek Opera, The Romantic Hero and Troubadour, The Baroque Cycle, the Enlightenment Epics, and the modern Horse and Space Opera.

OH! DUH! Stupid me… Wyatt the Odd has already commented upon Campbell… Way to go Wyatt, Campbell was a genius of mythology and religious history.

BTW, other students of Campbell's (aside from myself: 1983 at an exchange program from Texas to England where he was a guest lecturer for three weeks) have been Larry Marder (Tales of the Beanworld) and I believe that Greg Stafford was acquainted as well. Marder's work with Beanworld can be said to parallel much of Star Wars as well, as a young hero comes to terms with his journey outside of his comfortable little world into the great-big outside of everything.

Which is pretty much what Luke does… He leaves his comfortable little world when he recieves the "Call to Adventure" in the form of a talking Oscar statue and a bleeping vacuum cleaner, which lead him to the venerable sage, who bestows upon him a boon, which leads to the confrontation with the horrible devouring father figure whom Luke must eventually conquer, only Lucas gives us an excellent twist and throws in the Emperor as the father of the father (Uranus or Saturn to the Jupiter or Zeus of Vader) which it turns out that Luke must really defeat in order to free his father's true form, which has been devoured by the elder father figure in order to enslave him to his will… Which was what Luke was trying to do as well.

Also, if you will recall in the Fifth episode (the Empire Strikes back). Vader's plea to Luke to join him to overthrow the Emperor was a genuine and hopeful call for help, and had Luke Chosen to join Vader, he could have achieved his ends much faster, and without much of the deception by Yoda and Kenobi. remeber, Luke's job was to bring balance to the force. To Unite the Dark and Light side, and Vader knew this, probably more than anything, and realized that if he could get Luke to join him, that he could thwart the Emperor's plan to remove Vader and have Luke take his place (which Vader probably knew at the cloud city, yet pushed out of his mind, or tried to deny it, as it turned out that Anakin had the immaturity of doing just this: Denying the obvious)….

Anyway, enough of my rant… Star Wars is a marvellous set of movies and I cannot wait for Lucas to die or move on so that they all can be re-imagined.

Destruction, Purifying, Creation, Flowering, Vitality, Decay, Death, and Destruction, only to do it all over again… That is the cycle of things.

Cog Comp12 Mar 2010 11:39 p.m. PST

Oh, and as far as The Hidden Fortress Goes that is just another in a long line of heroic opera. It just happens to be based upon an Eastern Epic that was itself based upon Western Epics (at least the 50s version)

Patrick R13 Mar 2010 4:17 a.m. PST

Don't forget that Star Wars came after a period of particularly bleak and invariably apocalyptic dystopian SF movies. If we weren't going to be eaten as Soylent Green, mutant ants or the Carrousel would do us in at 30.

He dropped the ball once people started to call him Mr Lucas rather than George. And there was nobody to say "You're talking Bleeped text again George."

Personal logo enfant perdus Supporting Member of TMP13 Mar 2010 2:27 p.m. PST

Brilliantly done. Part of my misspent youth involved dead Germanic languages, including Old Norse, and this rings so close to true it's giving me flashbacks.

wminsing13 Mar 2010 3:25 p.m. PST

Loved it! Funny and smart on multiple levels.

-Will

Reader Name 00115 Mar 2010 4:57 a.m. PST

ha! cool ink, thanks

Jeremy Sutcliffe18 Mar 2010 1:49 a.m. PST

Just a couple of weeks early.

On the right date it would be on a par with the great Guardian spoofs like the island of San Serif or the famous panorama one about spaghetti trees.

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