"Were Nazi daggers any good as daggers?" Topic

In other words, were they functional and well designed, or were they just ostentatious decorative junk?

I did not post this in "Rules", because as far as I know, there are no rules that deal specifically with this vital question.

I don't have any hard data to hand, but anecdotal evidence suggests they did not perform all that well against T-34s.

I dunno John. But they sure made great souvenirs.

See the Osprey Warrior, "Dagger Aces of the SS".

Allen

I have one, it is of very high grade Carbon Steel, almost certainly Swedish in origin (Grandfather acquired one from an SS officer who had "no further conceivable need" for it in WWII).

Here are some pictures, John: link

They sure look dangerous enough (;-)). Incidentally, not only the Nazis (SA, SS) had them, also the regular forces (army, navy, airforce). Since at least the SA definitely used their weapons during the streetfights in the twenties, there is no reason to assume that those daggers were just decorative junk. The pictures do show businesslike weapons…

The one my grandpap gave me seems to be made of very fine steel(has kept a good edge since the war and no rust)and it fits well in the hand. He used it as a gutting knife for years. He swopped one of 5 Jap swords for it when he came home from Burma after the war. He also had his very field customized 30cal MG. but that is another story.

As with everything else German, they were sharper and more deadly than any other daggers in existence. Unfortunately, German manufacturing techniques meant that only 253 were completed before the end of the war.

Plans for the jet-propelled Blitz-Dagger had to be dropped with the ending of the war, but the scientists involved were all spirited away by the Russians and Americans to help jump-start their own Strategic Dagger forces.

ROFLMAO Mserafin!

I would say that by the time of WWII, a dagger was pretty pointless piece of hardware on the battlefield.

Since a knife would be primarily used as a utility tool, it would have been much preferable to pack a one that had been designed with such usage as a primary usage in mind. And if you get into the unlikely situation where you actually need to stab somebody with a knife, the utility-style knife is still good enough.

Rules-wise, I would treat those fancy daggers the same as any other knife.

"Incidentally, not only the Nazis (SA, SS) had them, also the regular forces (army, navy, airforce)."

Heck, even the German foreign service and Red Cross welfare officers had daggers. Makes you wonder who *didn't* have one by the time GIs were picking up souvenirs:

link

"Gee, grampa, is that an SS dagger?"

"No, kid, all I could get my hands on was a waterfront customs officer's."

Allen

Probably just about every organization in the Third Reich had some form of its own dagger or sword.

Wow, I had no idea that social workers got their own daggers too. Sort of makes housecall check-ups a bit more tension filled, I'd say.

And is it just me, or do the red cross knifes look like they could spread butter, paddle naughty children (or otehrs), as well as collect a liver or two?

Social Welfae Officer daggers???
link

EDIT. It seems I am not the only one to catch that…

Mserafin I can assure you that the US Air Force and Convair screwed up the design of the Dagger all by themselves German assistance was not required.

Fatman

A friend of mine had a Kriegsmarine dagger, a 2nd pattern according to the gallery Allen linked.

As others have remarked, the blade was very high quality. The thing as a whole, however, didn't seem to be very robust. One good stab and you'd be left with only the hilt, while the pommel rolled under the refrigerator and your foeman ran away with the blade still in his back. If called on to repel borders, a more sensible choice of weapon would be a sack of onions, or possibly a hard bound copy of Mein Kampf.

Mserafin, you are right, German daggers were sharper and deadlier than any other daggers anywhere ever, but there main drawback was unfortunately, the lack of field sharpening facilities meant that many had to be taken to the rear to be serviced…

how exactly did they service their daggers at their rears….on second thoughts, I'd rather NOT know

Try taking one on a plane and claiming its harmless

I guess as a follow-up question to the OFM's original question is: Which set of rules are you using where the type of dagger used is an issue?

Looking at the bizarre contraptions some WW1 trench raiders armed themselves with, maybe a dagger would be quite useful in some situations. Never mind a bag of grenades and a sharpened entrenching tool, all you need is a Luger, a dagger and a monacle…

IRL I thought the main combat function of daggers was the same as that of pistols – to provide souvenirs for the enemy.

When manufacturing daggers, it is hard to imagine why the ever thorough German military-industrial complex would not produce high quality ones.

The plucky British tommy just had a jack knife.

Keep your fancy dancy daggers, i'll take a Fairbairn-Sykes; a real fighting knife.

When manufacturing daggers, it is hard to imagine why the ever thorough German military-industrial complex would not produce high quality ones.

However, in the late war they might have also designed producing Volksturm-versions with a more economical design…

I used to have several of them.
The naval dirk type ones- like Kriegsmarine,Luftwaffe, etc- were nice but impractical- especially with all the belts and tassels, SS/SA were really impractical- due to handle design, best one- the HU knife… Well made, but towards the end there they were cutting corners.

I'm pretty sure that Sven Hassel mentions in one of his autobiographies how he wiped out an entire company of Stalin tanks using only his dagger. While wounded.

'taken to the rear to be serviced…'
That opens up a world of possibilities….

no doubt they were very handy for the sausages and bratwurst…..

Youse guys are nuts.

how many more tanks could the Germans made if they didn't make all of those daggers?

At least one. Maybe two!

"Volksturm-versions"

Ah yes, the oft-ignored 1945 Volks-dagger.

Made from bakelite.

They would be pretty useful on the battlefield when they decided to infiltrate into enemy lines at night, crawing into your slit trench or tent issuing silent death.

Look, Gary Gygax had a fetish for polearms. That's much worse, AFAIAC.

Think about it.

Polearms.

Hurr hurr.

Roger Hall writes about accepting the surrender of a German unit in Norway at the end of the war. The German officer presented Hall with his dagger, Hall looked around at all the Norwegian civilians who'd suffered through years of the occupation, put the dagger on the ground, and stamped on it with his paratroop boot, snapping the blade in two.
Grelber

If you are close enough to stick em you are close enough to shoot em, so shoot em.

At that range anything sharp will do, it doesn't have to be made out of fine steel to open a can of food, just use your P38.