"Italian Armour In Russia - Semovente Markings?" Topic

Against my better judgement I find myself looking at this, partly for my own (bare metal but it might get painted one day….) Italian army, and partly with a view to running up a decal sheet. I'm pretty happy that I've got the L6/40s sorted (although I can't reconcile different sources saying that an L6 company was 4x6 or 5x5 platoons…. I know BF have gone with 6, but information on markings, together with 26-tank companies, would both support 5x5 imo – the odd marking scheme definitely seems to have been done to accomodate a 5th platoon.)

Anywaaaay, getting to the point…. I'm fairly sure I've got the LXVII battalion nailed, including the oddities of their markings, thanks to some excellent Italian sites and a precious few photos. On the XIII's Semoventes, however, I'm completely at a loss…. From the usual numbers quoted (19 vehicles in two companies) I'm presuming that their organisation must've been 2 platoons of 4 to a company, plus single vehicle CHQs and BHQ, (although some sources suggest a single squadron of three sixes and a single HQ vehicle….)

Either way, does anyone have any info on their markings – the only photo I can find that seems to be in Russia shows nothing other than the registration plate, which may well be correct, but obviously seems rather a thin "set" of references to go from….

Probably the one that you have is not the one here, not that it's any help regarding markings:

link

I think you're doing well; better than most of the "experts", as you have them accounted for, at least!

Allen

Dom,
before I start scanning do you have the Squadron Signal book on Italian armour (No.6089)?

Andrew

Unfortunately, Pignato is of no help for Semoventi da 47/32s in Russia.

Allen

Allen,
I stand corrected, only a few L6/40 images in that book I mentioned.

Dom there is another book that is useful, I thought I had a .pdf copy but can't locate it :-(
It does have numerous images of the Italian AFV's, worth getting if you can.

Military Chronicle's "On flanks of Stalingrad. Operations near Don-river. 17 June 1942 – 2 February 1943"

Can be found here: link

Rgs
Andrew

Thanks chaps. That book looks good, but way too rich for a speculative buy. The L6/40 drawing on the cover's great though Andrew, as it appears to confirm that I've got the L6 markings nailed, as well as giving me the battalion commander's registration number…. :-)

As for your link Allen, actually that's really rather a lot of help, as it pretty clearly indicates that they didn't use tank-style rectangle markings, which at least the odd Semovente da 47 unit did….

(The one shot I have is nearly head-on, so between the two it's pretty clear that " all" may well be the correct number of markings – a rear hull shot would be nice, but the glacis and especially sides are both more usual spots, so if they're both bare it becomes a reasonable guess….)

So to summarise – thanks a lot gents, actually quite a lot of help….

Dom :-)

(Currently trying to resist the temptation to drop "Italian Eastern Front AFVs" in favour of calling it the "ARMIR Armour" sheet….)

Catchy!

What can I say, I have a weakness for alliteration….

LOL I was up late for some reason this morning Dom. I looked all around to see what I could find. Squadron Signal 6089 by Pignato and Tank Power Vol. XXIX Mussolini's Tanks for example. With no luck of course :(. Robert

Thanks for looking anyway – I'm reasonably happy that I've got it now. Just need to actually design the decals now; details….

No Prob LOL. It was almost 2 am here and it make me have to think on what references I had and to glance through the ones I could remember LOL. Robert

Wow, Andy's emailed me some scans, and I'm right back to square one…. ;-) Three photos of Semoventes, all most definitely 100% in Russia (two of them have snow and Russians, and the third's a captured vehicle on display in Moscow….) Given the discrepancies I'm now inclined to think that the photos Allen and I had come up with are mis-attributed and maybe Tunisia or elsewhere….

1. They *do* have tank-style platoon markings on sides and rear, but not individual numbers.

2. One is photographed in close proximity to two L6s, and looks much darker in colour than them….

Hmm, food for thought….

Dom.

That's good! (Justifies my already having plastered one of my two platoons of them with I-95 transfers already, anyway…)

Allen

Is your email still the gte.net one? Let me know and I'll email you the piccies.

As Arte Johnson used to say, "Very interesting."

Allen

Dom, are you doing this in 15 or 28 mm scale?

15 – can't see there being much call for it in 28mm. (Actually I'm not sure that I've ever even seen the *vehicles* in 28mm, which would definitely limit the demand….)

Dom,
how about 1/72 -1/76 scale, should be demand for that ;-)
Is it simply a case of scaling up the images and printing out?

Regards
Andrew

No – my print process gets best results from raster graphics, not vector (for tedious reasons to do with aligning colour layers and building in overlap to allow for imperfections) – the end result is that it's "scaling up" to give the general form, followed by tedious pixel-by-pixel editing of outlines etc to get the best printout possible…. I am contemplating trying a few 20mm sheets at some point to see if there's interest, but the starting point won't be anything as obscure as this….

(Actually I'm not sure that I've ever even seen the *vehicles* in 28mm, which would definitely limit the demand….)

i'm reaally lousy at remembering what italian vehicles are called but didn't crouchie cover them pretty well (along with FoA) in 28 :)

I'm not sure – I thought he may have done the Semovente, but if so it's OOP at the moment, as I don't see it on JTFM's site. FoA just do Lancias.

Scratch that – just found them on Company B's site. Of course that makes a 28mm sheet a definite "no" from me for obvious reasons….