"Looking for unusual scenarios" Topic

Most people think of the IJNAF Zero being used in the Philippines in 1941-42 but the IJAAF Nakajima Ki-27 "Nate" was used also. One of the last few combat encounters of the AAC's P-40's was one between 2nd Lt. Earl Stone and Sgt. Toshishada Kurusawa who both died in the dogfight on February 9, 1942. Robert

"The particular battle Feb 9 was 4 P-40's covering the recon mission by the Philippine pilot Jesus Villamor flying a PT-13 biplane trying to photograph Japanese artillery sites firing on Corregidor. 6 Type 97's attacked. One P-40 was missing, another shot up and landed at another base returning to Bataan later. One Type 97 was missing, another force landed at a forward field on Bataan and was desrtroyed there by US artillery. The Japanese claimed 5, the US pilots actually didn't make any specific claims but US public announcements at the time credited them with 6. The famous Japanese ace (famous overclaimer among Japanese aces, actually) Satoshi Anabuki claimed 2 victories in this combat."

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This is a good example of a pilots skill vs time in an aircraft. Major Adriano Visconti flying a Macchi C.202. Robert

" On 13 August 1942 while flying with a wingman in a formation of two C.202s on a reconnaissance flight over Malta looking for a shipping convoy, the Italian aircraft were bounced by four Supermarine Spitfire escorting the ships. Visconti, only flying the Macchi for the second time, was able to shoot down two Spitfires and damage the other two, allowing the other Macchi to complete the reconnaissance mission."

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A list from a friend of mine,

Credits awarded in various squadrons for destruction in air-to-air action of multi-engined enemy aircraft (131 Japanese, 7 German) by USN multi-engined types:

Consolidated PB2Y (Coronado)
1 Kawanishi H6K, Type 97 (Mavis)
5 Mitsubishi G4M, Type 01 (Betty)

Consolidated PB4Y (Liberator/Privateer)
13 Douglas DC-2 (Tess)
6 Kawanishi H6K, Type 97 (Mavis)
10 Kawanishi H8K, Type 2 (Emily)
2 Kawasaki Ki-45, Type 2 (Nick)
1 Kyushu Q1W, (Lorna)
11 Mitsubishi G3M, Type 96 (Nell)
46 Mitsubishi G4M, Type 01 (Betty)
2 Mitsubishi Ki-21, Type 97 (Sally)
5 Mitsubishi Ki-46, Type 100 (Dinah)
14 Mitsubishi Ki-57, Type 0 (Topsy)
1 Nakajima Ki-49, Type 100 (Helen)
6 Nakajima L2D, Type 0 (Tabby)
1 Yokosuka P1Y (Frances)
1 Dornier Do-217
2 Heinkel He-177
3 Junkers Ju-88C

Consolidated PBY (Catalina)
1 Kawanishi H6K, Type 97 (Mavis)
1 Junkers Ju-88C

Lockheed PV (Ventura/Harpoon)
1 Lockheed Type 14 (Toby)
5 Mitsubishi G4M Type 01 (Betty)

The Ar-196s from the Tirpitz attacked 2 FAA Albacore that was shadowing it with no kill from either the Germans or the British in 1942. Robert

Found this interesting answer to the question,
" Q. Which RAF night figher scored the first British intruder victory of the war?"

"A. Blenhiem MKIF. In the early hours of June 18, 1940, a Blenhiem intruder, flown by Pilot Officer Alastair Hunter, shot down a He 115 floatplane near Calais, France, giving the RAF intruders their first victory. Later, when anxious members of his wing asked him how he found the German aircraft, Hunter told them the curtious pilot had been flying with his navigation lights on!"

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Robert

Would anyone have any information on the operations and encounters of Nachtjagdgeschwader 1 and RAF night fighters over Malta mentioned on the Fun Trivia site? Robert

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Night intruder mission where Flight Lieutenant Karel Kuttelwascher while flying a Hurri shot down 3 Luftwaffe aircraft over France on the night of 4/5 May 1942 without the benefit of radar.
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Robert

Night intruder mission where Flight Lieutenant Karel Kuttelwascher while flying a Hurri shot down 3 Luftwaffe aircraft over France on the night of 4/5 May 1942 without the benefit of radar.
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Robert

"Gladiators of the Norwegian Jagevingen3 at Fornebu Airport, consisting of seven operational biplanes, managed to shoot down a total of five German aircraft on 9 April, 1940. The Jagevingen claimed two Messerschmitt Bf-110 fighters, two Heinkel He-111 heavy bombers and a Junkers Ju-52 transport plane, with only one Gladiator being shot down. Two were destroyed on the ground when refuelling and rearming at Fornebu while the four remaining aircraft were ordered to land wherever they could, just not at Fornebu. The Gladiators scattered, landing on frozen lakes around Oslo, never returning to active duty:

There were plenty of targets, but at the same time I was forced to manoeuvre to not get an enemy behind me. Suddenly I saw a German. I cut back the throttle, made a half-roll and dived straight down on him. I opened fire at a good shooting distance and kept him in my aim until only 50 metres separated us. Then he rolled over and disappeared downwards in a spin.
-Sergeant Kristian Fredrik Schye, April 1940"

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"This aircraft starting its engines over a dispersal covered by pierced steel planking at Sterparone, Foggia Airfield Complex, Southern Italy, is the Boeing B-17G-50-DL Serial Number 6405 "Big Yank" of the 5th Wing's 483rd Bomb Group, 15th Air Force, An airplane which has an interesting history because its crew was officially credited with three Me-262 jet fighter down and another probable (record of most German jets destroyed by a single crew for the entire war) during a long mission of the 483rd Group over Berlin March 24, 1945, target the Daimler-Benz Tank Works. Tail Gunner Lincoln Broyhill recalled: «I saw four jets attacking a lone B-17 from another group. The B-17 knocked down one of the enemy fighters before it flew in a crippled manner towards the Russian lines. The remaining three fighters came at our plane. Two of them came right behind each other at my position. They were about 1000 yards away when I started cutting loose with my guns. The first (Me 262) made a pass at 200 yards and my tracers were going right into its fuselage. Suddenly it went down in flames. The second came into my sights after the first had dropped. I kept shooting away because he was getting into my hair. Suddenly, it also spiraled down. Upon hitting the ground, it burst into flames. Because I had my guns spitting lead so rapidly, they jammed». Ball-turret Gunner Cecil Shellabarger recalled: «I began shooting at the third enemy plane when it was about 800 yards away and when he came within 100 yards of our tail, he peeled off. He seemed to stand on end when all at once, he fell off on his left wing. I shot at him again and hit him between the wing and fueslage. He went down into a straight dive and about 4,000 feet from the ground, it disintegrated» (from "Big Yank"-The William S. Strapko Crew -http://www.warbirdsresourcegroup.org/URG/bigyank.html). Note on the nose a portrait of the US President Franklin Delano Roosevelt painted by Mario Rucci, an Italian artist. Named "Big Yank" by Crew Chief Irvin "Irv" Davis, the aircraft completed 50 combat missions from its base in Apulia with various crews and was subsequently selected as an Air-Sea Rescue plane and was used at least once in this role to drop a boat to a downed American fighter pilot in the Adriatic Sea. The plane survived to war and after VE-Day, May 1945, the "Big Yank" was converted for passenger use with the so-called "Homebound Airlines", part of the "Green Project " which utilized former combat aircraft returning to the USA to transport returning servicemen as well. As the 483rd BG was deactivated at Pisa, Italy, in September 1945, "Big Yank was returned to the USA and its last flight was to Walnut Ridge, Arkansas on December 28, 1945. After this date was scrapped. Victor Sierra "

China 4/11/39
"Two large formations of G3M's were intercepted near Chengdu by 7 Dewoitine D510cs from the 17th FS and 7 I-15's from the 27th FS. Captain Shen Tse-Liu led the Dewoitines. The I-15's having a height advantage attacked the Japanese formation first and carried out several passes. It was then the turn of the D510cs. Experience had shown that in a dive the cannon armament had a tendency to jam. This was caused by the spring tension in the ammunition drum being insufficient to feed the gun. Capt Shen was able to carry out a successful head on attack on the G3M flown by Captain Okuda, CO of the 13th Ku. Shen achieved numerous hits on the right wing root. The wing root was set on fire and the aircraft nosed over into a dive, resulting in both wings snapping off. Shen and his fellow pilots then turned around for another pass. Coming in from the rear they met a hail of return fire from the rear gunners. The return fire hit two aircraft; P-5921, flown by Shen Tse-Liu, received hits in the engine causing him to force land where he was injured in the process. P-5924, flown by Lt Chen Kwei-min, suffered hits in the fuel tank, but was able to land safely."

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And another chance for combat,

"25/10/39
During a morning raid by Japanese G3M bombers a mixed force of 13 Chinese fighters rose to intercept. Among them were two D510cs of the 17th FS. An hour later at 1157hrs a further force of eleven fighters, including three more D510cs, although two developed engine trouble, were made ready to intercept. No interception was made due to the bombers avoiding combat."

Just a little out of the time frame but there could be some interesting scenarios played out between the Nationalist Chinese and PLAAF shortly after WWII. From what I have read so far there were at least 11 engagements between them. Both sides used ex-IJAF and IJNAF aircraft along with the Nationalists using US aircraft that were supplied to them by the US during and Postwar. The Nationalists used P-47s , P-51s, B-25s and B-24s.The PLAAF also used some captured P-51s,Kawasaki Ki.45, Mitsubishi Ki. 30, Ki.46, Ki.51 and Tachikawa Ki.55s.Both sides also used Oscars,Franks and Tojos.

"But the Communist forces, known before 1949 as the Chinese Democratic Alliance Forces, had liberated a wing of late model Hayabusas at Shenyang, Liaoning Province in their occupation of the Northeast in 1945-47. Their air force experience began at that time under the guidance of a captured Major Kobayashi who set up a training school for pilots and technicians that became the Red forces' first aeronautical institute. They also received some of the assets of Manpi, Manchukoku Air Industries, and Japanese-built Jungmann trainers, which Soviet forces left for them. When the Chinese Civil War ignited in 1947 Kobayashi's personnel and the new Red Chinese Air Unit, mostly Oscars and Franks, saw some action and were almost used in the big push to cross the Yangzi River that finally defeated the Nanjing Central Government of Generalissimo Jiang Zhongzheng on the mainland"

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KI-44

"The end of the war did not see the end of service for the Ki.44. The Nationalist Chinese 18th Squadron of the 12th Fighter Group equipped with Ki-44s formerly of the 9th Sentai, which had disbanded in Nanking, and of the 29th Sentai, which had surrendered on Formosa, and these Shokis were used during the Chinese Civil War. Additionally, The People's Liberation Army Air Force was given aircraft from the 22nd and 85th Sentais, who had surrendered to the Russians in Korea. The Ki.44s were flown by the Nationalist Air Force until the last two were finally retired in the early 1950s."

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Robert

Not air to air but there were some Hawker Hectors flew along side Lysanders,

"613 Squadron used theirs to attack German troops advancing through northern France in May 1940. One aircraft was damaged near Calais and crashed near Dover, before the squadron was withdrawn from action."

and
"during the Dunkirk evacuation, they continued to fly supply-dropping missions to Allied forces from bases in England; on one mission to drop supplies to troops trapped at Calais, 14 of 16 Lysanders and Hawker Hectors that set out were lost. "

Robert

Again out of the time frame there were a few engagements between ROCAF P-47Ds and PLAAF MiG-15s and La-11s in Mar 1954. The ROCAF claimed at lest one Mig downed while the Migs and La-11s claimed at least 2. Robert

Thought I would repost the little Luftwaffe vs Luftwaffe air war of 1940. Do-17s,He-111s,Me-109sand Me-110s vs Me-109s and Ms.406s. Robert

"On May 10, 1940 air combat between Switzerland and Germany was initiated. Several Swiss Bf 109s engaged a German Dornier Do 17 near the border at Bitschwil; in the ensuing exchange of fire, the Dornier was hit and eventually forced to land near Altenrhein. The scene was repeated on May 16 when a German He 111 returned from France by way of Swiss airspace. Two Swiss fighters jumped the light bomber when it dropped down below cloud cover to de-ice its wings. The German aircraft was hit by machine gun fire and was further damaged by anti-aircraft fire near Zurich. Two injured flyers parachuted; the other two crew members went down with the plane and were captured.

On June 8 a C-35 observation plane, a relic biplane, was attacked over the Jura Mountains by two German Bf 110s. The pilot and observer were killed. Later on the same day, Swiss Captain Lindecker led about fifteen Swiss fighters against twenty-eight German planes. The Swiss pilots again displayed their ability in air to air combat, knocking three of the German planes from the sky and severely wounding the crew in a fourth. A Swiss Bf 109 was hit and damaged in the dogfight.

German reconnaissance aircraft, equipped with cameras, flying over the fortified Northern frontier of Switzerland, were driven away by anti-aircraft fire. On 1 June, 36 German bombers entered Swiss air space and were attacked by Swiss ME-109's. Two HE-111 bombers were shot down. The next day another HE-111 was shot down by a Swiss fighter. On 4 June, as the British army was being evacuated from Dunkirk, the Swiss Air Force was engaged in an intensive dog-fight with 29 German planes. Both Luftwaffe and Swiss planes were shot down. One German aircraft had the following order on board: "Lure the Swiss fighters into battle and shoot down as many as possible." On 8 June, it was David against Goliath again – 15 Swiss aircraft engaged 28 Luftwaffe planes, resulting in the downing of 2 Swiss and 3 German aircraft."

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2Apr 1950. In the first Chinese Mig-15 engagement the Chinese Migs shoot down 2 ROCAF F-51Ds. Robert

"Battle over Lampang: On November 11, 1944, nine P-51 Mustangs and seven P-38 Lightnings attacked Lampang. The RTAF sent five Ki-27 Ota fighters to intercept. Although they fought courageously, all five Thai fighters were shot down."
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Might be a fun little escort scenario,

"The first Pe-3s were issued to the 95th High-Speed Bomber Aviation Regiment in August 1941 and it was initially committed to the ground attack and escort roles after retraining through September. It was redesignated as the 95th Fighter Aviation Regiment on 25 September and assigned to the 6th Fighter Aviation Corps of the PVO defending Moscow. A few days later six Pe-3s escorted C-47s carrying a British military delegation flying from Vologda to Moscow and defeated several German attacks on the transports."

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"Air battle over Ban Yang. During the Indochina conflict (1940-1941) Flight Lieutenant Chalermkiat Wattanangkoon led a flight of three Hawk IIs to reconnoiter the border. At Ban Yang near Aranyaprathet, the flight met an enemy Potez 25 reconnaissance biplane escorted by two Morane M.S.406 fighters, which they intercepted. Flight Lieutenant Chalermkiat shot down the Potez."
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This thread is so massive, that I'm not sure if this flight was mentioned before.

Escape from Penemunde Prison camp:

….At noon of 8 February 1945, as the ten Soviet POWs, including Devyataev, were at work on the runway, one of the work gang, Ivan Krivonogov picked up a crowbar and killed their guard. Another prisoner, Peter Kutergun, quickly stripped off the guard's uniform and slipped it on. The work gang, led by the "guard", managed to unobtrusively take over the camp commandant's He 111 H22 bomber and fly from the island. Devyataev piloted the aircraft. The Germans tried to intercept the bomber but without success. The aircraft was damaged by the Soviet air defences but managed to land in Soviet-held territory.

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I've seen the story before but not here on TMP that I remember. Robert

"The first two months at Böblingen were spent with organization, staffing and training. During this period, the unit also conducted patrols against intruding French recce aircraft. During an everung patrol over the Karlsruhe area on September 8th, a pair of Bf-109Ds from II./JG 52 intercepted and shot down a French Mureaux 115 from GAO 553. Fw. (Lt.?) Paul Gutbrod was awarded the victory claim, which was recognized as the first German kill of WW II on the Western Front."

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"Air combat between Thai and Japanese fighters. On December 8, 1941 the Japanese sent 25 Otsu fighters to attack Wattana Nakhorn Airbase in Prachinburi Province. The RTAF sent up three Hawk IIIs to intercept the Japanese, but were no match for them. All three Thai planes were shot down and their pilots killed. (Young's version: ‘At the airfield at Aranyaprathet, the pilots of Fighter Squadron 43, from Wing 4, awoke to the sound of Japanese aircraft flying overhead. Three pilots, Flight Lieutenants Chai Soonthornsing and Chin Jiramanimai and Pilot Officer Sanit Pothivaekoon, ignored the pleas of their fellow officers and took off in their Hawk IIIs to engage the Japanese. The three pilots attacked the Japanese formation, but the more capable Ki-27s quickly shot them down, with Major Hirose claiming one Thai airplane. All three Thai pilots were killed.')"
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"At outbreak of the Spanish Civil War Chiodi was embedded as fighter pilot in the 23td Gruppo, the famous "Asso di Bastoni" unit (Ace of Clubs), performing 53 war missions flying with the Fiat CR.32. Afterwards Chiodi returned to Caproni but, just after the Italy's entry in the WW2, was enlisted as volunteer in the Regia Aeronautica and posted again to 23nd Gruppo, at this time a 3st Stormo'unit, based at Turin-Mirafiori and equipped with Fiat CR.42. During the summer 1940 the 23rd Gruppo was transferred in Sicily, at Comiso airfield, for escort of the bombers raiding Malta. And here Antonio Chiodi meet his fate. On 31 July 1940, during the escort to S.79s bomber, the Chiodi's CR.42 was attacked and, after a brief clash, down by a British fighter Sea Gladiator. Antonio Chiodi disappeared on the sea with his airplane and his corpse was never salvaged. "
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Anglo-Iraqi War
"During the fighting, the sole Gladiator-on-Gladiator kill occurred on 5 May, when Plt. Off. Watson of the Fighter Flight shot down an Iraqi Gladiator over Baqubah during a bomber escort mission. The Iraqi Gladiators' only claim during the war was a Vickers Wellington bomber shared with ground fire on 4 May.[67]"

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"Immediately after launching his coup against King Faisal II in early April 1941, Prime Minister Rashid Ali al-Gaylani approached Germany and Italy for help in repelling any British counter-measures. In response, the Germans assembled a Luftwaffe task force under Iraqi colours called Fliegerführer Irak ("Flyer Command Iraq") which from 14 May operated out of Mosul.[68] Before this force collapsed due to lack of supplies, replacements, quality fuel and aggressive RAF attacks, two Gladiators fought a pair of Me 110s over Rashid Airfield at Baghdad on 17 May. Both German machines were swiftly shot down"

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"The Gloster Gladiator had its combat début on 24 February 1938.[11] That day, in the Nanking area, Chinese-American Capt John Wong Sun-Shui (nicknamed 'Buffalo') shot down an A5M Claude navy fighter, Gladiator's first victim. Wong is believed to have shot down a second A5M, for the wrecks of two Japanese fighters were found.[11] During that clash, Chinese Gladiators lost two of their number.[12] Chinese Gladiators scored several more victories over Japanese aircraft between 1938 and 1940 during the Second Sino-Japanese War. In China Gladiators were used extensively before the start of 1940 by the 28th, 29th and 32nd Squadrons of the 3rd Group. The Chinese aviators considered the Gladiator an excellent fighter in its class. But pilots flying the Gloster fighter were soon finding it increasingly difficult to hold their own against the modern A5M, and because of a lack of spares due to arms embargo, the surviving Gladiators were mostly relegated to the training role.[13] Then, when newer Japanese aircraft such as the Mitsubishi A6M entered the theatre, the Gladiators' days were numbered. American-born Chinese pilot John "Buffalo" Wong, the first Gladiator flying ace and first American fighter ace of the Second World War, was eventually shot down in a combat with A6M Zeros on 14 March 1941 and died two days later from the injuries.[14] He and Arthur Chin were among a group of 15 Chinese Americans who formed the original group of American volunteer combat aviators resisting Japanese aggression in China.[15]"
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Not if this true or not,
"Boeing also produced export versions of the aircraft; 1 was sold to Spain and 11 were sold to China in the mid-1930s. The aircraft purchased by Spain was the first P-26 Peashooter fighter to see combat, but it was shot down in 1936 during the Spanish Civil War without seeing any success."

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"VT(N)-90, also operating off USS Enterprise in TBM-3Es also accounted for 4-1-0. Confirmed as shot down were an H8K (Emily), an L2D (Tabby), and an A6M2-N (Rufe), and an unidentified aircraft. The lone probable was an N1K (George)."

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Hellcat night fighter Vs Rufe

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Some of the Japanese night fighters versus the B-29s might be fun. J2M3 Raidens and C6N1s for example. Robert

SBD kills,

"One pilot—Stanley "Swede" Vejtasa—was attacked by three A6M2 Zero fighters, he shot two of them down and cut off the wing of the third in a head-on pass with his wing tip"

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One night in 1944 P-61s were credited with 2 Irvings,1 Rufe and a Frank. Robert

Hungarian AF CR.42s Vs Soviet 1-16s on the Eastern Front 1941. Robert

Somthing out of the ordinary – the German Flettner Fl 282 helicopter. This from Wikipedia link no idea if true or not!

"Intended roles of Fl 282 included ferrying items between ships and reconnaissance. However, as the war progressed, the Luftwaffe began considering converting the Fl 282 for battlefield use. Until this time the craft had been flown by a single pilot, but now a position for an observer was added at the very rear of the craft, resulting in the B-2 version. During the Battle of the Bulge a formation of five of these aircraft conducted the world's first helicopter strike against armour. Operating low over the Ardennes Forest they destroyed two American tanks at a loss of two of their own, one to a British Spitfire, the other to groundfire. [4] Later the B-2 proved a useful artillery spotting aircraft and an observation unit was established in 1945 comprising three Fl 282 and three Fa 223 helicopters.[5]

Good handling in bad weather led the German Air Ministry to issue a contract in 1944 to BMW to produce 1,000 units. However, the company's Munich plant was destroyed by Allied bombing raids after producing just 24 machines.[6]

Towards the end of World War II most of the surviving Fl 282s were stationed at Rangsdorf, in their role as artillery spotters, but gradually fell victim to Soviet fighters and anti-aircraft fire."

So potential for Spitfire and 'generic Soviet fighter' encounters.

But what about the tank-hunting incident, considering no weapons were mounted how was it done? Panzerfaust perhaps?

PS: I'm quite dubious about the alleged tank-huntig incident, no confirmation on other websites – is this complete rubbish??

"One of the most unusual tales regarding the air war in the Far East during World War II concerns the operational use of Curtiss P-40 Warhawks by the Imperial Japanese Army Air Force (IJAAF)! According to research by noted Japanese military aviation historian Osamu TAGAYA;

"In total, the Japanese appear to have had as many as ten flyable P-40Es. For a brief period, during 1943, a few of them were actually used operationally by the 50th Hiko Sentai in the defense of Rangoon. Testimony to this fact is given by Yasuhiko Kuroe (64th Hiko Sentai) in his memoirs, in which he says one Japanese Warhawk shot down a friendly 'Sally' over Rangoon by mistake!"

However, Hawk victories over No.12 Hiko Sentai (FR) Mitsubishi Ki-21 Sally bombers in the skies above Rangoon, Burma began on 25 December 1941. On that date, twenty-seven Sally bombers attached to No.12 FR departed their home base at Don Muang Airfield, Bangkok Thailand (Siam) for a mission to bomb Rangoon and the nearby airfield at Mingaladon. Accompanying No.12 FR were thirty-six Sallys of No.60 FR along with an escort of twenty-five Nakajima Ki-43 Oscars belonging to No.64 FR.

After forming over Don Muang, the formation proceeded to Moulmein, Burma, changed course and approached Rangoon at an altitude of 6000 meters. With Rangoon in sight, the lead Sally of the No.12 FR under the command of Capt. KUSAKARI, suddenly turned away. A message from Capt. KUSAKARI indicated that his aircraft had some mechanical difficulty and the No.1 Hiko Chutaicho for No.12 FR, Capt. OURA, was to take the lead position. As the formation reorganized and proceeded to the primary target, the electric power facility at Rangoon, they were attacked by the defending force, British Brewster Buffaloes and Curtiss P-40Bs belonging to the 3rd Pursuit Squadron ("Hell's Angels") of the American Volunteer Group, "Flying Tigers."

At least three of the No.12 FR Sallys were lost. The first being that of Lt. Seizo HAYASHI. Two other Sallys made forced landings.

One crash-landed at Don Muang and the other, flown by Lt. Koichi MIYAWAKI, crashed in the mountains of Siam. Major Tateo KATO, leading the escort fighters of the No.64 Hiko Sentai, lost at least two of his pilots, Lt. Horoshi OKUMURA and Sgt. Shigekatsu WAKAYAMA."

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I believe there was an encounter by 2 parasol wing aircraft in Sept 1939 between a Polish PZL.11c and a Luftwaffe Hs-126. Robert

Westland Whirlwind vs AR-196.

"The Whirlwind's first confirmed kill occurred on 8 February 1941, when an Arado Ar 196 floatplane was shot down; the Whirlwind responsible also crashed into the sea and the pilot was killed."
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BTW Tim. I hadn't heard of the tank busting Fl 282 either. Robert

"A very important innovation in the Me 210 design was the use of side rear firing Mg131 turret guns (barbettes) controlled by the rear crew member by the means of a ReVi gun sight and a pistol grip with the firing trigger. These barbettes were delicate maintenance pieces and were not easy to handle. A famous victim of these guns was the American Ace Captain James Morris of the 20th Group. On 7/07/44, over Halle and Bernburg, he was shot down and killed in his P-38 Lightning by an attacked Me 410."

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4 Whirlwinds versus 20 Me-109s.

"During the same month, the squadron flew many offensive sorties-mainly against airfields at Quer- queville, Maupertuis and Lannion-as a result of which three Ju 88's, at least eight Ju 87's and some Bf 109's were destroyed on the ground, one E-boat sunk and another damaged. On one occasion four Whirlwinds were intercepted by twenty Bf 109's while engaged on a Warhead sortie and a fierce dog fight ensued. Although outnumbered 5 to 1, the Whirlwinds gave a good account of themselves and destroyed two of the enemy. Two Whirlwinds were damaged and a third force-landed when returning to base. All this led the squadron diarist to record:"The Whirlwind has at long last been com- pletely justified and vindicated, having shown that it is an admirable machine for ground strafing and also that it is a match for the Me.109s".While this may have been true low down, it was not so at altitudes, where, through changing tactics, the majority of combats were taking place."

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An interesting "What If?" would be an encounter between a Ta-154 Moskito Vs a de Havilland DH.98 Mosquito. Robert

once again a little out of the time frame Here is a encounter between piston engined aircraft.

"On the morning of June 26, 1950, one day after the start of the war, the U.S. Air Force's 68th Fighter (All-Weather) Squadron sent four F-82G aircraft from Itazuke Air Base in Japan to protect two Norwegian ships evacuating civilians from Seoul. While covering a motor convoy of civilians on the Seoul-Inchon road, two of the F-82s were attacked by two Soviet-made La-7 fighters, presumably flown by North Korean pilots. Rather than endanger the civilians below, the two F-82s pulled up into the clouds instead of engaging the La-7s.

The next day, North Korean aircraft attacked the early morning USAF flight. This time, however, the F-82 crews accepted the challenge and shot down three enemy aircraft.

An F-82 piloted by Lt. William G. Hudson and carrying Lt. Carl Fraser as radar operator, claimed a Yak-11 over Kimpo airfield in full view of those on the ground. As Hudson fired at the Yak, Fraser attempted to photograph the action with a malfunctioning 35mm camera. Meanwhile, after a North Korean La-7 fighter damaged the tail of his F-82, Lt. Charles Moran shot down it down. Maj. James Little, flying high cover nearby, also shot down an La-7."
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Looks like there were a couple of encounters between Gladiators and RO.37s in East Africa in 1940. The RO.37s lost out of course. Robert

At 08:00 on 4 July, five CR 42s of the 94a Squadriglia (Capitano Franco Lavelli, Tenente Tadini, Sergente Maggiore Arturo Cardano, Sergente Maggiore Trento Cecchi and Sottotenente Nunzio De Fraia) took off to escort an IMAM Ro.37bis reconnoitring the front line in the Sollum area. The Italian formation was intercepted by a number of Gladiators, which attacked the Ro.37. The Italian fighters intervened and managed to save the reconnaissance aircraft but almost all of the CR.42s suffered gun-jamming during the combat and two CR.42s were shot down. Tenente Tadini and Sergente Maggiore Cardano were both shot down by the Gladiators and Tadini baled out while Cardano crash-landed; both were taken prisoners.
It seems that they had clashed with Gladiators from 33 Squadron since a flight of three Gladiators from this unit took off to escort the 208 Squadron's Lysander of Flying Officer Webber and met two CR.42s over Sollum at around 08:30, Pilot Officer Eric Woods and Flight Sergeant Leonard Cottingham each shooting one down. No losses were reported nor the presence of other Fiats or the Ro.37 reconnaissance aircraft.
During this combat it is often reported the presence of Sergente Maggiore Agostino Fausti and it is also reported that he claimed two Gladiators during this combat. In fact, the existing Italian records do not confirm this information.

Tadini ended the war with 3 shared biplane victories. "

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"In the afternoon 20 Japanese G3M bombers on a raid to Nanjing were intercepted by 26 Chinese fighters from the 8th, 17th, 28th and 34th Squadrons flying eight Boeing 281 P-26 Peashooters, five Gloster Gladiators, 13 Hawk IIIs and Hawk IIs. The Chinese shot down four and damaged six Japanese G3M bombers."
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"In December 1939, the Soviet fighter group up to 50 planes under the command of S. P. Suprun was transferred to south Yunnan where Japanese air attacks on communications lines along the Chinese portion of the Burma Road had become more intense. Suprun's group participated in the Battle of South Guangxi,[11] flying missions together with Chinese I-15 fighters from the 4th Air Group, the 27th and 29th Squadrons from the 3rd Air Group, part of the 18th Squadron with Curtiss Hawk 75, and even the 32nd Squadron with the ancient Douglas O-2MC scout/light bombers."

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"On 8 February 1940, 27 Japanese planes heading for Mengzi were intercepted at 3.05 pm by three Hawk 75s of the 18th Squadron taking off from Kunming. In the ensuing dogfight, one Hawk 75 (No. 5024) was damaged and forced to crash land; its pilot Yang Tzu-fan was injured. On 13 February 1940 three Hawk 75s of the 18th Squadron intercepted 27 Japanese bombers which were on their way to bomb the bridge near Siulungtam. The Hawk 75s hit one Japanese bomber and were later joined by three I-15 biplane fighters. Together they made many passes at the damaged bomber, killing the upper gunner. The Chinese claimed to have finally shot down the hapless plane. Several of the Chinese planes were slightly damaged and one pilot, Tseng Pei-fu, was injured.[14]"

Since the Chinese also used the P-43 Lancer and P-66 Vanguards there may be a few scenarios with encounters with Japanese aircraft. Especially during escort missions with A-29 Hudsons and Russian SB Bombers. Robert