"Did French really wrap their hats(shakos?) in white cloth?" Topic

I am very new to the whole Napoleonic era, and know almost nothing of the history, let alone the different uniforms and such.

That being the case, I've stared watching some movies regarding the period, to serve as a painless primer.

So I was watching a few episodes of "Sharpe" (starring Sean Bean) over the weekend, but noticed how the French had wrapped their hats (are they called shakos?) up in white cloth, covering any insignia it may have.

Is this normal? IMO this made them look ugly, almost like deserters who rip off their patches in rage/shame. Or maybe like hospital staff.

Then I watched the 1970 movie "Waterloo", and didn't find any French dressed in this way.

Which is the more accurate portrayal?

They are wrapped in oilskin, to preserve them in inclement weather.

Do not use TV and movies as your primary source. Helmet covers were utilised much more than you might think.

Wargamers will always want to present their armies in parade ground dress though. Greatcoats and shako covers look very boring on the table.

Ah, so they were covers. Makes sense, since the "Sharpe" episodes I've watched were based in Spain.

Do not use TV and movies as your primary source

I know, Sage… but sometimes I'm just too tired (read "lazy") to sit down with a thick book.

From practical experience.

A white hat is less oppressive in the heat than a black one.

KAM

They might have taken off the shako covers and put on all of the plumes and swags prior to the battle so that they would look their best.

"Sergeant Major?"
"Sah!"
"Have the men put on their bling."
"Sah! DON….. BLING!"

"Wargamers will always want to present their armies in parade ground dress though. Greatcoats and shako covers look very boring on the table"

Is that right?

The canvas and oilskin covers were in common use and were to protect the shako.

John the OFM, that reminds me of the scene in Carry on up the Khyber with the kilts!!

Which, alas! I have not seen. 8^(

Ah, this must be it…
YouTube link

Isn't it Don King and not Don Bling?

I'm sure Connard is teasing when he says wargamers 'always' want to present their armies in parade dress. Judging by the number of manufacturers making figures in campaign uniform, that's obviously not quite the truth – the word 'many' or even 'some' might be better!

The shako covers were used quite extensively in the Peninsula by the French (but not so much, seemingly, by the Allies?). I've painted my troops' shako covers a variety of dirty whites, beiges, and even a few browns.

There was also an oilskin cover, which would be more for water-proofing than sun protection.

Waterloo, of course, was a totally different climate from the Peninsula, so light shako covers were in the main not seen.

I'm sure the producers of Sharpe used the covers as a way of saving money, by not having to buy elaborate shako plates/plumes etc. My bet is that underneath the cover was a very dodgy concoction of cardboard and sellotape.

Ahhhh… Carry On Up The Khyber – one of the best!

Do the 'Carry On' films work for Americans? They require an in depth knowledge of British slang of the 60s and 70s to get the full experience!

They require an in depth knowledge of British slang of the 60s and 70s to get the full experience!

What? Phrases like "Oooh Eeer" and "Bwoooaah"
:oP
Max

The Nassauer wore white covers at waterloo

I understand that during the battle of Waterloo they were ordered to remove there white shako covers as they were a target for artillery.

"Phrases like "Oooh Eeer" and "Bwoooaah""

Tiffin.

Oooh Matron.

borodina for one, has clear examples of the French donning parade uniforms at the start of the battle.

which is worth knowing, I always thought

My bet is that underneath the cover was a very dodgy concoction of cardboard and sellotape.

I got to wear a shako in a movie. It wasn't dodgy but my memory says that the cylinder was indeed made from cardboard.
Max

I think the topic begs my next question… were the shakos so delicate as to require covers?

And why didn't the British use shako covers, when they were battling in the same climate as the French?

As I recall, French shakos were made with felt with leather reinforcing bands – so, no more or less fragile than, say, a slouch hat from the ACW

The use of shako covers appears to me to be cultural, i.e not only did the Russians almost never use them, they often wore their shakos with full plumes and cords most of the time – I guess shako covers were a French thing

and a prussian thing

Some Prussian shakoes were rather like the film ones of cardboard and selotape, only using whicker or even straw. The oliskin cover made it look like a shako.

This was especially true in the Prussian reserve and landwehr regiments in 1813. They would also use captured French shakos by removing all of the braid, trim, etc. so theu wouldn't look "French."

Jim

"I'm sure the producers of Sharpe used the covers as a way of saving money, by not having to buy elaborate shako plates/plumes etc. My bet is that underneath the cover was a very dodgy concoction of cardboard and sellotape."

An apt description of Cornwell's writing…

Allen

Allen, you may not be the Messiah, but you are a very naughty boy!

I believe the proper order is;

Col:"The Battalion will don Bling."

SGT Maj:"Don….Wait for it…..BLING!"

all:"one, two, three, one, two, three, one."

Dutch508, I stand corrected.

<<This was especially true in the Prussian reserve and landwehr regiments in 1813. They would also use captured French shakos by removing all of the braid, trim, etc. so theu wouldn't look "French.">>

Yes, but wouldn't the garlic smell still have given them away?

<<All: "one, two, three, one, two, three, one.">>

Corporal Jones: One!

"Ahhhh… Carry On Up The Khyber – one of the best!

Do the 'Carry On' films work for Americans? They require an in depth knowledge of British slang of the 60s and 70s to get the full experience!"

It certainly worked with the Indian crew I sailed with in the mid-seventies, even though most of them only spoke Bengali!

"borodina for one, has clear examples of the French donning parade uniforms at the start of the battle.

which is worth knowing, I always thought"

Quite. The French had, I beleive, "tenue de route" or "tenue de campagne" which was the most comfortable style, including coats rather than habits, trousers or overalls and shako covers, "tenue de Bataille" which was trousers, habits, uncovered shakoes, with cords etc. and "tenue de parade" which included breeches and gaiters, ie. full parade dress.

I've just been reading Christopher Walkers link background sheet on the coldstream guards and he's talking about oilskins for their shakoes. It might have been more widespread than we realise as they would have been expensive to replace for a common soldier.

Of course the french would have white covers just to be stylish.

Captain Canada I don't think the comfort of the soldiers was the primary concern. You only have to see the stocks that the brits wore as an example.

<<It certainly worked with the Indian crew I sailed with in the mid-seventies, even though most of them only spoke Bengali!>>

But then I imagine a least a few would have had first-hand knowledge of "The Raj Experience" anyway.

They seemed to find Randi Lal and Bunged it In the funniest.

Some Hannoverian units had white shakos, probably diverted from a contract to supply English units destined for the tropics. Whether these were covers or bleached I am not sure.

On the topic of cardboard, I cannot remember the source but I recall mention of British hussars complaining that their cardboard framed busbies went out of shape when wet but the French ones were considered superior on account of the metal hoops forming the frame (which also gave some protection against sabre cuts)

Yes, that rings a bell; also, when worn without the detachable peak, Hussar hats dripped rainwater into the eyes (when it was raining…). Wasn't it a unit of Nassauers who were ordered to remove their white covers at Wtaerloo? And, with regard to various "orders" of dress, I think Davout said, "it is never possible to be too well dressed when the cannons roar"; no doubt there was a certain psychological advantage in all that finery, but give me a stout leather jacket and a pair of running shoes.

I painted a bn of French in campaign dress with white shako covers once, the guy went back and painted the covers black: "They didn't look finished to me…" was his reason.