"Best WWII Mess Kit" Topic

Who had the Best mess kit issued to their troops in WWII? What do you think? And I do know that "Mess kit" meant other things in other armies other then the US. Im meaning the individuls items issued to the soldiers to be used in eating food and rations in the Field.My preference is the US GI issued one followed my the German one. I really liked the US GI issued silverware too. BTW this isnt a serious poll :P LOL. Just wanted to post something different and light LOL.I myself happen to own a few different types of mess or eating utinsels from other countries. And who can forget the good ole P-38 can opener!! BTW I also happen to own a copy of the 1942 US Army Cooks manual. Great recipes for mass meals . On a similar note who do you think had the best rations?? Robert

No army has good rations…it's been a problem down throughout the centuries…

I still have and use the original P-38 opener issued to me in Basic Training, 1962, at Fort Jackson, South Carolina.

Jay

I have had quite a few P-38s over the years. But I still have mine from when I got it during the 70s. I still have my P-51 too :).
Robert

I like the depth of the bottom half of the German kit, the compactness and style of the US Kit and the ability to cook a stew for six in the British/Canadian Mess Kit. I understand the Soviets made and issued a copy of the German Kit. In Canada now, we do not have a mess kit, I kinda miss it. I do alot of backpacking and have a really nice nested set with KFS, all of stainless steel and all nested in one package…just perfect. I still have the little folding stainless steel can opener we used to get with our rations too, although we have gone to boil in the bags now.

The US army cook manual has been published as a civilian book as well seen it at the book store.

"The US army cook manual has been published as a civilian book as well seen it at the book store."

Is it located in the Humor section?

Damon.

No matter how good the rations might be, the troops quickly get sick of them. During the Christmas Truce in 1914, both sides were eager to exchange rations with each other, not in hopes of something better, but just for something different.

Strange question, how would any of us know? As a kid I tried some K rations that a father of a friend of mine saved. Desiccated and tasteless, coffee and hot chocolate, with a cracker and some jam, if I remember right. During WWII my father's (9th I.D. recce battalion) favorite meals were a deer someone shot in the Schwarzwald that was prepared by a guy who was a professional chef at the Ritz prior to getting drafted, and some fish they blasted out of a river using hand grenades. He was mostly hungry in 1944 post D-Day, because rations were always short on the leading edge of the logistics tail and guys had to scrounge around for food.

I still carry my P-38 on my keychain. After 911 it was harry getting it through secrity. The last time I went through security I had my foldable took kit and they never said a word to me.

Best rations, anyone of them when hungry. I remember mising a few meals out in the field.

I did hear that the Navy east good on the ships.

…………Doug

Oh, regards the mess kit itself, and not the rations, my dad used a knife-spoon-fork tool he got off a German prisoner. So long as he had that, he could get by. I don't know whether he messed with the plate/bowl assembly that was part of the kit -- he probably just ate out of the cans. He always told me that the mess services were pretty indifferent about cleanliness, and plates, trays, etc were always so greasy that they would easily slip out of your hands at a common mess. His friend, nicknamed "Heavy", was a cook. He used to give my dad a secret sign when the eggs were not fit to eat (this was probably not during front line combat duty).

Thanks for the responses so far :).From what I have read and heard the US Navy had the best food out of all the US services during the war. Including ice cream :). Now I for one have eaten US rations from Vietnam era C-rats and LRRP rations to the latest MREs. Along with some rations from other countries like Poland,Canada,Switzerland and Germany. I had posted about this on another discussion forum awhile back partially in response to the "Best" handgun,rifle,tank,Ect questions that tend to pop up LOL. I thought it would be interesting to discuss something that most don't really think about when it comes to discussing the war. Logistics just isn't as Fascinating or glamorous.
Robert

There is alot of information about rations and food from the various countries here :).
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For example,

Imperial Japanese rations

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Imperial Japanese rationswere the field rations issued by Imperial Japan in World War II, and which reflected the culture of the Japanese military. Rations had to be stout, durable, simple, sturdy and had to survive without refrigeration for long periods of time. Typically each ration was served in the field in tin boxes, and cooked near the battlefield.
The rations issued by the Imperial Japanese Government, usually consisted of rice with barley, meat or fish, vegetables, pickled vegetables, umeboshi, shoyu sauce, miso or bean paste, and green tea. A typical field ration would have 1½ cups of rice, with barley. The reason why rice was issued with barley was to combat nutritional deficiencies such as beriberi.
Typically ¼ cup of canned tuna, or sausages, and/or squid would be cooked from either captured locations or hunting in the nearby area. Preserved foods from Japan typically were issued sparingly. Other foods issued: 1 ¼ cups of canned cabbage, coconut, sweet potato, burdock, lotus root, taro, bean sprouts, peaches, mandarin oranges, lychee or beans. 3 teaspoons of pickled radish (typically daikon), pickled cucumber, umeboshi, scallions and ginger added flavor to the rations. Sometimes less than an ounce of dried seaweed, was issued for making sushi in the field, or beer and/or sake was issued to help boost morale.
US Marines, who captured these rations from the Japanese, often found a taste for rice vinegar, shoyu sauce and MSG, which were typically added to rice when the Japanese seasoned the rice for long range missions.

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Wow, a P-38 can opener a security problem? I can see it now: "one wrong move, and I'll, I'll open this can! I mean it!"

My uncle told me that when he was a 16 yr old Volkssturm conscript, the truck pulled up once a day, and someone on the back of the truck kicked out a case of rations. And each individual ration included a small bottle of brandy, which the older soldiers took from the teenagers. Mostly hard bread and sausage, other than the brandy.

The P-38 can opener. Hmm but it took an Australian to perfect the design by adding a spoon to the basic design, which not only gives it more utility but provides more purchase when opening a tin.

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These used to be items that could be sold or swapped with Americans for much more expensive items of kit. Hilarious really as they were disposable items that came with each ration pack. Simple folk.

Yes airport sec. was looking for TINY knives like the one on the P-38 after all the highjackers did only have box cutters the blade is not very big on those.

Quite a few country's mililtary services supplied a alcohol ration to their personnel during the war. Be it hard liquor or beer tuscaloosa. Along with cigarettes and tobacco. Not like today and its views and morals LOL.
Robert

Soviet rations

"Rations would often include shchi, a type of cabbage soup, and kasha, which is boiled buckwheat. These are standard Russian peasant staples, and there is an old Russian saying that goes, "Shchi ee kasha, pisha nasha" which means "Shchi and kasha, that's our fare". Typical additions would be tea or coffee, salt, bread, macaroni, salted fish, or canned meat. American Spam was very co nmon, and it has been calculated that there was enough food sent lend-lease to Russia to feed a 12,000,000 man army l/2 pound of food per day for the war. The lend-lease food wouldn't be common until 1943, but many lend-lease staples would be common for the rest of the war. Spam was invariably referred to as "second front", and egg powder used to be called "Roosevelt's eggs" (yaitsa being the Russian word both for "eggs" and ``testicles',). (6) Typical lend-lease foods that would be OK for reenacting would be flour, dried peas and beans, sugar, canned meats, particularly Spam or a facsimile of Tushonka (a kind of stewed pork product in gelatin) butter, vegetable shortening, oil and margarine, canned or dried milk, dried eggs, grits, and coffee.(7) Although coffee was consumed when available, tea was the norm and the traditional drink, and samovars (devices used in making tea that look like coffee urns) can often be seen in the field. Bread and sausage would be a common ration issued for troops during operations, as they could be expected to last a few days without spoiling. Some of the troops reducing the Stalingrad pocket un-intentionally killed some of their own liberated POW's by feeding the emaciated men bread and sausage from their own rations when the liberated men's systems couldn't handle it. (8)"

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Food for Russian soldiers includes bread, soup: Red Army rations varied from adequate to nonexistent depending on the supply situation. Bread and soup were staples. A type of cabbage soup called shchi was common, as was kasha, which is boiled buckwheat. Supplements included macaroni, salted fish, tea, salt, lard or bacon fat, and whatever vegetables the soldier could forage. American Spam became a common source of meat. Bread and sausage were often issued prior to combat operations since they would last for days without spoiling.
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By coincidence, I was just talking to an uncle on Saturday who is an Italian and Holland Sherman tanker vet. In Italy he had been taken out of the line to recuperate from dysentery that involved a week or so in hospital and a couple of weeks of light duty loading trucks.

He mentioned being upset that he was loading Canadian Molson's beer into trucks bound for British troops while the Canadians had been issued Aberdeen Stout that was not well liked. (IIRC, it was a Scottish town name but definitely not Edinburgh or Glasgow; maybe Inverness if not Aberdeen?)

Another thing they got often as a "snack" sort of meal was white bread with cheese and jam. And I've forgotten now exactly how often they got it, but in the field they also got WW1-style hardtack. And they'd trade the Americans corned beef for Spam.

Thanks for that Andy. Now I have some info on the German,Italian,Soviet,US,UK and Japanese rations along with some of the rations of POWs. Does anyone have any information on French rations ( "rations de combat")in 1939-40? Im assuming that after Normandy they would have been issued rations from US or UK stocks. Is that true? Robert

There were two types of messtin in use by the Red Army.

The M1924 'pot' type and the M1936 'German' type. The M1936 is still used by the Russian army.

I've got examples of both in my collection. I like the M1924 because it's just a pot with a handle – good for cooking and eating.

You also got an enameled or aluminium mug. About 7cm to 8cm size.

The only utensil was a spoon often not issued but one owned by the recruit as the call up notice frequently had a rider on it saying 'bring a big spoon'. Hence the slang name for your call up was The Big Spoon Order.

Speaking to veterans they often say they had enough food (though I imagine their definition of enough and a fat westerner's, like me, definition are slightly different) but getting drinking water was a problem.

As an aside Tushonka (tinned stew) is also the nickname for tank crew.

Canadian rations
After witnessing the less-than-perfect supply and rations situation in the British Army during the Great War, Canadian military planners decided to begin a 'similar but separate' program of rations procurement for the Canadian Army. This program began in the 1920's, and by the time World War II came about and it was time for Canada to join the 'Mother Country's' cause, ration development had taken on a very "Commonwealth flavour"…

Even though very similar in general design and purpose to their British counterparts, Canadian service rations were in many cases different with a flair not only given to uniquely Canadian tastes, but also with universal use by brothers in arms throughout the Commonwealth.
Canada had, similar to the UK, divided its rations into the following categories:
1. Food Service Rations---Generally fresh food or what would be considered mess hall food.
2. Field Service Rations---Foods that were transportable, had shelf life and no refrigeration requirement and could be eaten with limited preparation needs. These included Composite Rations and Supplemental Ration Packs. These rations were normally designed to feed sections
3. Field Operational Rations---Items that could be issued to soldiers as regular sustenance when no messing arrangements were possible. Rations of this nature were the 48-Hour Ration Pack, the 24-Hour Ration and partial issues of the more portable components of the Compo ration.
4. Specialist and Special Purpose Rations---Foods that were either task specific, such as the AFV-(Armoured Fighting Vehicle) ration and the Mountain/Arctic ration.

5. Emergency Rations

Rations designed as a means of sustenance in survival situations, or as a last food source when no foods of any other kind are available. These rations included the Individual Emergency Ration (MK1 and British MKI and MKII-pretty much a chocolate nut cake in a tin), vehicle, aircrew and marine emergency rations, and the General Purpose emergency ration. The GP was a much-abused ration consisting of a Spam®-sized gold-coloured tin that contained 12 biscuits, 2 chocolate bars, and 12 milk chocolate tablets (these were actually procured from the US--Necco® Wafers!). Troops did not like this ration one bit, and if asked about WW2 rations, many Canadian troops have little recall of any other ration items, but always remember the "Emergency" ration as atrocious and disliked. (Military planners tended to add one day to any operational feeding based on the fact that each soldier had one of these by 1944).
6. Supplemental rations
These ration packs were distributed to troops in situations where:
Definite re-supply could not be insured
Foreign rations may be supplied in insufficient or unknown quantity or quality (The Canadian planners had run into issues with US D-Ration bars being the sole supply being delivered to Commonwealth Troops)
Partial issues from Compo rations were made, and were lacking some ingredients that were hard to carry once the compo tins or containers were opened
When no preserved rations of any consequence were available
These rations consisted mainly of 1-3 man packs of "extras", such as the "Biscuit and Beverage Powder" tins, which contained various biscuits and some form of instant beverage, and condiment/accessory tins, which were normally packed to supply either 3 or 6 troops. The contents of the Accessory tins (which came out in 1943 and were provided to most allies) could be "Oats with Sugar", "Matches, Sugar, Salt, Sweets and Mepacrine" or various other multi-serving beverage packs.

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BTW I forgot to mention that using the 1942 manual its great for when you are wanting to cook in mass quantities. Nothing like being to make BBQ sauce in gallons and pancakes in the hundreds LOL. Robert

It looks like the German style type of kit was used by quite a few European militaries Frontovik. I have a Swiss Army issue one with the device for it to be able to be used with a liqid fuel source. Robert

And who can forget the ration of horsemeat during certain times. Sometimes the rations of the troops were barely enough to sustain them. And ,at least in the Pacific, after becoming POWs got even worse if you can believe it :(.

"There were 5 officers, 9 NCO's and 110 soldiers left fighting at the end of November, 1942. Food was carefully rationed and consists of 120 grams of horse meat per meal along with some bread. Of the 3 daily meals, only one was considered large, and this consisted of only 1/2 of the required amount to sustain troops from day-to-day."

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"As temperatures dropped to minus 30 degrees Centigrade the German bread ration, already as low as 100 grammes a day was reduced to just 50. The starving German soldiers were forced to slaughter their horses and later still to dig up their frozen carcasses to eat the bones. "

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"By April the troops on Bataan were subsisting on about fifteen ounces of food daily, less than a quarter of the peacetime ration. Their diet, consisting mostly of rice supplemented by carabao, mule, monkey, or lizard meat, was gravely deficient in vitamins and provided less than Togo calories a day, barely enough to sustain life. Weakened by hunger and poor diet, thousands succumbed to malaria, dengue, scurvy, beriberi, and amoebic dysentery, madeimpossible to control by the shortage of medical supplies, especially quinine. Desperate efforts were made to send food, medicine, ammunition, and other supplies through the Japanese blockade to the beleaguered forces. But during the early weeks, before the enemy cordon had tightened, it proved impossible, despite promises of lavish pay and bonuses, to muster the necessary ships and crews. Even so, sizable stocks were accumulated in the southern islands, but only about 1,000 tons of rations ever reached Manila Bay. Shipments in converted destroyers from the United States were too late and too few, and only insignificant quantities could be brought in by submarine and aircraft."
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Robert

So. Once again. Does anyone have any information on French rations ( "rations de combat")in 1939-40? Im assuming that after Normandy they would have been issued rations from US or UK stocks. Is that true? Any other info on rations from some of the other minor countries? Robert

You could ask these guys…

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Thanks for that Frontovik. Ill have to check it out. Funny how I can find all kinds of info on the WWI "rations de combat" but not WWII. Robert

I just contacted them and hopefully they can help :).

Robert

And speaking of WWII can openers. Here is a Japanese one :).
Robert

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And a German one. Robert

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Just got an e-mail back from the group that Frontovik posted. No luck from them. But they pointed me to another group. Ill try them next. Robert

I did get this from the site.

"If Robert is making reference to emergency rations then we are talking about the boite a vivres de reserve, that khaki rectangular steel tin referred to as an M18 (dimensions approx 230mm / 130mm / 65mm). The standard contents were 200g of 'war' bread, 300g of tinned meat,125g of chocolate. In addition beef stock cubes and a small box of Ovaltine often supplemented the core emergency ration.

The boite a vivres itself is pretty common, the contents themselves (bread, meat and chocolate) I have never seen. I suspect what the troops didn't eat was consumed by the local French population immediately after the surrender, or supplied to Axis forces fighting in the East from 1941 onwards"

Robert

Anyone know about the boite a vivres de reserve possibly being issued for use in the East? Robert

An interesting point; if the Germans used so many French weapons it would only make sense for them to use other military supplies.

On a tangential note: I had a meal with a French unit in the field once. Linen tablecloths and wine, on folding tables in the woods. And that wasn't anything special, that was how they ate all the time (the officers, at least). Wow.

Current Swiss issue is surely the best…You go home for lunch.

Hey Robert, when you said "mess kit", what came to my mind was the uniform typically worn to mess dinners in the officer's mess, senior NCO's mess, etc. The scarlets here are what I wore: picture (none of these guys are me).

I was intrigued and it took me a good read of your initial post before I realized what you were talking about.
--
Tim

Tuscaloosa,

During the D-Day commemorations at Arromanches last year, we had a French field shower/decontamination unit attached to us – a great bunch of guys, with a superb piece of kit!

Anyway, the food was supplied by a field catering unit of the British Territorial Army (volunteer reservists). The food was absolutely first-rate, the best I have ever eaten in the field and better than most I have eaten on station!

However, the French Sergeant-Chef came up to me quite concerned, because he couldn't find where the wine was being served! ;o)

LOL Tim. I have run into that before. Robert

Since the subject was brought up again. Why not this thread too :). Robert

Oh and also as a companion to all the "Best" threads that pop up LOL. Robert

Emergency rations are supposed to taste awful – it discourages thieving squaddies from breaking into them. I've tried the "Iron Ration" canned chocolate, and yes, it is pretty foul. Not the stuff you would give to the girlfriend.

Sorry if this derails the thread a little, but it's sorta related: does anyone know when the British Army discontinued the rum ration?

No Prob number4. It adds to the subject :). BTW I found awhile ago a recipe to make your own D-ration. Robert

PDF link

Another one here,

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Robert

I have read when the RN ended the ration,
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There is this thread on the subject over on the ARRES site,

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Robert

Here is one of the other sites that sell Repro rations. Pretty good prices too. Robert

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Thanks Robert.
I never got any rum issue through official channels even though I did enough trips to sunny Soltau in the dead of winter when vehicles would freeze to the ground overnight.

Guard duty on New Year's Eve was always worthwhile though because the Orderly Officer would bring round a copious supply hard liquor'

Back to mess kits – we had the old WWII style square ones, and the best chips/French fries I ever tasted were cooked by my sgt. in one using 'liberated' potatoes….

My pleasure number4. I wonder if someone has an exact date s to when. The US kit I like to use was dated 1968 :). Robert

The other WWII Repro rations company out thre I have dealt with. Robert
wwiirations.com

As a WW2 messkit I'm dead impressed with my friend's Italian one.