"15mm fantasy mass battle games" Topic

CYou could probably alter activations somewhat without breaking the game completely. If you were careful.
What's the issue?

BIF is not yet available, it is just a draft written in Italian at this stage.
It is a collection of special rules to apply to Basic Impetus (and Impetus, maybe with some further clarification).
Then there is an army generator and the guys are working on "standard" lists at the moment. The idea is to publish a rough transtlation in the Impetus forum (by May?) hoping in a generous editing from some English speaker.

My apologies for this blatant self-promotion, but:

link

is a list of some of the web resources I have found of others working on 'BIF'.

I would not mind doing some editing of an already-translated-into-English BIF, if you are looking for volunteers…

The issue I have with BI's activation rules is how everything is done with each unit/group one after the other. This creates some very unusual and confusing combat situations. It should be easy enough to add phases where everything moves during the movement phase, then everything fights during the melee phase, then everything shoots in the shooting phase, etc. I haven't actually tried BI though (I have exactly 0 historic miniatures in any scale) so I'd like to try the rules as they are before I start messing with them. Historic BI should hold me until the fantasy mods are translated and released.

The interrupt/op fire mechanism addresses a number of issues.
You move into a unit's zoc, they shoot at you or counter-charge etc.
Or is that not in BI.
I forget and my head cold isn't exactly helping.

You're right though.
You definitely want to play a few games before you start adding extras.

So define orces as levies, Trolls as regulars…or whatever the terms are in BI. Proxy, proxy, proxy. Then play a few games. For play testing you can use anything as long as you remember what it is supposed to represent.

"Okay, the dwarves are Roman Legions, the Elves are Celts…"

Piece of cake.

Gracias,

Glenn

Yes Shadowdragon, try them in at least 4 battles before fiddling with them. I like good sequence of play driven systems, but I also like the ebb and flow of activations in Impetus which creates a different flow of impulses of action back and forth and presents its own tactical considerations. The bursts of activity when one unit drives back and presses others, and then may be rebuffed and chased back in turn by reserves, has a nice drama that I think feels right for fantasy, and you get this even without the opportunity rules in the Full version (you may decide you don't need them for what you want to do).

If you mention what troops you already have, someone could suggest two opposing armies to try. One suggestion is to include Large Units of Orcs, for example, as that is a nice rule that works well to represent troops that are not very strong but derive resilience from numbers and depth. I'd go light on shooters and focus on melee troops initially.

Mike

I reckon orcs are warband.

So maybe Orcs: Impetuous and in Large Units, Move 6 or 7 Unit Value 3, Impetus Bonus 2, Victory point value 1. Short Bow B (or worss). This should keep their enemies busy for a while.

Uruk Hai (the tougher sort of Orcs): Move 8, Value 5, Impetus Bonus 2. Short Bow B. Impetuous.

Warg/Wolf Riders: Move 12, Unit Value 3 or 4, Impetus Bonus 1, VP 1 or 2. Missile weaponry depends on personal views. Sort of like Huns lite.

Trolls maybe as Elephants for side effects, 5/5 for combat?

Special attributes should probably be added as well.

Well, for fantasy I still have some old Warhammer armies I can pull out. I have undead and dwarves. If I base them 8 infantry or 4 cavalry to a unit then for Undead I have 2 units of ghouls, 3 units of skeleton spearmen, 2 units of skeleton warriors (sword and shield), 2 units of skeleton cavalry, 1 unit of skeleton archers (or 2 units of skirmishers), and a piece of artillery (a catapult). I also have some undead giant vultures but there are no rules for flyers in BI. I suppose they could just be used as light cavalry though (I have enough for 1 unit).

For dwarves I have 2 units of berserkers, 3 units of warriors (axe and shield), 2 units of spearmen, 1 unit of heavy warriors (sword and shield), 2 units of long gunners, and 4 pieces of artillery (cannon, ballista, organ gun x2). I also have a giant lion and a griffin that can be used for the dwarves (although, again there's the problem of no rules for flying).

Can anything be made from those?

Flying rules are simple.
Use as CL. They also can cross any terrain with the exception of "mountains" (impassable terain) and allow them any interpenetration through friendly units.
Also they can fire overhead.

I have to say I have given a number of mass rules a shot but I ended up with Fantasy Rules 3. I like the basing and the flow of the game. Also you can play any mini you have in any scale. Keep in mind there is a new version of Fantasy rules out. The new version is a scaled down version for faster play. It's called Fantasy Rules! TCE (Tournament and Campaign Edition). It only cost $11.95 USD USD, and dose not require FR!3 rule book to play.

Noel

I find the TCE version of Fantasy Rules! pretty much fixes everything I don't like about FR!3.

sabersedge.com/chipco.php

scroll down, it's the second product.

I also love the original Warrior Heroes by Two Hour Wargames.

I don't see it on twohourwargames.com so you may have to email Ed about that. Basically it's the fantasy version of the old Warrior Kings game.

One game alot of people have forgotten is A Fist full of miniatures. The game is simple you have a basic point system to build your units and you can finish a large game in a quick amount of time.
The only knock on the game was the lack of magical attacks. But its upto the players to decide how much flavor they are looking for in a fantasy game.

GW- or hero level or something toned down. But this game I have played for years after trying out almost all of the rest.

I am also looking for the same as shadowdragon! Whats the current state of fantasy impetus?

its still in development. there are (more or less playable) samples at:
link