"The Neapolitan Army" Topic

Hi guys,

I am after any and all information on the Neapolitan army, its composition, its make up and organisation by unit. A full history of each Regiment and what happened to it from 1806 to 1815, what changes were made, what units were name changed or went to form other units etc. My information on the Cavalry is sketchy and the Guard composition and tracking of the history of each unit is blurred.

Also, the Artillery, I did find out it was predominately of captured Austrian origin but information on the Guard artillery is very blurry and inconsistent, can anyone give me exact details on its composition and unit history at all?

Regards and thank you in advance
Shane

Shane,
I'm interested in the subject too.
May you tell me your mail adress?
Regards

I suppose that you have already seen these?

link

link

Thx Connard, got both of them but there are many gaps in the information along with other confusing data. I am hoping our Italian friends might be able to shed some clear light on this subject as well. I am getting alot of conflicting information on squadron numbers per regiment in the cavalry regiments as well as numbers in each sqdrn for example.

my email address is :

sdev2749@bigpond.net.au

Regards,
Shane

The Gruppo Murat website may have some useful info or links.

xoomer.alice.it/jmurat/#ars

PK

Hi Shane!

I'd just like to say regarding what you'd like to know about the Neapolitan Army… wouldn't we all! :o)

Below is how the Neapolitan Army stood in 1815 so that you may be able to trace back the history of each unit:

ROYAL NEAPOLITAN ARMY 1815:

ROYAL GUARD

Infantry

Grenadiers (2 Battalions)
1st Velites (2 Battalions)
2nd Velites (2 Battalions)
Volitgeurs (3 Battalions)
Marines (1 Battalion)
Veterans (1 Battalion)

Cavalry

Guard du Corps (1 Company)
Cuirassiers (4 Squadrons)
Hussars (4 Squadrons)
Lancers (4 Squadrons)
Light Horse (4 Squadrons)

Artillery

1 Squadron of 2 Companies

Train

2 Companies

LINE

Infantry

12 Line Infantry Regiments (3 Battalions)*
* 7 companies to a battalion: 2 Flank, 4 Centre and 1 Depot
4 Light Infantry Regiments (3 Battalions)*
* 7 companies to a battalion: 2 Flank, 4 Centre and 1 Depot
Veterans (2 Battalions)

Cavalry

4 Regts of Cavalleggieri (Light Horse) (4 Squadrons)*
* Each regiment had a 5th Depot Squadron

Artillery

1st Regiment (20 Companies)
2nd Regiment (20 Companies)
Marine Regiment of 2 Battalions of 8 Companies each

Train

1 Regiment of 2 Battalions of 7 Companies each

Sappers

1 Regiment of 2 Battalions of 8 Companies each

INTERNAL FORCES

Royal Gendarmerie Regiment of 7 Squadrons of 2 Companies each

Provincial Legions (Grenadiers and Voltigeurs) (63 Companies)

Provincial Companies (Grenadiers) (14 Companies)*
*1 in each of the Kingdoms 14 Provinces. Composed of discharged veterans or those unfit for active service

Naples City Guard (1 Infantry Battalion and 1 Cavalry Squadron)

City of Naples Internal Security Guard (1 Infantry Battalion and 1 Cavalry Squadron)

BUT HEY! Why take my word for it? See for yourself below:

Pages 102 and 103 contain the Army List
Pages 104 and 105 contain the Neapolitan OOB for 1815
Page 106 contains the Austro-Modenese-Parmesan OOB for 1815

link

Besides the above mentioned these will also help:

The Uniforms of the Neapolitan Army 1806-15 Part I by Colin Allen – First Empire Magazine Issue 13

The Uniforms of the Neapolitan Army 1806-15 Part II by Colin Allen – First Empire Magazine Issue 14

The Uniforms of the Neapolitan Army 1806-15 Part III by Colin Allen – First Empire Magazine Issue 15

The Uniforms of the Neapolitan Army 1806-15 Part IV by Colin Allen – First Empire Magazine Issue 16

And above all the OFFICIAL and DEFINITIVE work…

PDF link

Probably EVERYTHING you are looking for will be in those books last linked to. Though they're written in Italian I'm sure you'd be able to pick out many of the bits you want to know about like when formed and disbanded, organisation etc.

Hope this helps some what?

Dean Shaw

Ooops! Just realised for those who can't access PDF, the book is…

Storia Militare del Regno Murattiano (1806-1815)
(In Three Volumes) by Virgilio Ilari et al, Widerholdt Freres, 2007.

XI Corps had the Neapolitans 1n 1812

33rd Division: General de division Destrees (1 Aug)
Brigade: General de brigade Rossarol
Neapolitan Guard Marines (8/176)
Neapolitan Velites à Pied Reg. 2 Infantry Battalions (46/1154)
Brigade: General de brigade Ambrosio
5th Neapolitan Line Regiment 2 Infantry Battalions (49/1594)
6th Neapolitan Line Regiment 2 Infantry Battalions (42/1564)
7th Neapolitan Line Regiment 2 Infantry Battalions (41/1475)
Brigade: General de brigade Francheschi
Neapolitan Velites à Cheval Reg 2 Squadrons (22/320)
Neapolitan Gardes d'Honneur 2 Squadrons (31/395)
Neapolitan Horse Battery 4-6 Pdrs. & 2 Howitzers (6/75)

The 7th regiment were originally a French regiment, the "pioniers noirs" described as the worst in the French Army. When transferred to Neapolitan Service, August 1806, it was described as superior to any existing Neapolitan forces.

Rank and File and at least some of the Officers were Negroes so an intersting unit to paint for the period.
Blandford's Retreat from Moscow has some detail on the army for 1812 plate 20 & 21.

The units were refused eagles by Napoleon in 1807, in a letter to his brother, then the King, because, "you must be aware that… these troops are no better than none at all…"

Still, with many of the rule sets about, they should fare no worse than many other Nations, just don't use Quarrie's rules "Campaigns in Miniature".

I am currently cleaning the flash off some FR French to use as Neapolitans, yes the 7th! with others to follow.

rabbit

Try these:

napitalia.org.uk/eng

link

wow great pdf flyer information of those 3 books, seemed to be a must for those interested in the Neapolitain army

Frédéric Pouvesle of histofig porduced a nice pamphlet – which I found quite usefull as starter :

Uniformes de l'armée du Royaume de Naples

wow guys,

thank you for the interest and leads, I will be chasing them down during the week. That army is very complex and all over the place but I am determined to work it out.

Shane

Regarding the prowess of the 7th regiment, it stems from General Rapp , commander of the Danzig garrison, who described the neapolitan troops ubnder his command(centre companies of the 5th,6th & 7th Regts) as "a fine body of men and full of zeal" but singled out the 7th, as the best of the three regiments, for their martial bearing.
Contrary to popular belief, there were only 23 desertions from the Neapolitan troops during this campaign. The Neapolitans get a bad press for the situation in Spain where Murat emptied the main prison at Caserta to provide the men for the 1st Leggeri, after a desertion strewn march to Spain this unit had half of its strength used to reinforce the depleted ranks of the 1st & 2nd Linea. This effectively crippled the Neapolitan division as a fighting force.
As far as I am aware there were 3 battalions of Granitieri (one always stationed in Naples, perhaps the ones dressed in Red coats w/ black facings). I would certainly reccomend the First Empire series

I remember reading once that the Negro 7th Regiment was the best regiment of the worst nation for troop quality in the wars…I did wonder how accurate this statement really was ?

See Kingdom of Italy thread. I posted a list and short descriptions of books covering napleonic Neapolitan Army uniforms, organization, etc.

Dennis from OMM
onmilitarymatters.com

shouldn't you have one unit of vanilla facings, one chocolate, and one strawberry? jk

I always think of Neopolitan Ice cream whenever I see Neopolitan.

Hi Shane,
Because of the situation described above in the Peninsula campaign, the neapolitan army gets a very bad press particularly in the UK. I am not saying they were excellent soldiers but they were probably no worse than a lot of others. Rapp used them as his mobile reserve and for difficult missions such as attacking fortified enemy positions during the seige, something the Neapolitans apparently excelled at. And when it came time to surrender, it was the Neapolitans who wanted to break out whereas the others were happy to surrender.
The elite regt(elite co's of 5th, 6th,7th and remnants of the Veliti and Marinai della Guardia Reale) fought in the rearguard of the Grand Armee all the way to Dresden and fought on until Leipzig and was showered with Legion d'Honneurs by a grateful Napoleon.
Unfortunately these salient facts are brushed over and ignored by people who are quite happy to make derogatory remarks based on innaccurate and poorly researched information.Spanish troops suffer the same problem but like the Neapolitans a lot of this is down to the officers who by and large were not very good. A similar thing could be said about the British Officers when not in formations commanded by Wellington,

I think its true that Neapolitan troops have sometimes been unfairly denigrated- and the composite Reg'to d'Elite in particular was a good formation.
We can't overcompensate though. The low desertion figures refer, if I am correct, to the period when they were under Rapp's command in Danzig. The alternative to staying with the ranks (and within the city) was wandering the Polish countryside or handing oneself over the the besieging Landwehr, Opolchenie and Cossacks- which would have been a reality check and no mistake.
A very significant issue for the Neapolitan forces from the 18th century until reunification was the prevalence of membership of various secret societies by all ranks. This often created alternative unofficial hierarchies- with a sergeant 'junior' to one of his corporals, or a newly posted commander affilated to one society struggling with his officers who belonged to another. Murat in particular was inclined to ignore these factors.
A fascinating and much overlooked army.

I think it shows the importance of leadership, under Rapp, or MacDonald (commander of the 7th and the Elite Regt, a descendant of a soldier in the Spanish Irish Brigade, Limerick Regt transferred to Neapolitan service in the 1720s) they could be as good as any other soldiers, just as the British could be very poor if not under a good commander. Before Wellington arrived they had hardly covered themselves in glory in the Peninsula, due to the lack of effective leadership. If troops trust their leaders then they are effective.
The Neapolitans suffered the lowest desertion rate of any nationality in Danzig and were the only ones who wanted to break out before the surrender. As I said I only wish to put forward a more balanced view than the usual knee-jerk reaction to things Neapolitan. Secret societies would certainly have affected things, that and the wide range of nationalities in the army.
But I think the biggest problem they had was Murat himself, whilst a great leader of a cavalry charge, he was not known for his tactical or strategic brilliance. Murat also seemed to ignore whether the generals he employed were competent and this led to generals such as Millet (Murat's Adjutant -General) & Prince Pignatelli-Strongoli (commander of the Neapolitan Guard Cavalry which was routed by a troop of Austrian Hussars on the second day at Tolentino).

One of the things to keep in mind about the Neapolitan army is that when it was reformed after the invasion of 1806, it was filled with troops transferred from the invading French army, for example, the Neapolitan Royal Guard came from French Elite companies. I can't remember my source, I think it was one of the Napoleon online websites but I imagine units were topped up with Neapolitan recruits over the years, and that as stated several times, these included drafts from prisons that were prone to desertion.

Very true, However, when Joseph left Naples for Spain he actually took these men (the French Elite in the Naples Guards) with him so when Murat took over he was devoid of any good cavalry.

The problem with the Neapolitan Army is because of a couple of factors, namely the comments Napoleon himself had made regarding the Negro regiment but also the fact that the prisons were cleaned out to bolster the ranks. This point alone was playing with fire because the desertion rate became horrendous, they simply did not want to fight, just get out. You can imagine the problems this caused and why police style units popped up in abundance in Naples after…

I am a strong believer in unit attrition and cleansing of a units ranks before it becomes a stable, reliable combat unit. A period of flushing of the bad apples is needed in any combat unit before all the malcontents, lame, sick, discontented, cowards etc are gone. It is the men left over that remain that create the combat unit that will do well. The problem with the Neapolitan army is the percentage of this attrition was very very high due to where the men came from.

Regards,
Shane

I think you are misinformed on a number of points, Murat continued the practice of recruiting men from French Elite companies for his guards units and was warned about it by Napoleon as late as 1813.
There was the early use of prisoners and deserters to fill the ranks of the original regiments (with, as you predict disastrous results in Spain) ,before conscription was introduced.But it did not reappear till 1813 when the Provisional Regt( based at the main prison in Caserta) was used to provide the men for the 9th Line & the 4th Light. I think you will find chronic desertion was limited to the early period and the retreat from Tolentino in 1815 and was not worse than many other nations. As I said in a previous post there were very few desertions from 1812/3 campaign. Yet I have read in supposedly authorative books that there were large marauding bands of Neapolitan deserters ravaging the countryside.
Whatever Napoleons comments about the "Pioneers Noir" they should be viewed in the light of the orthodoxy of the time that black people were inferior and it should be remembered that Napoleon's army had been beaten by the Haitian slave army of Toussaint L'Ouverture and that the regiment itself was composed mainly of Haitian prisoners.So in that light it is not suprising he took a dim view of them
The reason why so many police units were employed was to keep down the Borbon guerrilas who were a constant menace throughout the kingdom.Admittedly a proportion of these were army deserters but it was the guerrilas who were the focus rather than deserters per se

Hi,
The Uniforms of the Neapolitan Army 1806-15 Part I by Colin Allen – First Empire Magazine Issue 13

The Uniforms of the Neapolitan Army 1806-15 Part II by Colin Allen – First Empire Magazine Issue 14

The Uniforms of the Neapolitan Army 1806-15 Part III by Colin Allen – First Empire Magazine Issue 15

The Uniforms of the Neapolitan Army 1806-15 Part IV by Colin Allen – First Empire Magazine Issue 16

are still available as back issues see firstempire.net

Hi Shane, I have recently purchased the memoirs of General Pepe, who served in Italy under the French, Parthenopean republic and Joseph and Murat all the way from before Marengo till Tolentino. It has a fair bit of interesting information as to the qualities of generals and various regiments. For instance he states that in 1815 the Hussars, The Gauardia dell corpo and the cavalleggeri were
the best units in the guards, the corrazzieri and the lancieri both being deemed substandard.
It also throws light on the problems faced by the Neapolitans due to Murats habit of promoting people because he liked them, without regard to their capabilities
If you would like more information I will try and help as and when I come across it, just say the sort of things you are onterested in

mate, thank you very much.

I am after any information which might give an insight into the worth of any or all Neapolitan units. Pretty much what I wrote in the first post still stands for me.

Regards,
Shane

rene forthoffer provided some wonderfull information on

the neapolitan army the result of years study

im still after some of the information if anybody has any

for example the regiment of cuirassiers

Ged

GJM FIGURINES

Shane,

I have a "DE BELLO" series book about the Neapolitan Infantry (no Light Inf., no Arty, no Cavalry – unfortunately) at home, and I'm painting a small Neapolitan Army right now. The book is in italian (I am italian) but there is a short english translation at the end. As far as I remember there is a brief history of each foot regiment and several uniform plates.
If you are interested, I can give you more details later on, just let me know
Sergio

mate, I would be indebted to you if you could, I have that series also but sadly ignored the Neapolitan book, I wish I had not.

please, by all means write up here what information you have, this would help not only me but many others wishing to understand that army more.

Regards,
Shane

Crociani, Piero; illustrations by Massimo Brandani. L'ESERCITO NAPOLETANO 1806/15. FANTERIA DI LINEA / NEAPOLITAN ARMY 1806-15: Line Infantry. Serie "De Bello" #6, nine full page color plates, many b/w & color, line drawings, Italian/English. 60 pages. MILANO: EDITRICE MILITARE, 1987.

Gentlemen
the ultimate book on the Neapolitan Army is

GENNARO ALOJA….L ESERCITO DI MURAT RE DI NAPOLI

prefaziona di Cesare de seta edition SUGARCOEDIZIONI with

sumptous colour plates of EVERY unit in Murats army printed

in Milan in 1990 cost me about gbp80.00 then not sure of

the costings now. its the best all in tome i have come

across on probably the most colourfull army of the

napoleonic wars. if your a Neapolitan fan like me beg steal

or borrow to get a copy

regards

Ged

OK Steven has already given the Title and main info on the book I mentioned (thanks Steven, it is exactly that one).
Let me see this evening (local time) what I can do to send you some more info on the line infantry units.

Just visited SUGARCO Edizioni website, but there is no trace of Aloja's book (out of print I guess). Sent them an e-mail, in the meantime I'll ask around to see if I can find it.
Stay tuned!
Sergio

It was available on Abe yesterday for over $300. USD It is still available on viaLibri at a MUCH smaller price!

link

Good Luck.

Some books you may wish to consider:

1-14300 Crociani, Piero illusts by Massimo BrandaniNEAPOLITAN ARMY 1806-15:Line Infantry Serie "De Bello" #6, nine full page color plates,many b/w & color line drawings, Italian/English.1 vol, 60 pgs 1987 MILANO, EDITRICE MILITARE NEW-color softcover ……$20.00

1-55790 Pepe, General MEMOIRS OF GENERAL PEPE General Pepe served as a soldier in the ItalianLegion at Marengo, was promoted to major, then toColonel of the 8th Neapolitan Light Infantry andcommanded a Brigade under Murat, maps/plans, illus1 vol, 284 pgs 1999 UK, WORLEY PUBLICATIONS
NEW-dj ……$15.00 spc

1-999088 088 NAPOLEON'S ITALIAN & NEAPOLITAN TROOPS Osprey Men-At-Arms series, 8 color plates, text.1 vol, 48 pgs 1996 LONDON, OSPREY PUBLISHING NEW-pb ……$13.00

Dennis from OMM
onmilitarymatters.com

hi shane,
I also have the book on the line cavalry from the same series De Bello, unfortunately it is all in italian. so maybe I could scan the plates and useful text and send it to laser 60 who could furnish us with any useful information . I will try and sort it this weekend if Laser 60 is happy to help.Also the First Empire series which i have

GEd what do you want to know about the Corrazieri?

dogs

i have some information.mainly photocopies of rene forthofers work on the unit …….buried deep under
a pile of research. i used to write to rene forthoffer
and when he sadly died i used to write to his wife
i bought loads of stuff (napoleonic as he studied the
neapolitan army under murat for 40 years(gulp) when i get
a moment i will dig up any info i have on them and post
copies too you.please be patient though as time is limited
and im a bit disorganised regarding my files

regards
Ged
ps if i find info i will post on site to share with everybody

dogsbollox

more than happy to help!
I was looking now at the DE BELLO book I have and the english text is some 16 pages (and written soooo small!) so my idea to send you guys an abstract becomes quite a long job.
Shane, exactly what kind of info do you need?

Sergio
P.S. viaLibri has the Aloja but it costs 150 $… ouch!

Hi mate,

I am after any and all information on the Neapolitan army, its composition, full unit paper strengths, its make up and organisation by unit. A full history of each Regiment and what happened to it from 1806 to 1815, what changes were made, what units were name changed or went to form other units etc. My information on the Cavalry is sketchy and the Guard composition and tracking of the history of each unit is blurred.

Also, the Artillery, I did find out it was predominately of captured Austrian origin but information on the Guard artillery is very blurry and inconsistent.

Hello again Shane!

RE: your last post I have a link here to the Italian Wikipedia which ia an article called 'Lista dei Reggimenti Italiani 1800-1815' which I translate as 'List of Italian Regiments 1808-1815'.

It gives an army list of the armies of the various Italian states and the dates those units existed and ceased to exist.

I KNOW, I KNOW one must exercise EXTREME caution with internet sources especially something like Wikipedia as anyone can edit it, however I do have a good feeling about this one as it cites its sources as being from the Virgilio Llari books I mentioned in my post above besides other works by the Italian Historical Section written by that notable same author.

It is in Italian but don't worry as all it is is literally a list of the units in Italian and the dates they existed. All you need to know/have handy are the months of the year in Italian and Italian military terminology, but the latter are so similar to the English equivalent I'm sure you won't have a problem with them and besides you have 'Google Translate' and literally an army of friends and allies on here who I'm sure could help you out if you get stuck.

Good Luck on your research

Dean Shaw

link

jusr an idea may be usefull if everybody combined the
information they had on the Neapolitan Guard Cavalry
as many of the sources are contradictory abd confusing
i have a fair amounton the Lancers of the guard which
is my favourite unit..they must have looked something in
1815 dressed in sky blue lemon and white!!

regards
Ged
i will happily post some info on this board once i get
some time if anyone is interested

Thank you Dean, I saved that link. Every little snippet of information is valuable to me so thank you very much.

Ged,

You hit the nail on the head, the info I have on this army is so frustratingly confusing and contradictory to say the least.

Shane

see what i can do Shane…………

regards

Ged

can i suggest that we only post information that is not included on, or contradicts the written part from the Neapolitan section of the Histofig site, which covers a lot of the basics and more. Otherwise we will have very long posts all repeating the same information.
Also lets divide the posts up into Guard and line cavalry and infantry with artillery as a seperate topic. This should make it easier to channel our information in a logical manner and easy for people to discuss things. If it is all lumped under one it will be very messy. So that is 5 topics or 6 if you want to include militia etc. Any further suggestions? anyone who wants me to email them with scans can you include your e-mails mine is angus.sutherland@ntlworld.com

dogs, that is a great idea. Lets discuss each part of the army in turn and define each unit's composition, recruitment drawn from. Organization and make-up by year if possible. Also, the biggest problem I have with any army is how one unit is amalgamated with another or transferred to another or re-named etc. It is easy to lose track and become confused as to what actually happened. Units disappear or vanish into thin air.

Regards,
Shane

good idea gentlemen……..time permitting i will post specific information on say the neapolitan guard lancers
as to be honest every Neapolitan guard unit is especially
in the cavalry is so different from the next one one post
at a time is all i could manage anyway. or mabye just juicy
titbits may be the answer

regards

Ged

The Sugarco book by aloja is the best. There is also a reprint of period plates from those held at San Martino in Naples. Several of the same prints can also be found in a smaller view in another book on Murat that I purchased in 1970s in Naples. I'll attempt to assist as time permits. I own a number of primary and secondary sources on the neapolitans.
Regarding their fighting ability, you may wish to view the First Empire article on the battle for Gaeta 1815 article. It shines a light on leadership and the troops, who surrendered with honors months after the fall of Murat.
Saluti,
Bob

Bob

feel free to contact me on the Neapolitans as i have some
forthoffer information i would be happy to swap for the "bits" im missing. i have been to Naples 3 times to the
San Martino museum…………….shut or "renovating" every time

regards
Ged
GJM FIGURINES
gjm.figurines@btinternet.com
Gaeta is stirring stuff in the extreme..with good
leadership the Neapolitans fought like lions!!

Ged, what bits are you looking for? Naples does have a funny idea about the concept of time it was shut every time I was there too. Yes Gaeta was another page of glory for the Neapolitans.It also backs up what I have been saying is that the main problem with the Neapolitans was the officers, with good officers like the Germaqn who commanded at gaeta, the neapolitans fought as well as anyone. Especially as it was the 12th regt of line and a ragbag of militia units. The quality of Neapolitan troops tailed off after the 8th Regt. The 9th was formed from the provisional regt based at the main prison at Caserta which also provided the 4th Light. I am sure I have some stuff from Magweb on Gaeta and the capture of Capri somewhere on my 'puter.

hi Dogs…………actually it is the whole Gaeta siege
experience im intereted in as i have uncovered relatively
little and would love to know more

there are loads of other bits …will let you know

appreciate your offer

regards
Ged

GJM FIGURINES

Dodsbollox

also looking for information on the Neapolitan lancers of
teh guard in 1815.when they wore the splendid sky blue lemon
and red uniform!!
operational details etc

regards
Ged

All of this is fascinating. I too was brought up on the biased idea of the Neopolitans as being "chocolate box" soldiers that wouldn't fight, and I am now tempted to get a brigade, or division of them.

they could and did fight well in part at least!!
you cant beat em for panache or colour Chouan!!
read "pepes" memoires if you get a chance

regards
Ged
GJM FIGURINES