"The recession wargaming and you" Topic

With the latest news of the stock market slumping and a prediction of a severe downturn in consumer spending, I left wondering how other people feel it will effect their wargaming?
Luxury items are usually the first things people cut back on, how will this effect miniatures companies? Which ones might be pushed out of business?
Will you be cutting back now or be grabbing all those odds and ends that you've always been meaning to get, just in case those ranges no longer exist when the economy picks up?
At what point would you stop buying figures? Would even contemplate selling off part of your collection to finance other areas of your life.
Will ebay be flooded with even more figures as people find they need the money, or will it dry up because no one is actually buying them?

Miniatures aren't luxury items, their essentials. Like food and stuff :)

Seriously I think most gamers cut back on everything else first before miniatures/hobby purchases.

"Seriously I think most gamers cut back on everything else first before miniatures/hobby purchases."

I would second this. But what could also happen is people remember the 1000s of unpainted figures in their collection and start painting them before getting much new stuff.

Certainly from where I'm coming from, whilst I need to concentrate on painting stuff I have got, the magpie in me is always looking at other stuff and going "Ooo! Shiny!",
So I might cut down on spending, but it wouldn't disappear completely – I'd just try and spend at certain times/shows, rather than every month via the internet.

But I play boardgames as well, which is an extra drain of the funds… :-(

I'd sell off the stuff I haven't touched in a while and streamline the hobby. Old rules books would go as well and anything OOP that I don't play with would go to e-Bay to make some fast cash.

But to be honest I did this exact thing about 3 years ago and boy do I feel as if a weight has been lifted off my chest. I kept within the WWII era and kept only those miniatures, vehicles and scenery that would fit within it. I choose a single rules set to cover all my gaming and just altered it when needed. This streamlining allows for gaming WWII, Weird War II, horror, pulp, adventure, spy, sci-fi, and crime all within the same era without having to buy scenery for different times or different scales. I'll pick up the occasional new mini for special games and campaigns but my day of buying while armies are over. I get allot of gaming outta the same minis with little or no new purchases.

But that's just me,
Brian

I chatted to Bryan Ansell once about how a recession affects the Industry and he was of the opinion that it doesn't much. People tend to cut out buying sofas, cars and new houses but keep their hobby alive as it's cheap and they need something to cheer themselves up with if all about them is doom and gloom.

There is probably something in that.

I'm certainly planning on painting more of the minis I have bought and purchasing less.

Note I said plan rather than doing, so I may well fail in this plan!
Richard

I would look towards other hobbies that cost less or no money after initial outlay. Games Workshop are to blame. They have pushed prices of figures up and up…

I have already panicked and sold all my miniatures.

I can give an example of what I won't be doing…

Last Novemeber I took my kids to Bristol Reveille and I bought 2 pirates just because they liked the look of a picture displayed on a trader's stall. OK, they only cost £5, but they brought them home and have done nothing with them!

IF (and it is a BIG IF) I decide to purchase a range of figures, I will buy one regiment at a time and assemble and paint. If the 'project' just site there they will be sold on ebay or taken to the next available bring and buy!

My days of a hoarding crap are over :)

site=sits … doh!

I'd already decided that this was the year of 'not starting anything new', and I'm hoping to keep to that. That does not preclude me from buying stuff for periods I already have.

If the recession bites personally, then yes, I would not make any big investments or start anything new. It's all very well to claim that these things are not luxuries, but I do have a family to feed and house. I'd certainly hope to continue making smaller purchases: as I'm a slow painter, just getting a few dozen figures could keep me busy for weeks.

I am in the transportation field and we felt the recession long before the politicians or media noticed. Got laid off a while back in the last round of budget cuts. Until I am gainfully employed, as opposed to just making ends meet, no new projects, no mass purchases. Just the occasional paint or brush while I work on reducing the backlog of unpainted lead. If I really want something, I have to sell something else to pay for it.

I've started to re-visit some previous projects adding a few extra bits to finish them off, rather than starting out on new things. That way I can still spend some money on nice things and get the parcels in the post to look forward to but save on major expenditure.

Wargaming was expanding fast during the UK's 1980's recession, so much so that 3 wargame magazines were on the shelves of WH Smiths.

GW may be the worst hit as they rely on younger wargamers, during a recession pocketmoney will be reduced.

i ll buy more to feel better and forget the gloom

sorry to hear that coldsteel.

i hope things will better for you!

well, actually…I'm paring down/trading/selling off SOME things that I'm simply no longer 'interested' in…but not necessarily because of the 'economy'. Times and tastes/interests 'change'.

I have cut BACK on some things…like not being the 'completeist' in getting all figures from EVERY series I'm interested in…and being more 'picky' about what I do get…but once again…it's NOT 'just' the economy.

The recent/just yesterday in fact, announcments by Blue Moon and Hydra about more spacepulp stuff has gotten me very excited/I immediately purchased one new set (out of 12 or so??) of figures! 8-)

But on the other TENTACLE…look at some of the changes in the industry related to 'softer economy'…buyers 'tastes', etc…such as the whole 'SST' thing with Mongoose, the pushing back of new figures/sets/series by Wizkids and many things put on 'hiatus/hold' by WOTC/Wizkids and others…and the rising price of tin, plastics and transportation.

All of that plays a role in the overall 'market' for miniatures as well as everything else.

But just like some folks will 'cut back' on some 'luxuries'…(like going out to dinner/movies/trips, etc)…I consider some new 'miniatures' or epoxy or 'spare bits'…more of a NECESSITY…for my MENTAL HEALTH and (dubious) sanity…as well as giving me something positive to do for recreation/taking my mind off problems….

It's also healthier, more socially acceptible and less dangerous/costly than setting up a portable/mobile 'drug lab'….besides, I NEED my cold medicine 'as is', I can't bother 'wasteing' it for designer/recreational chemistry!!!!

JUST KIDDING!

I have enough trouble getting the right mixture of blue-yellow ribbon epoxy without 'lumps'….no way I'd try anything more 'exotic'!

I think I'll go lay down and nap for a bit….I stayed up too late watching 'Life after People' last night…

*slish…slish*

The "recession" isn't having much impact on my buying and gaming habits but paying off all the debts my ex straddled me with in our recent divorce is. Been selling off unused portions of my collection and going into new periods on a much more limited basis than I used to. Happily I have my finances structured so that I will have my divorce debts paid off in about 3 years and then I can go back to my usual spendthrift ways when it comes to wargaming.

Dave

I did well last year – finished all the medieval figures I bought & quite a lot of the SYW British. Failed to start the 6mm WW2 armies I bought at Salute & have quite a lot of Moghuls outstanding. I probably averaged two units every three weeks & unusually they are painted, based & issued with flags.
From previous years still have New Kingdom Egyptian, Gauls & quite a few Macedonian Successor units awaiting the paintbrush.
This lot insulates me from recession pretty well as I guess I could paint for at least two years without purchasing anything except more paints & some glue.
Still – figures will not get cheaper & there is lots still to buy – & figure quality is improving year on year so my visit to Salute should leave me three or four hundred pounds lighter.
My wifes hobby is making stained glass windows (as well as buying clothes). With the various courses she has been on I am fairly sure she has spent upwards of £1,500.00 GBP Wargaming is still a cheap hobby compared to most others & you may not want to sell your possessions but they still have a value which can be realised if needed.
So… Recessions are unlikely to affect my spending on my hobby.

Mostly energy costs, and to a lesser extent, the exchange rate are killing new purchases in my case. I'll probably reduce hobby spending by 80-85% this year.

Wargamers are a different breed of consumer. We are more akin to drug addicts who don't stop with economic downturns.

Funny, I was thinking about this very topic this AM on my way to work, listening to the news about the carnage in overseas stock markets.

Here in the US, the Gov't is talking about mailing every taxpaying consumer a check for $800… I wonder how much of that I could siphon off for my addiction, er, hobby?

Seriously, I've already cut back a little on hobby spending with the rise in gas prices, food at the grocery store, and drop in the value of the $US; However, I don't see myself cutting back more unless things get 'really bad', like job-loss.

At a macro level, larger companies like GW may be hit harder in a consumer pullback; smaller companies that don't have shareholders to assuage may fare better.

I would say that the 'recession' is having an affect on home and work, but not on my modelling or wargaming. 2007 saw me spend less than in previous years, but I felt that this was down to attending shows but not seeing anything I wanted.

2007 also saw one other change in my buying habits – I am now buying more from the net/ebay etc.

Tony

If I get $800 USD bucks,I'm gonna save it and not spend it,just to be contrary. My spending habits have already changed dramatically last year with the arrival of our little one,and my wife staying home.Now I mostly get new stuff by first painting figures for others at a very good rate.Once I've earned the "credit",I tell them what I want. I spend very little household money on the hobby.The good thing is that I really enjoy painting,so its not a bother to me to do a bunch of stuff for others first,and I dont have to feel guilty about new stuff.

The one difference that has changed this year is that I'm looking at smaller scales in metal and plastic figures.

I normally game in 28mm & 40mm – this year I'm looking at 6mm Naps and 20mm plastic ancients. You can build a decent sized army for £30, instead of £100+

It just requires a change of mindset…

I placed a lot of orders towards the end of last year and already spent a fair amount of money in the first few weeks of this year too. So far my spending is on track or set to exceed 2007. I'd only limit spending and sell my miniatures in a serious manner if I was unemployed and had the time. I wouldn't let it stop me from gaming, building and painting.

How's that saying go, "A recession is when your neighbor is out of work, a depression is when you're out of work"?

I am buying less and tackling that lead pile. I will still make that "gotta have" purchase though.

For me space is more the issue than money. It has cut down my travel to conventions etc. (although having kids is still the bigger impediment).

But it is big ticket items that are off the list now – not $50 USD worth of figs.

Well, I'm doing a 200K extension on my house starting next month. Since we are having to make my game room a temporary kitchen for the next 5-6 months there does not seem to be much reason to buy a lot of new stuff this year. Well, except for a stock of those Perry ACW plastics (and anything else that catches my fancy of course). The main problem this year will just be storage for any new purchases that add to the lead mountain. As a result of the impending works I've decided to spend more time board wargaming this year than doing miniatures.

If a really bad turn comes (job loss) I've already consulted with my wife and there are certain periods and figs on the chopping block, bills come before minis. We don't spend much anyway, paying down debt ala Dave Ramsey, so my purchases are mostly for the odd building or paint and brush. My "big" purchase for the year, gaming wise, was Duffy's "Russia's Military Way to the West" and that combines b-day, xmas, etc; I'm pretty much done for the year unless I get $$ selling things on ebay. I've got a box of lead sitting here that has to get done first. My airsoft gear will probably go before gaming though. As for the $800/1600 check, that's allocated to the car payment already.

Most wargamers may not make enogh money to be heavily involved in the market. A few are based on their posts on the subject.

However the slowdown and higher prices for gas andfood has hit the average gamer a lot earlier than just now. We saw effects at all the shows in 2007.

Honestly sales were just recovering from the post 9/11 drastic decline, when several membership programs for selling miniatures hit the small retailer (such as myself) hard.

So overall sales do not seem to have been very strong in the historical market for several years. This weekend is Siege of Augusta (Ga) which is my first show of the year. It is often a good indicator for the year.

Nelson Time Portal

During the last recession (the late 80s/early 90s one) I tried to sell some of my figures but struggled to find anybody looking to buy figures (ebay of course probably changes that now) but during those dark days painting my figures (the huge lead mountain I had collected) proved to be quite a cheap option compared to going out for a drink, etc.

So, I will spend more time at home painting and reducing the lead mountain of unpainted figures – not sure I will buy any new figures though if the recession hits.

Yes, lets hope that 800 dollar bonus from our federal government isn't a short term loan.

I think it will hurt your FLGS badly and couple that with the 4th Edition D&D announcement killing off all the 3.5 sales could be a huge disaster for that market.

As far as manufacturers go I would hate to be at the high end of pricing and be a seller of armies and not just character figures.

I've cut back a little on my buying, but not much. The area I've really cut back on, unfortunately, is buying miniatures from the UK. With the pound where it is versus the dollar, I just can't justify very many purchases. That sucks, as there are some amazing things I really WANT to buy from the UK, but just can't justify it.

If and when the dollar rises back from monopoly money status, I'll be back buying from the fine UK manufacturers.

Traditionally, as the economy worsens, hobbies are the second last thing to get cut. The very last thing is money spent on home improvements. The only question will be how much money will be spent by us on our hobby. One can see a wide range of answers here.

Probably not effect overall spending much – most of the regular hobby buying is so cheap (!). £3.00 GBP for a magazine here, £5.00 GBP on paints there, a new brush for £2, and so on.

Bulk figure purchases and new game sytems are probably hurt more, but most people don't start a total new army every couple of months (do they ??).

I actually plan to spend more this year than ever.

However the slowdown and higher prices for gas andfood has hit the average gamer a lot earlier than just now. We saw effects at all the shows in 2007.

Less food = More miniatures

Easy equation and good for you, too.

I may have to give up drugs, guns, liquor, and rented women to support my minis habit.

I will probably buy less figures but other things would go first.

If I get laid off, I will actually be able to get paint some of my lead pile. Also I might reduce the loft insulation (several hundred plastic kits).

On a selfish point, there my be some bargains to be had. I am waiting for the next Wargames Foundry sensible prices offer.

Recession or not, my gaming plans for this year are already set. I've already got more than enough paint and figures to use the paint on. Aside from swimming to Salute or walking to Historicon, I don't think I can pare my expenses for those shows much more.
I supplement my meager pension with some part time work. If the recession comes about, I may not get asked to work as frequently, but having me "on call" for a weekend is still cheaper than flying someone down from the main office to cover the site. Oddly enough, that company's stock is actually up today, so maybe they are recession proof.

My hobby spending is taking a hit as my employment expires on the 31st January. Gotta find a new job (before Salute), so I can feed my addiction, and I do have 1000s of 28mm unpainted lead to keep me busy in the meantime.

If I were to lose my job, you're damn right I'd cut back on my minis. And on food, beer, and all that other stuff that eats up my paycheck.

Barring that, however, I doubt my plans will change much. I've already decided to focus on painting what I've got rather than buying new stuff.

Fortunately, I'm now working in the oil & gas industry and things are looking pretty good for us.

As Dickens illustrated in "Hard Times" people need entertainment as much as they need food and housing.

Wargaming is not an expensive hobby. Most people could give up a holiday once a year and pay for everything they need, or if the wife disagrees with that then keep the car an extra year, or buy a cheaper replacement washing machine, and so on.

It's big purchases that tend to get cut back on first because they save the most money.

When times get harder, folks turn more to their little pleasures. Hobby industries will always be with us.

Sounds like most of us are set for a win/win.

Keep my job, buy more figures.

Lose my job, paint more figures.

I better get back to work or I'll be painting more figures soon.

I'd say times will get tougher for the FLGS. Anyone reseller who is sitting on a pile of d20/3.5 books can feel secure in knowing they'll have plenty to burn this winter to keep them warm.

As Irishserb mentioned, the exchange rate has done far more to dampen my spending than the recession. More impulsive items that I would be encouraged to purchase if the exchange rate were better are all gone right now.

As for new purchases I have done very little outside of using OG15's 40% sale discount last year to round out my 15mm Napoleonics.