"Spinespur - a review" Topic

Here's a review of Spinespur I posted on RPG.net, for general interest:

Die mechanic is 3d6, you've got one die of a different color called the Blood Die. It's used to settle disputes and determine weapon damage, among other things. Roll the bones, add 'em together, add or subtract modifiers. Infinity has me preferring a d20, but it doesn't use a Warhammer mechanic so that's okay.

Each player nominates a figure to be in charge for the round, roll and add a stat to determine who has "control." Controller says who goes first. First player activates one unit, performs actions, then the other player moves a unit.

Figures get two Actions per turn, Actions are either full or half. Full actions are things like move, melee, shoot, move and melee, move and shoot, cast a spell. An action can be split into two half actions, which don't have to be consecutive (so you could do a half action, a full action, then the other half action). Half actions are things like step (move up to an inch), stand up/go prone, open/close something, scavenge, drop something, lock on to a target, rip out a thrown weapon (from your own body or another), or reload.

Setting is a "pocket universe" city, where very naughty people are kept. There are two bits of opening fiction that tell a little bit about the place and its history – a good overview is the "Hurst" link on the website. The book's intro fiction is about a guy named Ernest (you can figure out exactly who Ernest is through clues in the story and the ending picture) talking to the subtle-as-a-brick Lucius Sipher (yeah, I groaned too, though further information indicates that looks can be deceiving) about Spinespur. Second story is about one of the protectors of Spinespur before it was called Spinespur.

The minis aren't bad, either. Choice figs are Mr. Jingles, Pigskin, and Martin Greygun (he's a nearly spot-on Duke Nukem and will be rather useful in other games).

Statistics
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Stalk – how far you move. Pretty straightforward.
Aggr – Models' aggressiveness. Supposed to represent the model's raw strength and not its combat skill, determines melee damage.
Brawl – Model's close-combat skill.
Aim – Model's ranged combat skill.
Reaction – Model's defensive skill.
Mental Fortitude – Model's ability to resist thing like magic.
Grit – Model's leadership/fear resistance ability.

There's also health and identifiers for living/dead/construct and has a soul/doesn't have a soul (important for a few attacks and powers), and the sex of the model.

Most models have at least one special ability, which is pretty standard stuff – one might grant a model to use two close-combat attacks, another grants the model an additional Fear Token each turn, and still another lets a model make one final attack and then slip away into the shadows, leaving the battle. There are many different abilities, about six pages worth.

Combat
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The to-hit and damage roll are combined into one, sorta like Silent Death. If an attack strikes home (3d6 + brawl/aim vs 3d6 + Resist), the Blood Die determines what kind of a hit it was (low is better). A number of special melee attacks can provoke what amount to an attack of opportunity (for instance, you can make a trip attack, and the defender gets a free counterattack before you perform the trip). One cute mechanic is "scavenging" where you can pick up a weapon from a dead body. Want that guy's chainsaw? Kill him and take his stuff!

Fear
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Fear tokens are generally granted by figure abilities, and can be used for a number of effects. They can be used to change facing (if someone moves out of LOS, for instance a model moves to your rear arc), restore health on a 1-to-1 basis, cast or maintain certain spells, bolster die rolls, or perform rerolls.

Regions
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The regions area could use a little expansion, as it's just over three pages. It gives a brief descripton of the regions of Spinespur. Each region has some mandatory and optional rules that add some interest to the game (for instance, in one region, the police can show up and put a halt to all combat actions for a turn, and in another, rolling 6-6-6 means the model simply vanishes in the corn). The regions of Spinespur are Hellheart (government area, the only "nice" part of town), the lands (sewer system), Ghetto (run-down buildings), the Scrapyards (a big junkyard), and the Tainted Fields. A little more description of the town would be nice – for instance, I asked on the forum regarding the layout of Spinespur, and it turns out that the whole thing is like a big bullseye with Hellheart at the center. I'd like to see more detail on the different regions and possibly a little info on suggested terrain – the book is filled with photographs of the game in action, and they've done some very nice urban terrain. A little how-to would be appreciated!

Forcebuilding
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There are three different methods of building a force – Open, Philosophy, and Agenda. Every model has a "philosophy" (malevolent, uncorrupted, indifferent, calculating, psychotic) and many have an Agenda, which is generally tied to whichever Senator the model works for (Senators are always named models, like Mr. Jingles and the Anti-Pope). The only restriction in an Open build is that you can't have two models with opposing philosophies (malevolent/uncorrupted). In a Philosophy build, all of the models must have the same philosophy (everybody's malevolent, for example) and you'll get a small point bonus to your force build. An Agenda build, all figures must have the same Agenda and you gain a specific Agenda Bonus. You can't claim both a Philosophy Build bonus and an Agenda Bonus for the same force.

It looks like 100 points would be a pretty good starting fight, and 200 points would put a lot of models on the table.

Forces
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Dark Faith – eeeeebul church. Ebul pope, ebul cardinals, ebul nuns, plus zombies. If ebul church is your thing, this has got you covered.

Akrons Institution – Dr. Frankenstein mixed with Jekyll and Hyde. Interesting intro fiction, rather amusing. Dr. Akron runs an eeebul hospital (he doesn't necessarily think he's evil, and actually thinks he's helping). You get Dr. Akron, who can turn into a big monster, golems of various shapes and sizes, and Hack (think Jason Voorhees and you've got it down pat).

Men of G.O.D. – theoretically good guys, this faction pounds the snot out of Evil. They're Men In Black, for all intents and purposes – they use higher tech weaponry and have medic figures.

Slaughterhouse – Here's your standard slasher-flick faction. This group lives on a pig farm out in the Tainted Fields and is led by Pigskin. The faction includes farmhand-type figures and giant killer pigs.

Others – Here we've got the "nonaligned" figures. Stuff like generic thugs, mercenaries, and Mr. Jingles. I wonder if some of the named figures in the Others section won't get their own Agendas later on. The Caretaker and Mr. Jingles are both listed as Senators, for instance.

I'm hoping to get a chance to play in a week or so, but my first impressions are quite positive. The book itself really is for the "mature" set (I'm thinking of the Mr. Jingles fiction in particular – it's good, but it ain't for the kids). The gameplay has no mechanics that could be considered offensive, so it could be RUN for just about anybody.

Nice review, thanks.

Can't help but wonder why the faction bosses are called Senators…is there a congress somewhere, or were they all DC-area baseball players before they wound up in Spinespur? And who would have thunk Guaranteed Overnight Delivery also did black ops in alternate dimesions?

When it absolutely, positively has to get to a pocket dimension overnight, accept no substitutes!

Extra charges for dimensional shift may apply. Please note there are currently delays transferring packages to Valhalla and Ravenloft, due to labor strikes.

I should be reading that commercial in Rod Serling's voice, right? :)

I have been waiting in the wings, not sure if my thoughts on Spinespur would be appropriate or relavant to anyone, but this review has given me reason to speak on the subject at hand.

By the reviewer's data extract there is little to be seen as over the top disgusting or x-rated. The game play seems to be useful and fluid with interesting high points. The miniatures if the game, the process of gang building is appropriate.

So one has to ask, why?

Why the fluff that is over the top and is on the fence for x-rated?

I read the comfychair rebut on the subject from a few days ago on this site within another thread. The reasoning was there.

Sometimes reasoning is like seasoning; little to much or not enough of any given element and you have spoiled the soup.

So if the game mechanics worked,if the miniatures were in place, and if the playability was sound why add the bits that were sure to offend?

Allow me one more analogy to better express my thoughts:

Halloween the original movie. The movie's villian is well known; Michael Myers. This freak of nature is some sort of demonic avatar that kills, maims, and all in all is a pretty poor example of a good guy. He is bad as they come. This character fits well within the premise of the noted game. Now the first movie in all it's Carpenter glory, if the movie allowed for Dr. Loomis to describe in great detail the various things young Michael may have done with his dog, victims, and/or fellow inmates/nurses/doctors in reference to some sexual nature…would the film be what it is today?

Ok ok ok, the critics would have shut it down and the blurb from before noted that the game would never make it to film due to this very subject…but was the game fluff that has raised so many hackles really needed to express the sheer despair of being stuck in the game?

It would have seemed that a "reference to things worse then any nightmare or darker/colder then space…etc." would have sufficed. The underground style of fetish details were and honestly still are beyond over the top.

In the past 30+yrs I have seen games come and go. Most have something interesting to offer, some did not. Some hit many homeruns but still failed to remain on the market for so many reasons. A strange name that no one but you understands (not yours, just making a point). A overly complex game system that takes 4-5 days to make a character and 2-3 hours to complete 1 round of combat. Too simple. Not enough art or even worse, bad art. Poor editing. Etc. Etc. Etc.. If making a game is a race. You prepare, you train, and you practice. Come race day you are rested and ready as you can be. You are sponsored and the hopes of your family, friends, and your personal goals are on the line. You show up in a clown suit, without pants, and a gun with one bullet. The race starts and you shoot yourself in the foot. Well done. Great effort training. You should have placed, maybe won. But at least you made the point, your point.

Wait a minute, did you make a point? The idea is that the setting is so horrific, so terrible, that to express this in its' greatest and most effective way…your writers or designers or who ever came up with the fluff that offends.

Was the point to paint an interesting image on a shop window full of detail and precise lines…and then throw a handful of fresh manure on it to express the emotion behind the art? Why not a brick?

Were you guys so drained by the process of creation that all you had left was the noted fluff? If the game does not focus of the said fluff and its contents, then why have it at all? Your game doesn't focus on a lot of disgusting things,yet there isn't fluff that details those acts of horror and grossness.

Congratulations. You spent the time to create an interesting game, seemily good mechanics, and familiar yet creepy miniatures…and actually made the miniatures instead of saying you would and slowly release them. You guys did all this and then in the final moment, added an element that you KNEW would not be acceptable and that you KNEW would make your product a vanity project instead of a viable game. Congratulations.

Your chance to make a skirmish game with great horror elements and potential, flushed away (at least for me,and to tell you the truth I wish anyone making games and miniatures the very best because it is such a small market and it is so hard to get a foothold at all) because of a gross out gimick.

This is a case where the full monty did not need a background story of why. Sometimes a little mystery and shadow works far better than a money shot.

Good luck with your game…I would recommend that you pull the fluff while you can and give yourself a chance to make a success of your game and your extented efforts.

The soap box is yours, and I do not need to know what you did last night or saw last week in tijuana for you to make a point about the game…see how that works? Make a point without details that serve no real purpose other than to stir the pot.

By the way…had I never heard of Spinespur and had only read the review from above I would be more than happy to follow up on this game…but I read the fluff that was so gleefully provided before.

Shame, it looked like a fun game.

Ummm…did I miss a memo or something? Is there some sort of major issue with the game's background fluff? Didn't get that from the review, beyond a minor caution that the book isn't for kids. Someone got a link to whatever 28mmMan is talking about?

Hundvig, from what I remember of the earlier thread there are references to deviant sexual practices etc

Hundvig…you do not want to read it. As they say it does not have any real connection to the game, only to the background despair of being stuck in their slice of hell. Stick with the review and give the game a try if you see it at a con or demo…sans the fluff.

Perhaps 28mmMan, you're underestimating the attraction of the forbidden. True, the game may be shutting out GW's target market of 9-12 year-olds, but teenaged or slightly older gamers might, I suggest, be more intrigued by the warning on the rulebook then if the warning was not there. I remember the excitement of sneaking into R rated movies when I was underage. Or absconding with a beer or two from the old man's fridge before a high school party.

It is, after all, a game of horror. Recent horror movies, not films from the 80s, have become quite more graphic and extreme. There's nothing left to the imagination on celluloid anymore. If the game purports to be a modern horror film transfered to the gaming table, then "reference to things worse then any nightmare or darker/colder then space…etc." wouldn't work.

That being said, I haven't read the fluff in question, so maybe I'm arguing just for the sake of arguing! :)

In Spinespur's defence and adding to what Tony S says above, the 'fluff' is somewhat nasty in places but certainly nothing worse than any recent horror film on the grittier end of the spectrum- the likes of Silent Hill, Hostel, The Devil's Rejects, Wrong Turn, The Ordeal, the Hills remakes etc- some even harks back to the original Texas Chainsaw Massacre (Slaughterhouse and the Cornfields). Or in recent horror comics and games (everyone else notice the Manhunt and The Suffering nods?).

Frankly if you are not a fan of this kind of darker material then the game may not be for you. Personally I am and I love it- fast, solid mechanics; lots of character abilities and a very dark setting combined with some lovely miniatures. I'm personally very pleased to have the 'darker' background materials- this is a horror game afterall and it all fits.

As an aside it always amuses me on TMP, just like in real life I suppose, that people are willing to post an opinion on something they haven't actually read. Funny how a lot of media commentators do the same thing when calling for censorship of horror films (the recent storm in a teacup over Saw3 and Hostel being a case in point).

In the end, it's obviously a horror game and it has a rather obvious '17+' sticker on the cover- if this doesn't give you an idea of the contents I don't know what more can be done. I can look at the cover of a GW rulebook or LOTR or whatever and know it's not for me. I don't then log on to TMP and have a honk at the ridiculous fluff of the latest 40K release but heh that's me.

The only fluff that gave me pause was Mr. Jingles'. It's fairly intense, and definitely not something the younger set should be exposed to. The dude is basically John Wayne Gacy, if that tells you anything, and likes to indulge in Gacy's particular sexual vices. It was well-written fluff, it's just intense and gives you a very good idea of just how bad a man Mr. Jingles is.

If you can handle reading about Gacy, you can handle Jingles.

All of the rest of the fluff is pretty standard "horror" fare – the fluff for Dr. Akron even has Frankenhooker, for goodness sake.

But like I said, the game mechanics themselves are perfectly suitable for all ages, as long as you give the "occult" mechanics a pass – and quite frankly, if you have issue with the occult in your games, you're not going to be looking at Spinespur in the first place.

If anybody wants a further description of the Jingles fluff, head over to RPG.net and register, then send me a private message. I'm registered under the same name there, and I've got a thread on Spinespur in the Other Games Open forum. Obviously I can't copy-and-paste the fluff, but I'll give you the details.

i read some of the posts and think to myself "if people don't want to acknowledge the fluff.. they dont HAVE to". They are passing on a good game just because they wont want to read about certain aspects about it? None of the rules have the models committing perverse acts on other models.

about Senators, they are basically "leaders" of their Agenda/groups/gangs/bands. For example Pigskin controls the meat processing plants that supplies the other senators with food. Each of the Senators have a seat of power and a special role in the senate.

One small correction to 28mmMan's post.

The setting came before the game mechanics, before the miniatures, before the artwork. The setting was my creation as a RPG and was then developed into a game.

Great Review Thorhammer! Thank you. I am happy to see someone who bought the book give insight rather than speculation.

It is, after all, a game of horror. Recent horror movies, not films from the 80s, have become quite more graphic and extreme. There's nothing left to the imagination on celluloid anymore.

Which is why most of the horror movies put out in the last decade are pure garbage. Shocking effects and brutality are a poor substitute for good storytelling and a director who understands how to build dramatic tension. Learning to scare people without disgusting them is a talent Hollywood seems to have forgotten.

If you can handle reading about Gacy, you can handle Jingles.

The only way I'd want to "handle" Gacy would be with a cattle prod, followed by a noose and a good tall tree to hang him from. This game wants to celebrate that sort of thing, I think I'll pass on it altogether, no matter how good the game mechanics may be. No reason at all to support anything that tasteless, thanks.

Rich

first we are talking about mini games not movies. it's hard to make a game "dramatic and suspenseful" without making it almost an RPG type of game.

i think its pretty ironic that you can't handle a "grim" setting of a game but you delightfully describe what you would do to a certain human being.

You mean a reader likens someone to someone else (because that's how they personally perceive something) and you see that as a celebration of the person they likened it to?

That strikes me as odd. I'm figuring that criteria seriously limits the miniatures games you play or movies you watch. After all most WWII games involve Nazis, Warhammer 40K basically uses the Bible myths as a foundation with Horus as "the fallen angel." Playing with or against Chaos would then make all those people devil worshipers? After all, they are in your words celebrating Nazis and Lucifer.

People do horrific acts daily. I just watched the Tom Selleck movie "An innocent man" and some of the scenes there were more graphic than the jingles fluff piece. The Jingles fluff piece in question is a page and a half long and the acts he commits take place in another room where you only hear a man screaming. No in depth descriptions, its left to the mind of the reader from sounds of a ruckus and the words of an enraged evil clown.

I'm not telling you to buy the book, it may not be for you. However I do ask that you don't completely condemn it without seeing all the facts for yourself. I know people who believe Homosexuals should be put to death or that Jewish people are the devil. Had I gone completely by their words instead of meeting a Homosexual or a Jew then I'd be as ignorant of the situation as them and reacting off of their personal prejudices.

Please understand, I'm not trying to insult you even though your conclusion aims at insulting me by saying I'm celebrating Gacy. What I'm trying to say is if you don't like something, that's totally cool. Just be sure it's for your reasons and not what you heard from someone else.

For starters, I can honestly tell you I didn't have John Wayne Gacy in mind when writing the story for Mr. Jingles. If he was purposefully based off Gacy, we probably would have named him "Pogo The Clown," which was the actual stage name/clown name/whatever JW Gacy used. Jingles is a reprehensible human being, nothing more and nothing less. Any coincidence to other reprehensible human beings is -- in HIS case -- genuinely coincidental. There are characters in Spinespur inspired by real people, but, as the writer of the Jingles story, I can tell you he isn't one.

I think anyone who takes the time to read all the fiction in the book (rather than getting a second-hand recap of it from people on-line) will understand that very very little of what anyone in Spinespur does is being "celebrated" by these stories. These characters and their acts are being presented, that is all. Most of the time, in fact, the characters are very obviously and blatantly being *condemned* rather than anything else for their actions.

Jingles, in particular, is hardly being "celebrated" (as John Wayne Gacy or otherwise). In fact, he's set up by us to very specifically be one of the least likeable characters in the game, and is never really presented in any sort of positive light. In the notes Comfychair sent me one of the lines that really stuck out was "this guy's got all seven deadly sins in him," and I took that and ran with it.

Anyone that is refusing the chance for a demo (or even their own casual read-through) of this game just because they heard someone else tell them something about the fluff is, I think, missing out. Contrary to what 28mmMan might think of our character, we're not going to be going to anyone's house and holding a gun to your head and forcing you to read anything. If you don't like what you've heard, that's fine, you don't like what you've heard. But I think you'd be making a mistake to turn your nose up at an entire book based on a snippet or two of the fluff you've heard secondhand (amidst reviews praising the game system itself).

Hopefully we'll see some of you guys at Gencon. And if you don't swing by the booth (and give my boss extra work to do), that'll be fine, too -- have a good time with whatever games you play.

The Comfy chair guys did what they wanted to do. What they really wanted to do. There's enough "not for everyone" stuff in that background to be assured of that.

That's the way:
a) you please yourself as a designer (and it is a luxury)
b) you get to really please the folks who have similar views – even if that excludes others.

To me, that's better than vaguely pleasing more people, for whom it will be just another game.
That's how you get fans, and I hope they get some. I'd be getting into Spinespur if I wasn't heavily into another project at the moment, but I'll certainly get some figs at one point.

Anyhow, I think the choice not to change the initial background must be respected, and I hope it'll work well for them. Liking it or not is another subject.
And it's not as if you couldn't bypass the fluff and go for a more "teenage horror" flavour with the rules/figs.

Homosexual rape makes a game "not for me." I only play games with themes like Eugenics, racial strife, good old hetero rape and Exterminatus.

I quite like the weird off the wall approach to Spinespur.
That review was very well done and has given me a good insight into the game.
I've heard different "opinions" on the fluff and that's all they are. These guys have made a game "They" wanted to make rather than pandering to an already over-filled market.
I've got a lot of respect for that.
I also respect other people's views on what is for them and what isn't.If you don't fancy it, don't buy it!!!
I like the sound of the game and from the review it looks like the rules have a lot of merit aswell. Too often you get games with awesome fluff but the game itself lacks any substance.
I have ordered my rules and minis ( being in the UK I'm still waiting) and I am looking forward to giving them a bash.

Regards
PM

Before it seems like there is something personal with the noted game/its writers/designers/etc. and myself I can assure you that there is not.

Does it matter what I think about the game,not really. After all I am just a blank face in the sea of internet masks. But I am not hiding some agenda.

At the very first post for Spinespur I was quite interested.
Second posts with upcoming miniatures, I was still interested.
By this time the game was being discussed in this Horror forum and I was sure that a skirmish game that I assumed at the time would allow for Freddy, Jason, Michael, and just about any other horror killer freak from movies/TV/book/manga/etc. to be played with matching support gangs…and that totally rocked…I was completely on board…in fact I wanted to sculpt miniatures to fit within this realm of modern horror hell on where it was.

Then the promise of background story and full explaination of what was to come from the game came out.

I read it. Confused I consulted a few of my long time game buddies and asked them to read it and see if it was just me reading between the lines or was the fluff of a nature that it seemed to be. It was across the board seen as "I can not believe they are going to print this", read by a dozen at least at the same time at different parts of the world.

So is it me? Is it the people I call friends? Do we see the world with blinders and do not get the big picture? In fact I catch hell for even commenting on the subject; it has been compared to ordering a _hit sandwich and then complaining that it tastes bad. So why continue commenting?

Because I want to like the game.

Skirmish is my prefered game. I like horror. I like gang type situations (gorka morka, necromunda, etc.). I want to like the game guys, I really do.

The nod towards GW and its chaos product is an interesting comparision, and here is why I think so…

I only played chaos and usually warbands of Slaanesh. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slaanesh

Now anyone who has played GW WHFB or 40K will tell you that the forces of Slaanesh are all about pleasure and excesses that almost always relate to sexual tastes and practices. Sounds perfect for Spinespur. Here is where the difference begins to expand in leaps and bounds. The forces of Slaanesh are twisted sexual pleasure freaks that can and do just about anything to satisfy their bizzare extreames. If the fluff for Slaanesh had described these acts of fetish freakness then I would have been put off and would have moved on to something else. I liked the miniatures and the idea of the forces of Slaanesh marching into battle smiling and laughing all the way, looking forward to battle without regard to life and limb they were fearless, it was just another pleasure to experience…that is it. The fluff that I read, not heard about, from the Spinespur background went to far with details that were not required to make the point; period.

The Spinespur game sounds like fun. I want to make (Brom themed) Marilyn Manson gang, or beastman packs prowling the streets, or half mechanical self surgery freaks looking to change the world, or whatever…I wanted to play this game.

Remove the excessive and by the game designer/writer's own comments "not relative to the game or the game play" and you will have a customer.

If you do not want my money or my support then keep the fluff and stand by it.

By no means should you bend to the will one critic, but what you have done goes beyond what was needed to make your point.

"SPINESPUR: a horror themed miniatures skirmish game that focuses a spotlight of darkness on the most twisted demented elements that man can imagine. Gangs of evil cultists, packs of beastmen, bizzare monsters, killer clowns, and even a few brave mundanes battle in this hellish world. If you are ready for a mature themed miniatures game that brings the best of all elements of modern horror media then step up and choose your faction. Hell waits for no man."

There I said the same thing you did. Makes me want to start on a gang right now.

Add the fluff, that is not needed…we all know it is a bad place and it sucks to be there… and you lose people.

With a small market and an even smaller share within the same, it seems that oyu guys are not interested in making the most of what potential this game offers and instead it seems that there is some point to be made.

I must have missed it.

Remove the fluff. Make more money. And grant yourselves a measure of success.

So in closing: I wanted to play, I would like to play, but I do not want to be the guy who plays "that game". Remove the fluff (we are talking about 100-150 words maybe) and I will support this venture 100%…until that happens enjoy your 15 minutes and know that in 3-5 years you can join the list of hundreds that created games to see them flushed away…but in this case you filled and flushed your own bowl…enjoy.

Dear Lord- the arrogance here at TMP is astounding! First the moral outrage (think of the children!) followed by the above. Seriously do you people have nothing better in your lives?

28mmMan- you said it yourself- 100-150 words max- if you really wanted to play the game ignore Jingles' background section or Magic Marker it out CIA style or whatever. I'm also actually intrigued by how you and "a dozen at least" of your friends managed to read the Jingles section without purchasing the rulebook? Or is it another section you are now taking issue with? Or did you actually read it at all?

Your arrogance in asking (apparantly seriously) that Comfy Chair remove the 'offending' fluff so that you will support the game is shocking. Don't we have an inflated self opinion! I might try the same… ah Infinity, always wanted to play it but didn't like the guys on the unibikes, ah Corvus can you can those guys and I'll jump aboard. I mean seriously!

To then gaze into your magic eight ball and declare the company will be 'flushed away' in a number of years because of the Jingles material is equally disturbing. Your last paragraph shows a lot of spite which is a) uncalled for and b) very over the top. Why the viciousness? Do you have shares in the company?!

Intriguing that the two individuals with the greatest 'issue' with the 'extreme' material also resort to using 'extreme' language themselves- what with the hanging of Gacy and now filling bowls and flushing them- yum.

Comfy Chair- I'm a very satisfied customer (all the way here in Australia) and love the background, the system and the miniatures. I applaud you for taking the plunge into more adult themes- I'll be a supporter for the long run.

@28

Its funny how you play a game aimed at the adolescent teen and say the following
"The forces of Slaanesh are twisted sexual pleasure freaks that can and do just about anything to satisfy their bizzare extreames."

And thats OK, because none of the fluff says it happens, but its a known piece of the unspoken "history".
Comfy Chair says right off the bat, its not for everyone, its still not. If you and your gang are hung up on the one or two pieces of fluff,please go back to playing "twisted sexual pleasure freaks" and quit bashing a game you haven't played.

When i played 40k actively i heard MANY homosexual references between the armies of Slannesh and what they would do the offending MALE models. As written above just because it's not in print doesn't mean players do not say it out loud. Mind you this just isn't my group which i will admit we are a pretty weird bunch but this was at GW tournaments such as grand tournies and gamesdays.

if one piece of fluff is really bothering you. Rip it out of the book you are only going to take out the grave golem page anyway. You won't lose any stats because are on the back of the book anyway. Also you only point out ONE example in the whole book, did you bother to read all the other stories in the book?

don't get me wrong if you dont like the game because you weren't fond of a game mechanics or you just didn't have a feel for it thats fine. But you make it seem like that is the only thing holding you back from even trying this game is the mention of Jingles. If homosexuality bothers you so much why didn't you ALSO bring up the short description in the Sisters of Obscenity… or you only hate male/male homosexuality? which i find is pretty hypocritical.

The nod to Slaanesh was the most extreme thing I could think of that has made it past the gaming sensor culture and comfychair mentioned it.

The interesting thing is that I was not "hung up" on the Mr Jingles…disgusted to be sure but not hung up. The fluff on Rufus Tith is what finished the deal for me.

To be fair I read it again…I was wrong about something then I will be the first to admit I was wrong, about anything:

TMP link

It starts here for me…I was interested and looking forward to the game.

Move forward to today.

Reviewed the site…the game looks interesting and has potential to fill an adult niche…adult being non-picha chu and G rated.

The basic overlay within the site is well managed and it seems that this project is well designed, internally supported, and is on track for a complete release (miniatures ready at the time the game is released).

Up front is the feeling of dark, seriously horrorific,and hellish environment regarding the game setting. Repeated warnings of adult content and direction with appropriate reasons…zombies will not put on clothes and there for will be naked if naked and not for any other reason, etc..

The background fluff within Hursts print shop is where the issue for me comes in.

And at this point I will just note the link, you all read it and make up your own mind. The game looks well designed. The miniatures look interesting and a couple are inspired horror types. The skirmish experience looks to be potentially a great deal of fun. I wish that my first experience with this game was first hand with the designers at a playtesting setting. It is tough to judge a game from afar.

So I will agree to disagree. I will be the one who steps down before the internet bluster starts flying. To the Spinespur game designers/writers/artists you have a good idea for a game hopefully something good comes of it for you and yours.

Best of luck to those guys at comfychairgames.

comfychairgames.com

PS
Cereal and fishbane…just for the record I do not have any issue with what anyone does or does not do in regards to their personal lives, sexual or otherwise. I would never defend the crap from GW and the reference was to a time 12-13yrs ago when I would still consider playing a GW product. If you have buddies or local gamers who push their idea of what a particular faction might do then that is hardly the same as the parent company saying/printing that one thing or other will be done.

And just for the records…the Scrapyards sound like a great setting to make some killer board terrain.

The Foreman and his Junkyard Dogs…crazed mechanics that search the whole of Spinespur raiding anything with mechanical parts for their covert projects…always accompanied with their packs of manegy hounds/dogs. Some even say there are a few fell men who run with the animals.

Lots of big wrenches, hammers, tool bags…now that is a gang.

thats why the minis/rules/etc are WHAT you make out of them. After all miniatures are just representatives and YOU choose what they represent. Sure there is an overlying story but why do you think some people use "proxies". I've seen robots used as "space marines" totally disregarding the established story just because the player wanted to use other company models and made his OWN story to go along with them.

hell yesterday i even played a game of spinespur with good ol' Mr. Jingles and did not make a reference to anything sexual. He strikes me more as a drunk/crazed/psychotic clown, at least thats how I would like to imagine him.

if you want to see the battle report it's in the "battle report" section under "general discussions". You have a good idea maybe you could flesh it out a little maybe look at some stats and pitch the idea to SK. He loves hearing feedback about the direction of a new agenda and fleshing out the spinespur world. hey you never know.

One of the reasons we made Spinespur was because we thought it would make a neat game setting. Some people like it, some people don't. Everyone votes with their wallet.

Were starting on sculpting our next wave of miniatures in que, so theres support to keep us going (and we thank everyone for the support!)

Were not going to change our stories or detour from our chosen path as we see nothing wrong with it.

Best of luck and fortune with your project.