"HOTT vs Chipco FR!" Topic

Have played Hott and quite enjoyed it. What is the main fifferences with FR!
Thanks , Michael

FR! has more racial differntiation, a better developed magic system and a great deal more detail allowing things like sea combat, sieges, etc.

I would echo what David Gray said and add more variety of troop types and more character types and options.

never played HOTT, it is currently more popular at the convention scene, but i'm a diehard FR player.

Hi. I am fairly well versed in both sets (well up to FR 2nd edition). FR has more depth in most areas. The Morale Clock is a neat idea. There are a huge amount of army lists. The magic system has a lot more elements to it thsn Hott. All in all FR has a lot going for it. Downside is that the magic system and army lists are possible game balance issues. Possibly to the point of the games not being much fun to play. The number of available players is a shadow of what it once was. I think FR is the better system. But I'm more likely to play Hott.

Hott, is a nicely balanced game. Magic doesn't dominate. There are loads of cool army lists out there. It has an AWESOME fan supported page in the Stronghold. It is a generic system, though. Players abound!

Thanks,

John

I'm wondering if the FR! crowd dwindled in the face of the price hike it underwent as a PDF?
If so, now that they've dropped the price maybe more folks will come try it out/come back to it…

I didn't buy the last edition because of the price hike-- so that's one.

I don't think I'll buy it at 20 bucks either-- 15 is about my limit for a PDF.

Hi guys,

Thanks for the kind comments. We have a new FR Lite (not sure what the real name will be) upcoming that will sell for the same price as LPE, DOK, etc. The comment about coming back is an interesting one. Our experience is that interest waxes and wanes for games over time. At the moment FR seems to be enjoying an upswing in sales. Lots of folks in remote locations and overseas seem to like the pdf format (which also allows us to sell old editions of the rules for players who prefer them). Pdfs also mean that Curtis and I can stay in the business as long as it is fun for us and keep releasing games at our own pace since we have no inventory, etc. to worry about. Personally, I have always seen FR as a toolbox for more sophisticated gamers (our average player is around 30 last time checked) to build the fantasy world of their choice. I've really always thought of those other guys as offering an alternative vision and not as competition especially. Certainly we do our best to make sure that your expensive miniatures in other systems can be used in ours as well, so have fun with the variety!

The fantasy rules question has been raised a lot recently and FR! usually gets a thumbs up from the readership.

HOTT is just too bland and takes the 'generic ruleset' to new lows. This is fantasy we are talking about. If I wanted to play DBA, well..I just would :p

FR! shares some concepts but does much more with them, not perfectly, but still light years ahead of HOTT

Is there more than one version of FR? If so, which is the best? How are figures based for this system?

I think HOTT is excellent for tournament play.

Having played dozens of games of FR!, I think it an excellent system. There are a couple of issues: there are SO MANY variables (a good thing, giving players great range of choices in army design and victory conditions and such) that play balance can be a real problem. Play for the fun of the game and it doesn't matter. Rules lawyers and power gamers may be very frustrated.

Secondly, the I go/You go system (and the Morale Clock) works fine with two players but not so well with larger games with more than two sides. I have gamed Five Armies from THE HOBBIT half a dozen times with FR! and it gets bogged down with the large number of units in play.

What is the basing system for FR?

IIRC FR basing for 15mm is 40mm x 40mm bases for all units. Characters can be mounted on any small, appropriately-sized base.

We play multiplayer FR games all the time with no problem. They take about 3-4 hours to play. You have to implement some limitations to make it work however.

(1) Limit flying units to 4 or less.
(2) Limit Specials to 4 or less (Fanatics, Major Spirits, Dragons, Large Monsters).
(3) Add 1 to the morale clock for every extra player on a side--so our 3v3 battle had a 12 morale clock instead of a 10.
(4) Limit each side to only level 1 magic. With the changes in Magic in the new edition, plus this limitation, the games play much faster.

Anyway--Huge fan of FR, I've been playing it for 8 years, I paint up at least 2 new armies every year, and I highly recommend it to anyone wanting a fun large scale game system.

I really don't think FR suffers in large games. We have used it in games involving over several 100 figs and played in the 3-4 hour timeslot. Done the same with HOTT. I REALLY like FR when used in a low magic environment. Using lots of magic CAN significantly tip the scales. The rules ARE solid and I would happily suggest folks check them out especially with the recent price change. The authors are GREAT guys and I am very happy with their decsion affecting the pricing of the rules. They have released a multitude of excellent rule sets.

Long live Chipco!

Thanks,

John (who is now firmly back supporting Chipco and their products)!

I agree with stormtitan and John that limting certain things speeds up the game. I did Five Armies with about 8 players,and each had about 20 stands plus several characters. Minimal magic, as in THE HOBBITT, but there were dozens and dozens of combats to roll each turn, and of course combats often carry over several turns. It was great fun, just slow, and with significant magic would have been impossible. The morale clock adjustment sounds like a great idea.

"HOTT is just too bland and takes the 'generic ruleset' to new lows. This is fantasy we are talking about. If I wanted to play DBA, well..I just would :p "

You make the common mistake of saying they are the same. But HOTT is not DBA at all. They use simliar mechanisms, in particular the concept that it is the overall outcome of a combat is what matters as opposed to the thickness of the chainmail vs a londsword or hand axe.

Some might say that the generic nature has brought the rules to new heights. Not many rulesets allow the 'fantasy' of Napoleon's Airballoons to take on Poll Tax Rioters of the 80's in the UK, or Elves vs Judge Dredd, or Baywatch againt Tyranyds, or Orcs againt John Carter of Mars, or King Arthur's Knights againt Hitler's Weird Reich.

The 'fantasy' is in the minds of the players, your army can be whatever you want and the rules do not contrain you to pre-conceived ideas of what a fantasy army should be.

Look to The Stronghold for inspiration :
link

Of course, if you don't have the imagination for it then try something else .. ;-)

Steve P

The big difference is that HOTT is OK, FR is excellent.

Still working on my FR Ankh-Morpork & Klatchian armies…..