"Might of Arms" Topic

Just played my first game with these.

Quite taken and not just coz i won.

Does anyone know an English supplier besides Spirit Games, who seems to be out of stock?

I'm glad someone else has discovered them. They're my favorite set of ancient/medieval rules

Great for clubs. Join the Might of Arms Yahoo group.

Mike did you do the Samurai game this past week?
VR
James Mattes

Fantastic rules, but can't help you with the English distributor. As Mike mentioned, join the group and ask Bob about it.

Doug

home.earthlink.net/~bryantbob

What armies did you field, and at how many points

I am going to play my first game of MoA on saturday, so am looking forward to it, but havnt decided to use a roster or chits to mark hits and FP.

Formerly hiding under the label of "00JMTS"

I'm not sure of the points value. The game was set up for me by my opponent.

But for record it was a Crusader army against Saracen.

Who won, Franks or Saracens?

Franks.

I got my mass of cavalry on the side he wasn't expecting and kept my infantry tight and moved steadily into bow range of the troops he was havinng to turn to face the knights.

Incidentally, the cavalry has arrived. Ive swapped e-mails with Spirit Games and their new stock has arrived.

Order for MoA goes in tomorrow!

I was there, but the cowards at the club saw a snow flake and , aside from 2 new people, stayed home. They missed me wearing my Samurai Helmet. I'll reschedule a bit later on.

so what are these rules like?

I'm writing on the experience of one game but one with a colleague who has played with them more frequently and on the back of having done WRG Ancients (3rd to 6th) and DBM to death.

Suffice it to say that I picked up the mechanisms quickly, the game moved smoothly, combat results seemed "right"

Go to Saltarellos link (6 posts from the top) it leads to a reasonable description of the rules and their charcteristics.

I've played Might of Arms since Bob Bryant was playtesting them 15 years ago. He published them in 1996 and I've never found another rules set that I liked better. I've run dozens of games at conventions and at the local club. I have built a large number of armies designed for MOA, 14 or 15 at latest count. I know Might of Arms.

They are NOT DBA, DBX, DBM, or WRG. Occasionally some ignorant fool will upon casual glance make such a silly assumption and spew such nonsense. I've had a player or two walk into the club and upon finding out that it WASN'T DBWhatever stomp out never to be seen again.

Might of Arms is an army level game of Ancients designed for doing whole battles and producing a reasonable result. It is NOT designed for competition. A normal MOA battle of 1000-1200 points runs 3-4 hours. It is highly suitable for multiplayer and scenario play. This is why it is played in the big clubs like NOVAG and AOCMWC in the Maryland Virginia area. I know of a club in the Dallas area big into as well.

Basing is the normal WRG basing, so your troops are fairly compatible with all other common rules sets. Most of us use either the 2/4 convention or the 3/6 convention. In other words in the 3/6 convention (most common) Formed infantry is 6 stands and everything else is 3 stands per unit. Armies are a bit larger than DBA and DBM. 15 -20 units are common per army.

Being an army level game, your role is to be a General, not the legion clerk. It is stand based with no figure or stand removal until the unit routs – ie the unit is removed. Shooting is by stand, you cross index the weapon vs the target troop type and roll the number of D6 as you have stands shooting. For example: A 3 stand Skirmish Bow unit shoots at a Heavy infantry unit. The factor is 2, Roll 3 dice (number of stands) and for every 1 or 2 rolled, you get a hit. When the number of hits equals the number of stands in a unit, it exchanges for a Fatigue Point (FP). FP's effect morale checks.

The turn sequence is simple 1) Roll for who goes first. Lower 2D6 goes first 2) First Player moves then shoots 3) Second player moves and shoots 4) Delayed shooting for 1st player 5) Both players declare charges, counter charges and do melee. 6)Morale Recovery – NOTE: While Morale can go from Shaken to Normal, hits and FP's remain. Routed units are removed from the board.

A unit may both move and shoot in his phase, and charge in the charge phase. During the Charge Phase, both sides declare their charges, roll morale if required, and do melee. Melee is fairly simple, both sides cross index the attacking troop types and get their factor. Add melee modifiers (Charging, Pikes, whatever), the result of a single D6 and cross index number of stands with this number to get the number of "hits" on the enemy. This is simultanious. If there is a reason to check morale (there may not be) than MC's are done as per the priority list. Whoever fails first, loses.

Note that Cavalry melees typically go 1-3 turns. Infanty melee's will go 2 to 5 turns. Cavalry vs Infantry fights will see the Cavalry perform a breakoff at the end of the melee. Melee, is almost always a multi turn affair.

The rules are easy to teach, easy to learn, and by turn 3 with new people should not require the GM anymore. These rules are a joy to run convention games with. All you really need is the 1 page (double sided) cheat sheet to play.

The rules are available at a number of vendors, run $12-15, are in a high quality 108 page press bound book. 150 Army Lists ARE INCLUDED in the rules book. Nothing extra to buy!!! No silly barbie doll marketing here.

Checkout the Might of Arms Yahoo group. It's a very friendly sort of place.

If it were not for MOA, I wouldn't be doing Ancients.

Mikeah….you definatly gave a great view of thes rules…so much so that i've just ordered my copy…you should get some commission from Bob.

Cheers Andy

And the best part of the rules is – they are written by someone who speaks English as a native language. You can actually read them and comprehend the meaning on the first try!

That said, as you play them you will discover the best ways to do things. To be a good General, you have to master time, space, and be able to think a turn or two ahead. You will learn how to leave space for the cavalry to operate (bad players jam them up and take away there manueverability), you will learn when to withdraw your skirmishers – so as to not interfere with your charge or countercharge. You will learn how to maintain a ready reserve at a proper distence to plug holes and protect the rear.

We have one really good master of Light Cavalry here. With enough space he can peck you to death and then smash the bloody hulk with the heavy cavalry.

What makes these rules different is that while you can recover morale – you never recover hits. No unit ever escapes without damage. Yea, you can win a melee, but be so battered that you don't want to fight another. THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A MELEE THAT LEAVES ONE SIDE PERFECT AND THE OTHER SIDE DEAD. I can't tell you how much I hate that worthless concept, hence my love of MOA.

There is no such thing as a perfect army in MOA. That's really good. The great equalizer is terrain as some armies do better in some terrain than others. 900 points of Sarmations in wide open ground on a large board is better than 1300 points of anything else (except maybe another bow armed horse army). Put lots of hills and trees around, the Thracians with their Light Infantry really excel.

What armies are you considering building?

Just got a couple of units to finish in a Republican/polybian roman army and then i will start on their Carthaginian enemies.
Then most probably Macedonians and late persians.
Might take a bit of time as i have to paint a bigger than DBM late Achemenid Persian army (xyston figures) for someone else first.

Cheers Andy

Hi

Been a while since I used MOA, as mostly DBM players hereabouts, but I do think Moa is an excellent system.

mikeah wrote :
"Most of us use either the 2/4 convention or the 3/6 convention. In other words in the 3/6 convention (most common) Formed infantry is 6 stands and everything else is 3 stands per unit"

When using MiniMOA the table size is reduced does the same apply if using the 2/4 optional rule ?

Cheers

If you like. We don't limit the table size here. Indeed we go with the biggest table possible to ensure that it is impossible to play as though there is an end to the world. Nothing sillier than a battle where troops can anchor on both edges of the board.

The 2/4 uses fewer troops obviously. If you use it as a 2/4 the game plays faster. With MiniMOA, you use a 1/2 convention and just play as though it is 3/6. I would use CM instead of inches for range and movement then.

Since stands and figures are not removed, it all works out.

We use it for scenario gaming, actual battles, or interesting military situations here. Generally, the GM has the scenario predesigned and set up before the players arrive. In the 15 years that I've played this, I've yet to use the setup rules. It's much more the way folks would use JRIII or VNB then the highly stylized "competition" DBWhatever.

My dream is to play on a 20' by 20' area where prebattle manuever and no anchored flanks would come into play.

Hi mikeah

I found manovering with 2/4 system is 'easier' as wheels etc are tighter angles than 3/6 system. Personally I always used the optional one unit vs one unit rule with 2/4.

BTW I guess you could amend your dream to using MiniMOA on 10' x 10' :-)

Most I can manage is 7'x 5'…………

Cheers

Mike how many Samurai did you have in the game last year at Historicon or Cold Wars? I seem to remember that you used yours and Jims armies.
VR
James Mattes

Sgt Stiener – Remember that all manuevers are limited to 45 degrees faceing change and a 45 degree oblique, so it shouldn't matter much.

James – Uncounted zillions. They went from 1 edge of a 8 foot board to the other edge – both sides. Keep in mind that I added 17 new units since the last convention! To put them all down would require a reinforced table! Someday I'll count 'em. I don't need Jims anymore, I've got 2-3 complete armies.

Hi mikeah

Yes I know but with 2 stands wide rather than 3 its easier to turn a unit ie smaller overall arc.
Mind you if my Inf in particular are having to do all sorts of fancy wheeling I must be doing something wrong with my deployments and/or battle plan :-)

Cheers

Another thing that I've been doing lately is double baseing the formed infantry. This became necessary to protect the Samurai figures, but it makes for a more playable army. That is, instead of 6 40x20mm stands, a unit would be 3 40x40mm stands. The MI/LI would be 40x40 and the HI 8 figs on a 40x30mm base. When I do the Greeks I think that I might even do a single 120mm by 30mm unit stand. At minimum. 3 stands of 40x30.

Tomorrow the AOCMWC is hosting a MOA Medieval and on the 15th of April we will be doing MOA Samurai.

hello all,

Mike, to be fair i've done both MoA and DBM.. I like both. But to say that MoA can't be used as a tournament rules set limits the game system. It can be used as one and IIRC H'con years past actually had a MoA tourament.

With the flux DBx/AoW is currently going thru I wouldn't discount the tournament gamers. This could be an opportunity for MoA to shine to a all new set of ancient gamers. And most of us, despite reputation, are good-natured folks who like nothing better than the "gathering of friends" aspect of the hobby.

Madcam.

Mike,

Sorry, re-read your post. You didn't say couldn't be used as a tourament set. You said designed as such.

Madcam.

The proper way to do a tournement in MOA is to not do it the way DBA does it. I would make it a team tournement. DBA plays fast, making it suitable for multiple rounds and bring your own armies. MOA with 1000 points will play 3-4 hours with folks that know the rules and are not going to niggly every rules nuance, as competition gamers like to do.

If I were to do a MOA tourney, I would have 8 preset scenarios and 4 teams. I would add a Army break point rule (we actually have one). Each team is 3-4 players

Round 1 would be something like

Team 1 & 2 Carthaginian vs Roman
Team 3 and 4 Sarmations vs Byzantines (mostly cav)

Round 2 would be as follows

Team 1 and 3 NKE vs Assyrans (Chariots)
Team 2 and 4 Gauls vs Germans (Barbarians)

Round 3 would be maybe

Team 1 vs 4 Amazons vs Trojans
Team 2 vs 3 Alexander vs Ceaser

Other scenarios might include Samurai vs Samurai, Medieval vs Medieval (pre-guns), Thracians vs Greeks, Goths vs Romans

The reason I suggested these is because I can do them all.

If a tie breaker is required, Round 4 would be the tie breaker with a scenario pulled from a hat.

The scenarios would be preset and sides chosen by chit. The object would be to face the player with different military situations, slightly different options. Letting players select and optimize the Army list is really bogus anyway. You fight wars with the Army you have, NOT the army you want. It also eliminates the min-maxing that should have no place in wargaming.

Team tourmies also adds a social element that is missing on one on one. MOA plays on too big an area to do a one on one competition.