"Who Deserves to Be Great (Round 1)" Topic
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| Florida Tory ||06 Oct 2017 3:41 a.m. PST|
|robert piepenbrink ||06 Oct 2017 3:43 a.m. PST|
Someone misunderstands the system. You get to be "the Great Moltke" to distinguish you from "the Lesser Moltke." So if there is no "Eisenhower the not so Great" in normal conversation, there's not going to be an Eisenhower the Great. And it's never by Christian name unless you're royalty. "Lee the Great" conceivably, but only "Robert the Great" if he sits on the Cotton Bale Throne of the Confederate States--and if there's a Robert II later, which is why Victoria isn't the Great--yet. (I think everyone's just being polite about not calling The Virgin Queen Elizabeth the Great while Elizabeth II is still on the throne.)
I thought you guys read history. Were you just writing down ORBATS?
So maybe Moe the Great to distinguish him from Moe the Stooge. And--odd that he didn't make the list--Louis XIV. I understand the Sun King IS sometimes Louis le Grand, but it doesn't show up in English.
|Hafen von Schlockenberg ||06 Oct 2017 6:39 a.m. PST|
Um, I didn't propose this one, Bill. Credit should go to Gunfreak.
I was wondering why I couldn't remember doing it.
|138SquadronRAF ||06 Oct 2017 7:13 a.m. PST|
Robert, overall I agree with you.
Someone misunderstands the system. You get to be "the Great Moltke" to distinguish you from "the Lesser Moltke."
Couple of point;
History normally distinguishes between von Moltke the Elder (the three wars of German unification) and von Moltke the Younger (WWI). When I was at school in England we would have the people with similar surnames in the same class distinguished by the addition of Major or Minor to their name, usually based on their date of birth. I was for example James, Major as opposed James, Minor (no relation).
von Moltke the Elder would be far more deserving of the appellation "Great" than either Bobby Lee or Tommy Jackson, two of the most overrated generals in history. Since, however, as you say he was never King of Prussia/Germany he doesn't get the title.
Victoria is sometimes called "the Great" but more based on her longevity than anything else.
Napoleon was a monarch, but I don't feel he deserves the title.
Where Catherine or Freddy deserve the title ascribed to them I will leave to others.
|Cyrus the Great||06 Oct 2017 7:36 a.m. PST|
Why of course Cyrus the Great!
|Rallynow ||06 Oct 2017 8:26 a.m. PST|
| piper909 ||06 Oct 2017 9:10 a.m. PST|
We posthumously renamed our beloved black cat "Brenna Boru the Great".
| The Beast Rampant ||06 Oct 2017 9:17 a.m. PST|
You get to be "the Great Moltke" to distinguish you from "the Lesser Moltke." So if there is no "Eisenhower the not so Great" in normal conversation, there's not going to be an Eisenhower the Great.
| miniMo ||06 Oct 2017 9:33 a.m. PST|
Other = Great Caesar's Ghost!
(He's already been promoted ~,~)
|advocate ||06 Oct 2017 10:07 a.m. PST|
|robert piepenbrink ||06 Oct 2017 11:59 a.m. PST|
Thank you 138Sqn. I've run into the "major/minor business, but didn't know how it worked. My schools and units always added a first name, an initial or "last four." There is also the old Prussian system in which there might be so many Generals von Umlaut-Finkenstein on active duty they had to be numbered by seniority. (And didn't that cause difficulty when one of them retired?)
I have seen von Moltke, in English at least, called "the Great von Moltke" rather than "the Elder von Moltke." He is, I think, the only time I've seen the appellation used for a military commander who was not a monarch, and perhaps the most worthy of it.