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"80,000 Die of the Flu in USA" Topic


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Personal logo Wyatt the Odd Supporting Member of TMP Fezian27 Mar 2020 8:18 a.m. PST

Oh and I could care less about Performance Reviews since things that are filled with personal bias do not drive me.

Still the best worker in my group but only for about another year since I will be retiring for good.

The two are mutually exclusive.

Translating from Aerospace to English:

"Screw it, I'm Union. It's more trouble than it's worth for my superiors to try and fire me. My antisocial attitude and resistance to facts has been career limiting and I've already retired in place. Some time ago they shuffled my dead end career to a low-level business unit where I can't do too much damage."

Mithmee27 Mar 2020 8:30 a.m. PST

Yes I know somewhere in the 4-6+ million range.

But here is what I am getting at.

Spanish flu infected an estimated 1/3 of the global population

link

That would have been around 600 million give or take since the world's population was around 1.811 billion.

Given that the Spanish Flu killed around 50 – 100 million or around 3%-6% or the world's population at the time.

Now the world's population is just under 7.8 billion and 1/3 would be around 2.6 billion and at best this COVID-19 has only inflected around 4-6+ million.

It not anywhere near what the Spanish Flu was and time will tell if it will turn out worst then the H1N1 smack down of 2009, which killed around 284,000 individuals.

link

But this time they are going over board with the hype and fear.

Why did they not do what they are doing now 11 years ago?

Personal logo McKinstry Supporting Member of TMP Fezian27 Mar 2020 1:31 p.m. PST

Oh and I could care less about Performance Reviews

I'm beginning to understand the issues around the 737 Max and the KC-46.

they are going over board

They? The President, Vice President, Congress, NIH,CDC all 50 Governors, virtually every medical professional on the planet? If THEY are all of generally one accord, what does it say about someone not on board?

wmyers27 Mar 2020 2:41 p.m. PST

THEY are all of generally one accord, what does it say about someone not on board?

That's quite the misrepresentation.

Mithmee27 Mar 2020 2:57 p.m. PST

but it depends on where you live.

I work in Finance and the have nothing to do with building or designing the Aircraft.

Yes they are going over board.

Why didn't we do what we are doing today 11 years ago?

This will come to an end though their Police State rules might not. The power that think they have will go to their heads.

Threatening to arrest individuals just for being outside and not Obeying their edicts.

That is government running amok.

Personal logo McKinstry Supporting Member of TMP Fezian28 Mar 2020 2:18 a.m. PST

That's quite the misrepresentation.

I'm game. Show me where the President, Vice President, the House or Senate, any of 50 governors, anyone with CDC or NIH, or for that matter, any medical professional that thinks social distancing is a bad idea.

Mithmee28 Mar 2020 7:20 a.m. PST

Well you will never get any of those to admit it even if they did think like me.

But for many parts of the world:

link

Not even possible plus many of the ones you stated would love to keep it going and going and going since it give them power and control that they want to have.

Oh and I am planning on not "Social Distancing" today.

wmyers28 Mar 2020 8:52 a.m. PST

I'm Game. Show me where …


TMP link

Personal logo McKinstry Supporting Member of TMP Fezian28 Mar 2020 9:29 a.m. PST

I don't see one statement arguing against social distancing. I also don't see one US official, Executive, Legislative or Judicial. All I see are arguments against lockdown or minimizing the threat.

Personal logo McKinstry Supporting Member of TMP Fezian28 Mar 2020 9:33 a.m. PST

Mithmee. All that link shows is that it sucks to be poor and that it makes social distancing difficult to impossible. It does not argue that social distancing is needless nor does it minimize the risk, only that being poor and crowded sucks even worse in a pandemic.

Mithmee28 Mar 2020 10:06 a.m. PST

Yes but it is interesting that those areas are not getting hit with this.

Lets take Brazil are country with the around that same population as the US and has these areas in each of it major cities.

Cases reported less than 3,500.

Or, Indonesia also heavy populate areas and less than 1,200 cases.

These slum areas should getting smack down hard but they are not.

Why is that?

I keep on asking questions but you seem to only question may views which are not the views of those experts or officials.

Oh and I have already not "Social Distance" myself today and planning on not doing it again later today.

Why?

Because I know that the chances of getting this is slim to none.

Did not get SARS, did not get H1N1 and I will not get this.

Oh and I miss getting the Spanish Flu by around 37 years due to not being born until 1957.

Personal logo McKinstry Supporting Member of TMP Fezian28 Mar 2020 11:32 a.m. PST

Social distancing is not about you. Since you can be asymptomatic and still infect others. You might not catch it but over 100,000 fellow citizens have, most from someone who didn't know they were infected.

Failing to social distance is simply being a poor member of a society where the inconvenience of the individual protects the more vulnerable.

Given the damage to the economy and national security (CVN Roosevelt is having a mini epidemic on board) and most training cancelled throughout the Armed Forces, it is simply unpatriotic. Given our national ethos at least perceives us as a country that pulls together in a crisis, failure to social distance is fundamentally un-American at the most basic.

wmyers28 Mar 2020 11:49 a.m. PST

It may very well be countries like Brazil are not experiencing the effects because they may have a much healthier population.

Personal logo McKinstry Supporting Member of TMP Fezian28 Mar 2020 2:38 p.m. PST

t may very well be countries like Brazil are not experiencing the effects because they may have a much healthier population.

Or, as was the case in the US, they are lagging way behind in testing. You cannot diagnose what you don't test.

Their President Bolsonaro is without challenge the dumbest leader on the planet with regards to CV-19. He calls it a "little flu", threatens governors acting in the absence of Federal guidance with jail and claims that the generally appalling conditions for much of the citizenry makes them immune. Bolsonaro is a rarity in that he makes Maduro in Venezuela look if not smart, less stupid.

Mithmee28 Mar 2020 3:14 p.m. PST

No I would have to agree with wmyers that they are more healthy.

You might not catch it but over 100,000 fellow citizens have

Really probably closer to 1,000,000 but out of a country that has 360 million give of take odds are you will not get it.

Oh and one must have it to infect others and I do not get sick.

wmyers28 Mar 2020 3:34 p.m. PST

Here is a video from the USA, an acquaintance posted from a doctor in the USA on how crises are used to justify totalitarian measures.

YouTube link

Seems to tie in to what is being discussed.

La Belle Ruffian28 Mar 2020 6:31 p.m. PST

Perhaps you could move to Brazil Mithmee? No restrictions and you'd be even safer as there so few cases at the momen.

Mind you, I'm sure someone was telling Americans in Italy to head back home a few weeks ago.

Mithmee28 Mar 2020 7:02 p.m. PST

Now why would I want to do that?

You could try answering some of the questions I have put out since this is no different than what happened 11 years ago.

Why the Panic?

Why the Fear?

Why give Police State/Quasi Martial Law orders now and not 11 years ago?

Why haven't stores been restocked by now, they have had 3-4 weeks to do so?

Personal logo McKinstry Supporting Member of TMP Fezian29 Mar 2020 11:14 a.m. PST

Here is a video from the USA, an acquaintance posted from a doctor in the USA on how crises are used to justify totalitarian measures.

Every wingnut on the planet from Maoists to White Nationalists are all over You Tube. One wingnut claiming to be a doctor doth not an expert make. Only Facebook links to individuals are more wingnut laden tin foil hattery.

Why haven't stores been restocked by now, they have had 3-4 weeks to do so?

All the major chains have been restocking daily, at most every other day for smaller rural areas. A simple question as to restocking times will be answered on any major chains website. At a time of high unemployment, they are hiring in large numbers primarily due to increased restocking and sanitation, mostly daily.

Oh and one must have it to infect others and I do not get sick.

Please look up the term Asymptomatic. As you often mention, cases can be so mild that you do not know you have it.

Personal logo McKinstry Supporting Member of TMP Fezian29 Mar 2020 11:33 a.m. PST

YouTube link

If we are using YouTube for anything other than instructional videos, gaming and brain numbing (which we shouldn't) I submit this totally stupid NSFW video which is in favor of social distancing and every bit as valid as any other wingnuts opinion.

Personal logo 20thmaine Supporting Member of TMP31 Mar 2020 6:46 p.m. PST

I do not get sick

Then you'll live forever…..just like all the other people who never get sick.

Do we have an eyeroll emoticon, 'cos boy do we need one.

Mithmee31 Mar 2020 9:53 p.m. PST

No I won't but I do plan on living as long as I can.

Everyone dies.

Redblack04 Apr 2020 4:03 p.m. PST

picture

Personal logo ochoin Supporting Member of TMP04 Apr 2020 5:28 p.m. PST

I'm forced to agree with Mithme on the issue.

The number of reported cases of Coronovirus is far more than official statistics records. See McKinstry's point about asymptomatic (above).

Equally, the number of deaths is widely under reported.In hard hit countries, many who die aren't tested & hence, go unrecorded. In poorer nations, record keeping is often dodgy. Read this BBC article:
link

And then there's China. Does anyone really believe the figures they put out for their outbreak? Sixteen times higher death toll than the reported one is very plausible:

link

When you consider all this, it's worrying. I do understand why some people stick their head in the sand & try to avoid the facts. I guess they're scared to.

Personal logo McKinstry Supporting Member of TMP Fezian05 Apr 2020 11:11 a.m. PST

It should also be noted that at least in the US so far, if a patient is intubated, there is only a 14% survival rate.

Gunfreak Supporting Member of TMP05 Apr 2020 11:37 a.m. PST

In Sweden over 400 has died, with the actual number probably much higher. Sweden hasn't implemented much of anything to stem the rate of infection.
Compare that to Norwegian who has done a lot, we have 66 dead so far. Norway was quick to react. And so we have so far dodged much of the worst parts of this pandemic. At the same time, we've avoided the most draconian measures. We've avoided curfews, the mail has never stopped. Most stores remained open etc.

Mithmee05 Apr 2020 1:22 p.m. PST

I am with the guy in the red shirt was just at three different stores and at a four on Friday.

Not going to Self Quarantine or wear a mask or use hand sanitizer.

Oh and I will not Social Distance myself either.

Oh and will never get this or run into anyone who has it.

Personal logo ochoin Supporting Member of TMP05 Apr 2020 1:24 p.m. PST

Well done, Norway.

In OZ, the country's daily new infection rate has fallen to about 5%. No time for complacency, though. A possible 'Second Wave' could follow. However, our leaders have been sterling.

"All of the hard work of Australians is beginning to yield real dividends in terms of lives saved and infections prevented," Health Minister Greg Hunt. "Every one of us can save a life, or any one of us, by doing the wrong thing, could risk a life."

The last sentence is good advice many should heed, if not for themselves, then for their families' sake.

Condottiere06 Apr 2020 9:26 a.m. PST

"Every one of us can save a life, or any one of us, by doing the wrong thing, could risk a life."

Yes, because hubris and willful ignorance can exact a dreadful toll on everyone.

Gunfreak Supporting Member of TMP06 Apr 2020 10:10 a.m. PST

The total number of dead in Norway so far is 76, the number of dead in Sweden this past day 76…
One country did something to prevent the spread, another didn't.

Mithmee06 Apr 2020 11:02 a.m. PST

Something to do with the Demographics but I do fine it interesting that Russia has so few cases and deaths.

Basha Felika06 Apr 2020 11:18 a.m. PST

You think the Russian figures, like the Chinese, are accurate and honest?

Personal logo McKinstry Supporting Member of TMP Fezian06 Apr 2020 4:50 p.m. PST

Oh and I will not Social Distance myself either.

As I sit here typing I'm waiting to hear how one of our 7 EMT's for our entire rural District is doing relative to his CV-19 symptoms. No results on the test so he is isolated leaving us 6. 3 of us worked with him on a Wednesday call so if he is positive, the 3 of us will be out for 14 days minimum leaving 3 EMT's requiring outside help. If we get simultaneous calls which will add 45 minutes or so to the response, people in our community, my friends, my neighbors may suffer from this without getting close to a CV-19 victim.

I don't know how our fellow EMT got it or even if he has it for sure but I do know I appreciate every doctor, nurse, EMT, firefighter, grocery clerk and LEO that I encounter that is risking their life, their family and certainly their peace of mind to do their job and are putting up with a heck of a lot more personal issues than merely having to stay 6 feet from their fellow citizens or wear a mask.

I do know for sure what I think of anyone who finds their own personal inconvenience more important than their society, community or family and utter disgust probably understates that emotion.

Mithmee06 Apr 2020 6:59 p.m. PST

Well I am not the only one who thinks the way I do.

Plus you have not answered my questions on why did we not do this eleven years ago when around 100,000 died from H1N1.

Or why don't we do this every year due to the Flu?

Why now?

What is so freaking different than 1957, 1968 or 2009?

When all this is done I really doubt that this will match any of the above three years.

But this is such a crisis that this had to be treated differently.

Oh and yes I will not Social Distance myself or will I ever wear a mask or face plate.

Because I know that the chances of getting this is slim to none.

Live in Fear and give up your Freedoms and Rights.

I won't and I really do not care what you think about what I do since I can careless about what you are doing.

Basha Felika07 Apr 2020 1:44 a.m. PST

There are some who deserve to be socially ostracised for their wilful ignorance and selfish behaviour, especially those who care not for the welfare of others.

Mithmee07 Apr 2020 6:41 a.m. PST

Well that would never work with me but if it would make you feel better go right ahead.

Not going to change any of my views.

Redblack13 Apr 2020 10:46 a.m. PST

Let's state some facts from CDC

While the impact of flu varies, it places a substantial burden on the health of people in the United States each year. CDC estimates that influenza has resulted in between 9 million 45 million illnesses, between 140,000 810,000 hospitalizations and between 12,000 61,000 deaths annually since 2010

As of April 13 per John Hopkins

US 557,571 cases 22,108 desths
Brazil 22625 1245
France 133,685 14412
UK 89,554 11346

world 1,850,527 114,425

Mithmee13 Apr 2020 12:19 p.m. PST

US 557,571 cases 22,108 deaths

Well the number of cases is probably right but since they are counting everything the number of deaths is…

Inflated.

Even with that taken into effect the United States is only around a 4% Rate those others…

Are far worst and we have been padding the numbers.

Redblack13 Apr 2020 1:27 p.m. PST

Other information that has been misstated, ignored or claimed as false in this thread,

link
The Statistical Institute three years ago estimated that the world's population in 1920 was 1,791,496,000, and that in 1924 it was 1,894,874,000. But it has since raised its estimate for the year 1920 to 1,811,012,000.Many researchers have suggested that the conditions of the war significantly aided the spread of the disease Most of the deaths were in Asia

The 1918-1920 'Spanish' Influenza Pandemic. This world-wide epidemic caused by influenza viruses led to between 50 and 100 million deaths in 1918and 1919 (as much as 1 of every 18 people).In 1920 the population of the US was about 100 million around 25% of that was affected by the flu and about 550,000 died. (2,2%)

In 1920 Medicine lacked most of the treatments we have today so the number of infected cases and number dead was at least 10 times higher than it could have been today.

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