"London Bridge "Incident"" Topic

Two coordinated attacks on innocent civilians. One using a vehicle to mow down people and a stabbing attack.

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One fatality so far. I hope all the injured are able to pull through.

Thoughts and prayers to them, their loved ones, and collectively to all our U.K. friends going through this senseless barbarism, yet again.

Dan

Im just about prayed out for this stuff . People need to start making changes in there thinking or this crap is going to continue .

Bunch of friggen animals. My thoughts and prayers are with the people in London.

Now reported as one continuous event conducted by the same group of men.

Three attackers shot dead.

Six or seven dead at this time (don't know if that includes the attackers or not), 20 or more wounded.

Prayers for the victims and their families, and the people of London.

My best wishes for the victims and people of the UK.

The world is a bit crazy at the moment. Puts TMP silliness in perspective.

Pure terrorism, people without any moral compass.

My condolences to the victims.

Garrison,

You are so right about putting our trivial things in perspective.

Dan

Prayers for the victims and their families.

John

PS. Well said, GarrisonMiniatures

My condolences to the victims of this tragedy. And my sympathies to the people who live under leadership that encourages and enables these events to take place.

I don't understand what these lunatics think they are accomplishing with these attacks. They aren't going to bring down a government. They don't seem to have any demands. They are just killing innocent people for no reason. Psychopaths, the lot of them.

They hope to force the western governments to move more and more totalitarian "for the sake of safety" and as a bonus more bombings of the Muslim world so more terrorists/insurgents will be made.

My condolences to those that lost their lives and those wounded. And a job well done to the London Police for putting a fast and effective end to the situation.

My wish is that the media would stop reporting these
as 'attacks,' which tends to legitimize them in the
the minds of some and instead report them as MURDERS.

Among the other definitions of 'murder' is 'the unlawful
taking of human life', which these certainly are.

The more we hear about murders and the less about
'attacks' by a supposedly aggrieved very minor portion
of a culture, perhaps the more incented folks would
be to pressure their locals to teach local people how
best to prepare and to defend themselves.

Against a knife-armed attacker, a cricket bat would
make an excellent weapon, mostly to keep the potential
murderer from closing in.

Jabbing the bat at eyes, groin, belly might buy enough
time for unarmed folks to flee.

Like kidnappers being paid a ransom and then kidnapping again because it works, terrorists see terrorism as a path to their overall goals, and will continue to do it as long as they receive the benefits they want from those actions, including media recognition and political acquiescence as the West tries to "understand" them (they don't care to be understood) and make social changes to assuage the terrorist's cultural views (they're aren't enough changes that can be made to do that).
They're not out to make the Western nations hardline or softline. They really don't care about that at all. They're out to destroy Western civilization, and replace it with their own extreme ideology. Period. The planes weren't flown into the Towers because the West was hardline or not hardline. The bombs didn't go off at the Boston Marathon because the West was hardline or not hardline. And this attack last night was no different. All of these attacks occur because the West exists. Indeed, they occur because anyone who is not part of the terrorists' evil ideology exists. If you do not agree with them 100% completely, then you are an infidel (whether Jew, Christian, Buddhist, Hindu, Sikh, atheist, agnostic or Muslim or anything else but rabid ISIS nutjob), and they believe they can do ANYTHING to you.

That's the answer. Like Nazis, Japanese Imperialists, Khmer Rouge, the KKK or any other extreme group in the history of the world, they think they have the right to do anything to you if you aren't one of them, and that only they are right and only they should rule the world.

The world isn't that simple.
No they are not mindless killing machines, just as the Nazis weren't mindless killing machine.
Nobody goes around claiming the Japanese attacked pearl harbor because "America existed" no they had a clear reason, both based on ideology (we own the pacific) and strategic reason(America is a threat to our plans in Asia)

To pretend ISIS are any less aware of strategic reasoning then the Japanese is a great disservice to our self. Claiming the enemy are "orcs" with no deeper intelligence and reasoning behind their actions is stupid.

There is also a clear diffence between the leadership and the cannon fodder.
War is about rich old men sending young poor men to die. The same goes for terrorism.

Old men can stir up hatred against the west easy. They have so much to work with. From just stoking the fire of religious fever. To patriotism (bombing our homeland/motherland.
The rich old men want power and money some might be true believers. Other might just be happy to send those naive fools to blow them self up so they can become richer and more powerful.

Remember ISIS was started by some of sadams old buddies. Sadam and this ilks were not fanatics. But they are willing to use fanatics.

May the seven who were killed Rest in Peace.

May the others who were injured gain full recovery and the strength to deal with what has happened to them.

May the scumbag killers burn forever.

Well, someone is certainly using these murderers as if they were just like disposable phones. And they willingly and knowingly surrendered themselves to that fanatical cause. It must be a successful tactic, seeing as how it keeps getting repeated decade after decade against unarmed civilians.

You want to know what their purpose is?

To get our own media to make us think in these illogical ways;

A) To make us see the murderers as victims;
B) To get us to forget who the victims really are in these cowardly murders every single time;
C) To make us forget who are the ones who inculcated, recruited, gave the murderers direction and put them to focus all their energy on this destructive path; and, ultimately
D) To make us think that our society created all of that, even though the enemy has been doing this to each other long before we came into the picture. Look up Alamut.

The enemy has been studying and using our own media like this since the 60s and, little by little, they are getting all their objectives accomplished. Remember, terrorism is the use of fear of seemingly random attacks on civilians to effect social and political change. And they have been using our own media to change us little by little.

Dan

Uh, Gunfreak? The leader of ISIS, the so-called "Caliph," was a minor Islamic scholar during Hussein's final years. He's only 45, and has no connections with Hussein or the former leadership of Iraq. He's a radical Islamic cleric, not some "old man sending young men to war." His personal motivations are exactly as I stated. He's a megalomaniacal homicidal nut job. That he uses his own beliefs as propaganda to recruit losers and sociopaths to his banner is irrelevant; he's not grandstanding, he's sincere. And he wants you and me and anyone else who doesn't agree with him to be dead.
It really is that simple.

Mithmee +1

Charles XII was only 19 when the great northern war started. It's still old men sending young men to die just because someone isn't ancient. And 45 is more than twice the age of most ISIS fighters.

And it's still mostly Saddams people behind it. link

Gentlemen, I realize there are valid discussions to be had on these subjects,but may I humbly suggest that this board is perhaps not the most appropriate place for them?

Which is why I haven't returned to some of the obits I posted.

Maybe a new thread on the UM board,instead?

No aspersions on anyone here; just my personal feeling.

+1 HvS

Agreed, sorry for starting something that's not appropriate for an obituary.

Maybe a new thread on the UM board,instead?

Only if you want to end up in the Dawghouse.

You want to discuss this come over to the Blue Fez and you can freely discuss this.

Agreed as well, and I apologize for contributing to a misdirection of this thread.

Let us now just remember and honor the victims, and pray this madness stops.

Agreed. Thanks Hafen for the reminder.

Dan