"Ares I-X Test Launch a Success!" Topic

I managed to watch the lift-off of the Ares I-X test vehicle on the NASA channel on-line. Very impressive. It was odd (and a bit alarming) to watch the dummy upper stage go tumbling off out of control after separating from the booster, but I guess everything went okay. Strange looking vehicle with the upper stage so much wider than the lower stage—it's built upside down! The NASA video and audio feed is basically unedited, so it was cool listening to the flight controllers taking with each other. Everything was go except for the weather and the guy in charge was constantly demanding updates from the harried weather person. You could tell the poor woman was getting a little flustered. At one point she made a pretty elementary math error that even I caught (edge of clear zone 12 miles away, clouds moving at 14 miles per hour, time until clear zone arrives…. Uh…. Lemme see… uh, fifteen minutes?) But they just managed to fit the launch in before the window closed at noon. And there is something just so awesome about a countdown. I got chills even if it was just an unmanned sub-orbital test. Cool stuff. I can't wait to see an Ares V launch! Bigger and badder than a Saturn V! Yee ha!

Yay! Will the moon colony, orbital elevator and civilian reusable shuttles be far behind?

Unfortunately, yes.

It's still a multi-stage rocket. What is this? The '60's?

Yeah, it's kind of depressing at that. Strange how technology advances so unevenly. There have been incredible advances in computers and electronics and yet aerospace hasn't made a significant advance in over 50 years. Railroads and automobiles haven't changed in nearly a century. Ships… forget it. Real progress in space is waiting for some fundamental breakthrough in physics and who knows how long that will take. Still, in the meantime I'd rather see them doing something than doing nothing.

Despite the gazillions that were pumped into the Space Program the money coming out has been only a trickle, comparatively speaking.

Granted, the hurdle is substantially bigger than mere flight, but without commercial applications and a reliance on proven tech means we haven't seen the spectacular space projects we were promised in the 60's.

The cost to put one kg into space still is the biggest hurdle. Without a major shakeup, costs will remain high and profits marginal.

Much is expected from private commercial operators and craft to bring costs further down and up launch frequency.

It's still a multi-stage rocket. What is this? The '60's?

Yeah, it's kind of depressing at that. Strange how technology advances so unevenly.

Back before rocketry really started someone calculated that with Earth's gravity (9.81m/s/s) a rocket could never escape Earth's gravitational pull and enter space.

Assume we have a rocket with mass Mr. The fuel needed to propel mass Mr into outer space has a mass of Mf. So the rocket really weighs Mr+Mf now. Oh-Oh, now we need some extra mass of fuel to get the rocket that weighs Mr+Mf up high enough to escape earth's pull. This extra mass is Mf2. So the rocket must really weigh Mr+Mf+Mf2. Ad nauseum.

So a given rocket with fuel, will always weigh more than the fuel's capability of lifting that mass up high enough, with the adequate escape velocity, to escape our gravitational pull.

Well, for single stage rockets that is. That is why you have multi-stage rockets. You keep dropping off the unneeded weight of old engines and spent fuel tanks.

The moon is 1.625 m/s/s. A single stage rocket will work here. In fact, the Apollo lunar landing module worked just fine. It didn't need to jettison any unneeded weight to escape the Moon's gravity and later rendezvous with the orbiter.

Mars is 3.728m/s/s……..no idea if a single stage rocket would work. Jupiter is 25.93 m/s/s……..I assume that the rocket would be crushed to the size of a soda can, so it won't take off either.

Ralph

For Mars, we won't need a rocket from the Earth's surface. The idea is to use the moon as a staging post and build and launch Mars missions from the Luna surface. One of the reasons NASA is (wanting to be) going back there.

Although there is far more competition to establish bases on the moon this time around (India, Japan, China, Russia, European space agency and of course NASA are all in the race) we won't be reestablished there until the 2030's.

It's the long haul this time I'm afraid, but then that's only to be expected, because this time we're going back to stay (albeit in a rotational ISS kind of way).

Space is getting busy and crowded with increasing competition. NASA's dominance in Space is fast slipping away.

Worse still(for those that worry about such things), while China, Russia and others establish dominance on the moon (and beyond?) if NASA's space program is run down too much, the U.S will have no response for at least another ten to twenty years AFTER the 2030's because it will take that long to get their programme going again (not until its far too late in other words).

I'm British, but even I can see that the U.S NEEDS the Constellation program, so as to "stay in the game". It would be a great shame (both for the U.S and for the future of humanity as a whole) if the great innovators of the first chapters of space travel were now to fall by the wayside and become bit players.

The Human Spaceflight Review is here (155 page PDF):
PDF link

Regards, the Gorb

Bravo for a successful launch!

For Mars, we won't need a rocket from the Earth's surface.

Correct, but the rocket still has to leave the Martian surface, if it is a manned mission. Then the 3.728m/s/s will be important.

Ralph

Despite the gazillions that were pumped into the Space Program the money coming out has been only a trickle, comparatively speaking.

But some of these benefits are hard to gauge. For instance, the fact that you now have the choice of bonding nice tooth coloured resin fillings into your mouth is a direct benefit of the US space program.

BTW, whatever happened to TANG? Can you still buy it?

Ralph

A reminder that discussion of the POLITICS of space travel should adjourn to The Blue Fez, our sister website: thebluefez.com

Wow, buzzkill.