"No I will not Commit Fraud....people that ask" Topic

I sell a decent ammount on E-bay and I get a fair share of Overseas buyers (I am in the US). What gets me is every so often I get someone asking if I could write "gift" or list the value of the item as being less on the customs forms. I ignore them and always list the actual value and stat "other." I have no plans to go to jail for fraud.

I just hate it when people ask!

I always write "gift" on the customs forms as I don't see any reason why the government should be entitled to make you pay for used figures twice over.

I just hate when people are self-righteous!

Oh yeah… or how about the ones who ask if you can pick up the VAT for them?

The funny thing is that it doesn't work with Customs Canada. ANYTHING over $60 USD gets hit with about $16CDN in duties. I found this out after sending some models to a friend in Ottawa.

On the other hand, marking items such as figures as "toys" generally means that there aren't any import duties.

Wyatt

I'm with you Beowolf. What they are asking you to do is a serious felony in the US and is called "Customs Evasion" (or was). I classify stuff as either books or toys as almost no countries have duties on these.

I know chances of getting caught a re 1 in a million, but I'm not explaining to my daughter through the bars why I'm Bubba's Beeyatch.

Canada Customs sees Gift as a red flag to check what the value is. Put down what it costs and what it is and more times then not it will pass through. If they do check it you only play the Sales tax on the value of the item. I have more things come through customs that way.

I don't mind paying the sales tax, I do object to the handling fee Royal Mail slap on top of that for holding the parcel. And I wouldn't mind that so much if they actually did an outstanding job in every other department. But the fact is that these days if you send a birthday card with some money in it, you've got a 50 – 50 chance where the money will go, half the time it ends up in a postal workers pocket! At least that is how it worked out for my daughters fifth birthday! Out of six cards with money only three showed up.

Sorry for going off topic. I do agree with the original sentiment that asking someone to commit fraud is not on.

I hardly ever transact with anyone overseas, but I'd certainly like to know the proper procedure if I ever do.

I agree with beowulfdahunter that asking someone to mis-state contents or value in order to avoid postage fees is asking to commit fraud. It also seems foolish to put such a request in writing. :)

However, Wyatt the Odd raises a good point. If you have a choice between several ways to list the contents, as "toys", "models", "collectibles", "hobby materials", "miniatures", "toy soldiers", "wargaming supplies" … all of those are accurate, so why not choose one that is more likely to pass through easily?

In the UK, there wouldn't be a problem anyway, as we (in the UK) do not pay VAT (sale tax) when we buy second hand goods.
However if the person who buys the figures paints them and sells them on, they are then liable to pay VAT on the difference (profit).

I agree with beowulfdahunter and Crispy. While I do feel for individuals living in countries that have steep import taxes for ridiculously small personal purchase of even a few hundred bucks, fraud is fraud. My web site clearly states that actual value will be listed on the customs form and the buyer is responsible for any import taxes imposed by their customs office.

My duty-free .02 worth.

@donrice- one thing I make sure to put up front in any ebay sale is a very bold statement to overseas buyers that *any* VAT or customs duties are their responsibility. I got embroiled early on with some UK customers who went bonkers when they had to pay 70 GBP in customs duties.

My take on people who ask me to undervalue items- I will do it on occasion *if* the object could conceivably be that cheap. However, if they also want it insured then the insured value gets slapped into the value column of a customs form (i.e. it really raises red flags when a package has a value of $25 USD but is insured for $500…)

It's not smart to put "gift" in the description for more than just customs taxes. Just ask Homeland Security.

However, it's not untruthful to put a lower value of the goods that you are selling. For example, if they are painted miniatures you sold for $50 USD and are really worth $12 USD in raw materials, then that's truthful. However, you might also get only $12 USD on an insurance claim.

One of the reasons why I only ship within continental USA anymore.

Hey
write "Toy Soldiers" and put on the value…

If you wrote "gift" and a lower value, you are defrauding a government of taxes. That is a fine practice, to be congratulated, not frowned upon. Governments, ALL governments, get too damn many taxes to begin with, so the less the better.

"The funny thing is that it doesn't work with Customs Canada"

Actually, $60 USD is simply the limit for gifts. It's $20 USD for normal imports. And whatever you might think of Revenue Canada, you don't want to get on its bad side. You do what you want, I always want an accurate declaration on anything I receive.

I have a feeling that 'collectibles' is better than anything mentioning toy – I think the import duty is lower and it is still an accurate description. A friend who imports figures for a business was able to use the description of 'unsuitable for under 14' etc. to show that they shouldn't count as toys – though I can't remember if that helped import duty or VAT.

Toys are generally at the highest duty rate.

Toys are generally at the highest duty rate.

Really? In the US Toys are duty free. On the other hand, Miniatures and Collectibles will get hit, as these include things like Porcelain figurines.

Rob

When I sent toys to my sister's family in Norway from the US, I never had a problem labeling them as toys. Haven't done it in a few years.

I see no problem writing toys on an ebay shipment. After all, miniatures are "toys." Then again, I only sell in the US to make my life easier.

BTW when people ask my hobby, I say I paint miniature toy soldiers. They know what that means.

So, I send a gift values at £100.00 GBP to my cousin in Chester, UK, and another to my cousin in Dunedin, New Zealand. Both are subjects of Her Majesty the Queen, why should one pay tax on their gift?

Call me daft, but the first time I discovered that fact I was horrified, and I am damned if I will write "value £100" on the parcel to Dunedin.

As John the OFM says, the damned politicos get too much of my money already for me to weep over their lost taxes!

There is no difference in the UK between items that are 'gifts' and those that are not when imported. It is only the type of goods that matters, not whether it was paid for or not.

I hate it when people ask me to kill a guy. Just because I've done it before for them, they think it's my career.

When the box comes up missing then they will be wanting you give the correct amount and not lie!! Of course they will undoubtly hold you responsible for the full and honest sum.

OK, first things first – if you are running a company and are obliged to pay taxes on your ebay sales, do yourself a favour and state this fact clearly on your page. If you are selling stuff as a private person and are still obliged to pay taxes for the sales on ebay, then take it under consideration that such transactions are not necessarily taxable in other countries.

Personally, I run the odds game when purchasing stuff from companies, but I always ask PRIVATE sellers from US and Japan to write 'Gift' on the package. Otherwise I will have to pay $35 USD flat fee for the pleasure of having my package ripped open and often damaged by Swedish postal service. I will not pay any taxes for what's inside, but only the completely unnecessary postal fee. I will not apologise for my attempts to avoid that 'service'.

Considering the fact that the dollar seems to be one step from abyss and preparing to take two steps forward, you will probably have even more oversea customers within overseable future. Perhaps showing more tolerance toward their ignorance of US laws would be preferable to rants on TMP.

If you wrote "gift" and a lower value, you are defrauding a government of taxes. That is a fine practice, to be congratulated, not frowned upon. Governments, ALL governments, get too damn many taxes to begin with, so the less the better.

Amen!

I recently ordered some stuff from the US (I live in Canada), the sender put 'Gaming Supplies' and I got hit with a substantial Customs fee. I contacted Canada Customs and they said that they had to go with the description put on by the sender and that if they had been described as 'Toys' then there would have been no fee.