"Has anyone ever seen this before?" Topic

Ok, as a number of you know I am slowly renovating a 100yo house, It's my mother-in-laws, will become me and my wifes in a few years.

I finally got up into the crawlspace that was in the back room, the most recent addition, 20-30 years ago I was told.

I crawl up in there and find…

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They just added a roof over the old roof?

Now I am trying to figure out what to do about it? I can leave it but that just seem like I should do something about it. I don't know, has anyone ever seen this and what did they do about it.

Not sure what the shingles are made of but they might be asbestos I'd be careful in removing them if they are.

My gut reaction would be to leave it. I can't imagine a good reason for them leaving it 20 odd years ago but their might have been and I'd rather not find out the hard way.

x42

Leave it, it's not hurting anything.

Tom

YEs I have seen that. One friend replaced his roof to find that the previous contractor(s) had done that 2-3 times in the life of the house (Built in the 1920's). the load was starting to bow the roof.

I've seen it numerous times, especially on homes with additions built before the building codes curtailed the practice in the 60's.

Best bet is to leave it unless it is interfering with airflow in your attic space. If you do remove it be sure to test for contaminants – lead and asbestos primarily, and have a solid plan as to how to support the current roof. In fact I've found it is usually cheaper (when labor costs are counted) to tear both roofs off and start over with new trusses, decking, and shingles.

I agree with Cory. Unless you have a reason to remove the old roof, leave it alone. It will be far easier to remove it when the exterior roof is replaced.

Hey, at least there aren't any Christmas lights still strung on the eave.

Still not against any code that I have seen – and although it normally isn't done anymore now…it is much more common among people who would be doing the work themselves (farm houses and what not).

Before the advent of plywood, pneumatic tools and home centers doing even a small addition was a significant investment of time. You didn't want to open your roof/walls up to the elements only to get rained upon. So instead they would go ahead and just build over the existing shell and then cut the holes once the addition was closed in. This allowed them to spread the work over several weeks or even months without having to worry about the weather or other problems.

You still see it getting done a lot for people who still live that lifestyle – however more often than not additions get done by contractors who come in and tear off the siding/roofing and erect the shell of the addition in a single day. Plus modern tools allow things to get done much faster than they used to (plywood versus 1x6 T&G – pneumatic nail guns versus smashed thumbs – power saws versus hand saws).

Well I should point out that the house is in a very small town(not even a streetlight) surrounded by Amish. In fact most work ever done on the house was done by local Amish.

As others have said, I don't see an immediate problem with it. Still I'd check with both a reputable contractor and a testing agency or group to A) verify that the structure, particularly the joining area between the "old" and "new" structure is good and B) that there are no harmful materials like lead or asbestos in the shingles, paint, etc. left by the old roof.

Unless you have a burning desire to change things – just leave as is.

I had a house where the same thing was done – we just left it. Didn't see any point in changing things unless we had a reason – besides it would have been a real pain to remove it – there are always better things to do with your time and money…

I've seen it done in medieval houses. It just makes it easier to extend a house without removing an existing and effective roof.

Air flow and weight are probably the only considerations. Unless you planned on building a working attic. Then the space will be an issue. It's subsequently going to be an expensive demo to get into that will most certainly open up additional and unanticipated problems, as these things do.

firstly i'm from the Uk ot the US, and housing structures are very different over here to there …

However i think i would be more concerned with the structure of the 'new' roof that can be seen in your pictures. Its difficult to tell from the picture, but the rafters dont seem to have 'noggins' (cross braces) and thats a long run of wooden rafters with the only support to be those oddly angled braces – surely that can't be load bearing or up to code?

Oh, and obviously some insulation might be a good idea.!

This looks like something a Dutchman would do. I grew up around the Amish. They are unbelievably tightfisted. They will cut any corner they can to save a few bucks. If they can put on a new roof without the time/expense of removing the old, they will. My brother bought an Amish-made house. By the time he got everything up to code, it would have been cheaper and faster to tear it down and start over.

Oh, and obviously some insulation might be a good idea.!

I'm kind of embarrassed but when I first went up in the attic. I had thought that the end of the attic was the end of the attic. I insulated that area, and thought the job was done… From that end I had no clue this little room even existed.

it would have been cheaper and faster to tear it down and start over.

We have discussed that option a lot, and in the end most likly will take that route.

Been there, seen that, renovated around that. If it ain't broke don't fix it. If it is broke fix it.

Building to code is the nice safe and sane way to go, but I have seen some stuff not built to code that has worked well for 60 or more years. If it is solid and sound, I wouldn't worry about it.

LLC aka Ron

I also own a house with a roof built over a section of an old roof with no tear down. That section still has seven layers of shingles on it. I worried about it at first, but now that I have lived with it for over 10 years I no longer give it a second thought. The addition on mine was done over 25 years ago. I have had some things that needed fixing, but none of my issues came from the roof built over the old roof.

LLC aka Ron

Our house was built in 1850. It has a creek in the basement, a chimney that takes off on a 45 degree angle, probably no electrical outlets that are to code and every once in a while one of the original timbers rots away. It also stands in a flood zone up the hill from a creek. So far, it's stood the test of time. I have to replace some beams and fix frozen pipes every once in awhile, but it's still standing.

I'm more of the if it ain't broke, don't fix it camp. Unless of course it poses a fire danger!

Wow! I'd thought I'd seen everything!

We finally decided to knock down our 1948 house (post-war boom built--i.e., crappy) after a sinking kitchen floor and some sleuthing turned up a failing foundation. New isn't cheaper than fixing it but it resolved so many other issues at the same time. Only 6 more months of temporary quarters!

Having spent the past 7 years shoring up an older house (often fixing things that the last genius had "fixed" before me), I'd say leave it unless there is a reason (e.g., leaking roof). Who knows how the new roof is tied into the old one and whether the old one is bearing a significant load. Even a 1/4" subsidence upon removal could create an opening for water (or critters--I hate critters) to get in.

Good job on keeping an old house going!

Bob in Edmonton

You just found a new storage room for your terrain peices!
You lucky Bastard!

I'm an architect. I agree to leave it alone unless you are having some sort of problems. Even asbestos and lead are not much of a problem if they are undisturbed and in this case protected from both weathering and normal household contact. In fact tearing the roof off could open you up to real contamination if it isn't done properly. The only question I might have is about the newer roof above and the walls below. (I cannot make it out the new roof well or see the walls in these photos.) Any deflection under snow loads, leaking at the joint with the new roof, etc? Is the old and/or new roof properly supported down to the foundation? Cracks in the ceiling, etc? Some times people add the addition and knock out the wall without remembering the old roof is carrying some of that weight.

If airflow is a problem you could cut a vent thru the old roof. you really don't need that big a hole to get air thru. I can't really judge the size from a picture, but a few sqft will probably do the trick. Just wear a good respirator and don't cut any joists or live wires. If you think it might have asbestos, get it tested before cutting and creating dust.

Any fire danger would come mainly thru old wiring. Even then, it really isn't a problem unless it gets disturbed or is running more current than it was designed for. I have seen original Edison wiring that worked just fine.

My parents bought a house a few years ago and turned up something similar. The used the lumber from the old roof to complete the subflooring for a new bedroom/bath in what had been the attic space.