"Instant Mold Released - Make Your Own Bits" Topic

I am intrigued.

But resin squash molds would not be an option becuase of he heat generated by curing if I read this correctly.

For flat surfaces, good. for complex blobs (heads, shoulder assemblies) i sense heartache.

Looks great a making small bits, I need to make replacement engines for a few starships. This might work.

Isn't this encouraging piracy, which is supposed to be against TMP policy?

TMP link
And scroll down to nearly the bottom.

Isn't this encouraging piracy

Well the following line is not very well worded…

Have you ever wanted to make an extra weapon or shoulder pad for your army, but just can't be bothered to go on eBay to go through all the hassle to get another one?

If you make the bit yourself then use this to duplicate it, that's one thing…

Have you ever wanted to make an extra weapon or shoulder pad for your army, but just can't be bothered to go on eBay to go through all the hassle to get another one?

Which is EXACTLY the tone that the "But I WANT it!" crybabies whine about.

If TMP is going to be taking advertising money for a product like this, with ad copy in those words, it is time to delete the FAQ about piracy.

Sorry John the Ofm it depends on how you use it. I was going to make some sandbags out of fimo. Now I wont't have to make each one individually. I can make a master and cast the rest. I often scratch build items and this could be a great timesaver for making duplicates. I just ordered the Instant Mold.

The issues with potential misuse aside…this is a repackage and a markup.

link

link

link

One of these days, I hope that they will look into actually innovating as opposed to taking advantage of the consumer with $4 USD packets of sand, snow and static grass (or in this case $13 USD sticks of plastic).

I'm confident that most of the buyers will be like GoeffQRF, Atlatl2 and myself using it the way it was intended.

I'm equally confident that there will be others just as the OFM believes.

JJ

I think John and Geoff have raised a valid point about the advert wording.

But I'll get some.

I'm equally confident that there will be others just as the OFM believes

…not helped by poor wording in the advert which seems to positively encourage it…

I can make a master and cast the rest. I often scratch build items and this could be a great timesaver for making duplicates

Like many of these things, what sounds so simple often turns out to be more hassle, once you've experienced making the master, making the mould and all the problems from casting, miscasting and recasting ;-)

This product does not seem to be set up for mass production. Just the one off part. If you buy a mini (like a music CD) and want to make a copy for yourself, I believe this is allowed under the law since you have made the purchase in the first place and, the copy is for your own use.

Anyone who wants too spend the time, copy a bunch of minis with this product well god bless them. When you figure out your time and cost of greenstuff with waste, well you are probably making a wopping .06cents a hour.

But resin squash molds would not be an option becuase of he heat generated by curing if I read this correctly.

I have actually been using the Oyumaru for awhile now (which looks like this is a repackage of). For small resin items – the heat isn't enough of an issue…things like door and window frames for example.

Once you start to increase the volume of the resin though, the heat increases as well – and it does become problematic. I did some barricades that were maybe 1 cm across – 10 cm long and 1.5 cm tall. The Oyumaru got soft from those. It was thick enough that it still held its shape more or less – but there was a definite loss of detail from the master.

If you want to do something really thick – you can use a material like GelFlex or Plastucts Vinyl Molding Compound. Those don't soften up till around 300 degrees F – so most resins work well in them.

Seems like a lot of fiddly work to make a resin weapon. I would rather just buy a metal one from a vendor.

Funnily enough, it's probably the sort of thing I might make use of when making masters, as it would allow me to relatively make up duplicates of small parts (half a dozen wheels, a couple of doors) rather than have to master them all separately…

…although I'd probably still go to a mroe permanent mould in that case, in case I wanted them again next week :-)

Yea, looks to just be Friendly Plastic to me as well. I was managing an art supply store when that stuff came out back in the 80's. I have a pack of the pellets around somewhere.

GeoffQRF – I was thinking the same thing.

aside from the possible piracy issues, as a professional i am always looking for different ways to capture textures or an aspect of something that i like a part of but cant be bothered to try and draw it…so that looks cool to me!

**ducks**

It actually is fairly handy stuff.

When you do a fair amount of scratch building, there are a lot of things that get duplicated as GeoffQRF mentions. Wheels, hatches, windows, doors… Building each one, one at a time is very monotonous. Making a quick master and as many copies as I need is very handy. Unlike a silicone – you can normally go from making the mold to making the copy in a few minutes time. It isn't a durable solution, but as long as you don't plan on making a few hundred of them it works well enough.

However, since I don't do production work – I like to stick with reusable molding material. I neither have the need nor the desire to keep a pile of molds on hand. Between this type of material, and the pourable materials…I can work pretty fast and not get caught up making a dozen wheels and doors.

There are lots of times where I find one odd piece of plastic that "looks just like a crysknife!" or "would make an awesome chemfilter, sweetie!" (as my wife looks around wondering where I will store my new project).

The problem is, I have *one* random piece with no easy way to copy it (other than buying 50 blu-ray players or whatever).

This product helps.

Yup, some folks will use make illegal/unethical use of the product. Boo hoo.

Sounds useful to me. Anyone stocking it in UK?

Imagine building say architectural details, etc & reproducing in milliput. Durn handy

Isn't this remolded hot glue sticks?

I'm intrigued!

Isn't this remolded hot glue sticks?

No – it doesn't stick to stuff.

Sounds useful to me. Anyone stocking it in UK?

Take a look at the products that I linked to. They seem to be more or less the same thing (at a fraction of the price). Since they are art/craft products you should be able to find them in stores or at least from a regional online supplier at without the hefty shipping that they charge and without the costly markup.

Does it work with molten lead/tin?

For what it's worth, I'll add my voice to those saying that the wording of this ad seems to encourage piracy.

Personally I use green stuff to press-mould surface details I've sculpted myself and want to copy. I think I'll stick with that.

Encouraging piracy? I blame that ad for 'Cutlass!' You know,the pic of the lass with the cut blouse :)

Does it work with molten lead/tin?

Not even close.

For those in the UK and mainland Europe (and apparently Australia and New Zealand) – looks like Trylon might have the product you want. Called "Polymorph" it comes in pellets like "Friendly Plastic" does.

Would recasting an existing multiple part one of which is missing from a kit be legal? An example is you need four wheels but only have three. All the wheels are the same and recasting the fourth is simpler than trying to get the fourth wheel from the manufactrer. Is this legal?

By the way I'm not trying to beat this into the ground but I'm genuinely concerned over this issue. I don't want to put manufacturers in a bind because yes they need to make a profit to stay in business. Some company's though, I won't name who, are hard to order replacement parts from. Anyhoo I digress. Salut y'all!

Bruce the Texas Grognard

It looks like a handy option – I believe I'll get some…

Particularly if it will work for small volume resin items like scratchbuilt windows/doors as mentioned abvove…

James

I'm always surprised by the amount of disinformation in regards to intellectual property. Copying the work of someone else is not illegal.

What about making extra miniature parts from a company that ceased production 20 years ago?
Where would I go to get those parts?

And for anyone in the UK
link

Could you use plaster in these molds?

What about making extra miniature parts from a company that ceased production 20 years ago?

Illegal, in most countries. Depends of length of copyright, typically life of creator + 50 or 70 years. It does not matter that the originator no longer exists, it still breaches copyright.

As for irondog:

If you buy a mini (like a music CD) and want to make a copy for yourself, I believe this is allowed under the law since you have made the purchase in the first place and, the copy is for your own use.

Copying a mini or part of one is breach of copyright. It's therefore illegal. In most countries :-)

Note also that while American copyright law allows the making of a backup CD for your own use, UK copyright law is not as flexible.

There are some countries that have no concept of a copyright law.

Looks like a very convenient way to make up lower detail type parts for terrain, vehicles, etc.

I will definitely get some to keep time on my scratchbuilding projects down.

UK copyright law is not as flexible

How draconian! You can be indicted and sentenced for photocopying portions of a textbook? Making a hand-written copy of a published poem for a lady-friend? Whistling a top-forty tune or enjoying an evening of karaoke? I suppose one is taking a real risk socializing with members of law-enforcement.

Could you use plaster in these molds?

Working on the assumption that it is the same stuff that I am using…just with a different name. Yes, plaster works just fine in it. You will want to be careful though, since it isn't as flexible as a normal silicone rubber – so if you have any deep undercuts…you will likely break the plaster part when removing it.

I have used it to good effect to copy a section of a real stone for use on terrain and bases though.

Note also that while American copyright law allows the making of a backup CD for your own use, UK copyright law is not as flexible.

While not exactly legal in the US – it is often overlooked. However, I recall a case a few years back where a library was sued and lost for making "backup" copies of stuff like movies and tapes.

There is a difference between legal and not prosecuted. I J-walk from time to time to save the few extra steps up to a cross walk. It is illegal – however it is not often ticketed. If a cop does decide to ticket me for it though, I can not claim that what I did was legal…it was not after all.

There is a difference between legal and not prosecuted

actually, there is a difference between civil and criminal law, which people seem to be overlooking. In a case of copyright infringement, there is a plaintiff, not a prosecutor. You could have 300 copied resin space marine heads sitting on your desk, and an army of police couldn't care less.

Do I want to get into this?

Would recasting an existing multiple part one of which is missing from a kit be legal?

Technically, no. The right to copy the item belongs to the copyright owner, who may or may not be the same as the creator.

Copying the work of someone else is not illegal.

Interesting laws where you live. Try s.17 CDPA 1998 "Infringement of copyright by copying". From your choice of terms I assume you are in the US, in which case you'll have to dig out the relevant legislation.

You can be indicted and sentenced for photocopying portions of a textbook?

No. there are exceptions under s.28.

There is a difference between legal and not prosecuted

Only really a moral one. You choose to break the law and are aware of the [potential] consequences. Doesn't make what you do right just be virtue of not being caught.

Actually, there is a difference between civil and criminal law, which people seem to be overlooking.

You could be prosecuted for breaking the law, followed by a civil suit. Not sure the difference is really approriate here.

In a case of copyright infringement, there is a plaintiff, not a prosecutor.

Or claimant in the UK, who would sue you.

You could have 300 copied resin space marine heads sitting on your desk, and an army of police couldn't care less.

And that makes it right because…

That all said, I don't think that the advertiser was actually advocating that you should use this product to 'pirate' parts. I do think it was a poor choice of wording. You can create your own items and use this quite happily to duplicate them. It may be handy for making a dozen or so items, assuming you can put up with the hassle (and your significant other can put up with the smell) of casting them. Less than that and it's more effort than simply making another one. More than that and you're probably better off finding a friendly manufacturer who can slip it into a mould.

Guns don't kill people….

The intent of the product is not to promote piracey. You could use any product currently out there. I think I'm getting some. I sculpt my own minis. I'll find it very usefull.

I think I'd find it useful for some architectural elements I want to make. Much nicer than some other options I was looking at.

The enforcement of copyright is the responsibility of the copyright holder. If the copyright holder wishes to break in to my home to inspect my work area, then I will charge him with criminal trespass. That goes for the mattress-tag people, too.

Article 61 of the Agreement on Trade-Related Aspects of Intellectual Property Rights (TRIPs) requires that signatory countries establish criminal procedures and penalties in cases of "willful trademark counterfeiting or copyright piracy on a commercial scale".

'Piracy' involves distribution. Copyright infringement as well as intellectual property theft is a serious issue. Chastising a hobbyist who wants to cast an additional wheel for his ork battlewagon muddies the water and trivializes the issue.

You can be indicted and sentenced for photocopying portions of a textbook?

No, not in the US either. There are exceptions for such thongs as educational use, quoting excerpts for purposes of criticism (e.g.movie critics), etc. So, it's essentially the same as in the UK, as referenced above. Also, making a "copy for personal use" does not apply. There is a fundamental misunderstanding here. Under US law, one can record, for example, a TV show onto your VHS (TiVo these days) for later viewing and "personal use", but you not permitted to distribute that recording. Thar exception does not apply to miniatures.

The enforcement of copyright is the responsibility of the copyright holder. If the copyright holder wishes to break in to my home to inspect my work area, then I will charge him with criminal trespass.

Nope. In the US, the FBI can get involved. Just read the warning at the beginning of any movie distributed in the US. The copyright holder has the right to enforce the copyright and seek damages; triple damages if a properly registered copyright.

Wow. Boy this topic always … well brings out the passions! the bottom-line does seem to be: copying anything that is not yours without permission is wrong, ethically and legally. But, it is unlikely that the Games Workshop police are going to bother suing anyone over copying a single wheel from an Orc chariot, even though it is technically wrong. And, I really doubt the makers of this product would advocate copying some else's work.

No, not in the US either. There are exceptions for such thongs as educational use, quoting excerpts for purposes of criticism (e.g.movie critics), etc.

You are referring to 'fair use', which involves re-publication of some other parties copyrighted material. No one is trying to justify piracy, here. there in no 'fair use'(IMO) of re-casted bits.

In the US, the FBI can get involved

My girlfriend's birthday is next week…will the FBI be concerned when I copy a recently published poem into her greeting card? How about the poet? What are the damages?

Mattress-tag people

link

Chastising a hobbyist who wants to cast an additional wheel for his ork battlewagon muddies the water and trivializes the issue.

But still doesn't make it right. ;-)

The stuff doesn't hold detail all that well. I've used the stuff for crafts with kids, but it never occured to me to use it for making things for wargaming, which is strange because I will pick up chunks of wood and rock off the side of the road for use in wargaming and have made vehicles out of McDonals'd toys…

You are referring to 'fair use', which involves re-publication of some other parties copyrighted material. No one is trying to justify piracy, here. there in no 'fair use'(IMO) of re-casted bits.

Yup. Correct. I assume nobody is advocating piracy even if it's a bit or two, right? The magnitude of the copying has nothing to do with whether it's right or wrong.

My girlfriend's birthday is next week…will the FBI be concerned when I copy a recently published poem into her greeting card? How about the
poet? What are the damages?

Lol! Well, there have been cases where people downloaded some music and ended up in criminal trouble and being sued for tens of thousands of dollars.

Yup. Correct. I assume nobody is advocating piracy even if it's a bit or two, right? The magnitude of the copying has nothing to do with whether it's right or wrong.

Piracy involves distribution.
And this isn't about right or wrong…it's about copyright law. Copplestone Castings, as well as many other miniature makers, 'borrow' the intellectual property of others. "not-predators", "not-aliens", "not-terminators", etc ad nauseum. Is it "right", or merely "legal".?

No, at least not in the US. Piracy has nothing to do with distribution. My trusty "Black's Law Dictionary" defines piracy as:

"1) Crimes of robbery, kidnapping, and similar activities on the high seas. The trial and punishment of such pirates may be under international law, or under the laws of the particular nation where the pirate has been captured. 2) A colloquial term without legal significance often used to describe willful copyright, patent, and trademark infringement."