"What Exactly IS The PVA Trick?" Topic

I know I could probably find the answer by reading the big long post, but I am lazy and don't want to.

So, what is the PVA trick to keep plastics from flaking what glues work best?

DwarfMan

PVA glue. You 'prime' the fig with pva before painting over it.

What I do is coat the figure with a 50/50 Water/PVA mix after I have painted it. It seems to work with plastics, though it makes metals lose paint easier it seems…

Mike

PV before and PVA after both with ~50/50 mix.
You've got your paint in a flexible sandwich which wraps the figure. I've bent plastic spears 180 degrees without flaking.

I undercoat with undiluted PVA – perhaps the consistency varies? I use a big tub if it from Wickes.

I did try overcoating with PVA after painting once, but really it is just just too scary covering my nice paint jobs in white gloop. I use Ronseal acrylic matt floor varnish now.

<< I use Ronseal acrylic matt floor varnish now.>>

Does this mean that you can walk on your miniatures and the paint still won't flake?

Just out of interest, what made you try that option in the first place?

I've also used acrylic varnish, usually as a spray from Vallejo or Testor, on plastics before and after painting. I also spray print-out banners if I need to customise them with acrylics as some printer inks do not like water-based paints.

I use Testor spray varnish for my last coat. irchestian you are right it also works great for print-out banners.

Rustoleum Plastic Primer. Works a treat.

Hi

Some of my polypropolene figs and converted figs were featured in a book by Robert Schleicher on Wargaming in 1978. The figs STILL hold their paint.

Soaked first in a sealed tub of detergent ammonia for a week. Changes the chemistry of the surface of the plastic allowing ordinary acrylics to work.

Rocky

Rocky, Im glad you mentioned that, been wanting to give that a shot.

Have you had any incidence of the plastics becoming brittle? Or any other things to watch out for?

I guess 27 years is a pretty good long term test :-)

No, no, no. All y'all (you guys) got it all wrong. THIS is the real PVA trick . . .

link

CC

HOW MUCH??????!!!!

Haha haha! Does anybody actually buy PVA from GW?

I buy shampoo from GW!

Hacksaw:

The brittleness of soft plastic figures is a funny thing. I have many figures over 30 years old. Some are very brittle and some are fine. It is difficult to draw any real conclusions, but a good coat of paint does prolong life of a figure. Washing and leaving unpainted promote brittleness. But simple washing vs long soaks in any treatment (detergent, vinegar, ammonia solution) all have about the same result. I would recommend leaving them unwashed until you are ready to paint, but them you can use any treatment that works for you. I feel ammonia makes the best surface, but this can be a matter of taste. Once well cleaned the surface can be painted with acrylic straight on of given a primer as explained above.

DyeHard
15mmvsf.bagofmice.com/index.html

Should I prime the figure like I do with metals? So far I have gathered from these replies:

Step 1. Soak fig in ammonia
Step 2. 50/50 mix of PVA on fig
Step 3. Paint
Step 4. Put PVA mix on top of paint OR varnish in matte.

Is this correct?

Thanks for your help!

DwarfMan

Gent,

What sort of concentrations of ammonia are used? After they have soaked (how long?) do you then let them completely dry and cover the figure with;

a – PVA
b – acrylic floor vanish

What is the process to get he figure ready to paint with just prior to a spray paint undercoat just like a metal?

Cheers

HW

well, it sems that everyone uses different tricks. My own is:

wash the figure with dish detergent and warm water.

Prime: 50% PVA, 40% water, 10% black acrylic. This is the primer. It looks like gray goo but it will work-- it must be runny enough to go over the figure, leave some blackish PVA in the recesses, and some grayish PVA film in all other places.
Let it dry overnight (or even less)

Paint it.

Let the paint dry for 24 hours or more.

Give a final coat of floor varnish or PVA diluted with water. This should be even thinner than the initial priming. Don't worry if it seems that you are covering your figures in white stuff -- as it dries, it becomes transparent. Not too shiny, not too mat in my opinion.

How I have done it:

This is the way I did it back in the day (10+ years back).

1) Soak in cheapest household clearer with Ammonia I could find. Soak about 2 days, in sealed Tupperware shacking it like mad a few times a day.

2) Take out of soak and shake off well. Then rinse with lots of fresh water. (distilled water was often a last rinse, if you are crazy like me).

3) Let dry in clean air (well ventilated with little dust, hard to find these days)

4) Prime. Here is where one could use PVA, but I just gave them a very fine misting with spray enamel primer. Not even close to a complete coat. Make them look dusty.

5) Paint with acrylic paint.

6) let dry well, more then a few days.

7) Seal with polyurethane finish. Either clear or Min-Wax Tutor. (see dip method: link )

8) Spray with matte finish.

DyeHard
15mmvsf.bagofmice.com/index.html

Hi

I haven't done anything complex.

I started with this approach, oddly, because I had aquired a badly built model airplane out of a rare kit. In my effort to "rekit" it to make it better, I tried Ammonia. Reasoning is simple, most paint is, on thePH scale, mildly acidic, ammonia is a base.

Took the paint off and dissolved the "Revel type S" glue.

Polished the canopy. This last was the clue that lead to trying it on polypropelene, the soft plastic of figs.

But I try not to "overthink" problems. Detergent ammonia from the grocery, in a sealed tub because of the smell. Left a week, no hurry. I have always painted with acrylics and use a white prime.

I haven't had a fig go brittle yet, so I am unaware of what the cause might be.

Rocky

For faster drying, either use compressed air (automotive air compressor: quick, easy, economical, if you have one already) to dry the figures' every nook/cranny, in a matter of seconds. Alternatively, pre-heat your oven to its lowest setting (needs to be below 200-F, as they will get soft…), pop them in, standing upright, for 15-20 minutes, with the door propped open, to allow fumes to escape (if drying something other than water), then let them cool.

If you need to dry out the paint/glue/Minwax/whatever, faster, this is a safe method (oven at its lowest setting -- less than 200-F). I use this approach for all of my figures, metal, resin, or plastic; I even use this technique on homecast figures, made with the expensive Model Metal, which happens to have a very low melting point. Never had a problem, but my oven's lowest setting is 170-F. Cheers!

Good grief, you guys are really over the top.

I wash them, prime them, paint them, seal them. Done.
They hold up just fine.

True, the primer doesn't cover everything, most especially if the figure is red, but all I want is something for the paint to grab.

My oldest figure we game with is just shy of ten years and he's a spiffy as day one.

DS6151, if you still want that 54mm stagecoach (I have one for the cost of shipping), let me know. Go back to the Toy Gaming Discussion for my e-mail. Cheers!