"Warhammer-Based Skirmish Rules for 28mm Samurai?" Topic

I have about 18 unpainted Ronin/Brigands left in my collection, along with 8 Ninjas.

I would like to do skirmish raids and clashes, but need to know if anyone has done a Warhammer variant for Samurai.

Thanks.

CC

By the way, I may want to use the Ronin/Brigands as a small band of Wako (Wokou) pirates!

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wokou
picture
link
link
link
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koxinga

CC

Well, the obvious answer is Warhammer Ancient battles which now includes a Samurai army list.
If you want to use WFB rules though, I found these sites a few years back:

link
link

and this doesn't have WFB conversion rules but it does have links to a whole load of Samurai Skirmish rules

hem.spray.se/kendoka/samurai

Crow

PS – I bought the Empire Army book with the intention of writing my own rules but never got round to it – I discovered WAB instead =)

Crow

Thanks Crow!

I hope I can adapt that info to do skirmish actions.

CC

You could also try adapting the Mordheim rules (available for free as PDF from somewhere in the GW website nowadays), which are skirmish rules based on the main Warhammer 5th edition rules (the same ones as WAB is based on, so using WAB samurai list as a basis for Mordheim warband list should not be too difficult).

Griefbringer

Griefbringer,

Thanks to you, I think I found them!

link

I will give it a shot. Much appreciated.

CC

Thinking better of it, there is surely bound to be somewhere in the web some house rules of dubious quality for a samurai/Nipponese warband in Mordheim.

Here is one I found immediately:

link

It is probably not the only one out there.

Griefbringer

Dear Cacique,

Lord of the Rings rules would probably be very good for this application. There is a Samurai version on the Yahoo group.

link
Regards
Mick

In addition to the Samurai list you may want to buy the Fall of the West book which has a pretty neat skirmish system in it already.

Yes, the Kensei rules (lotr variation) is very good for samurai skirmish.

Cheers

Try this site for a Mordhiem based system:

link

It also has rules for Ninja and Ronin as Hired Swords.

SMc.

Also the samurai supplement 'Divine Wind' for WAB is out in May 2007!

Its a long wait but I have been waiting since May 2002 or there abouts!

Go to the Mordheim archive as already suggested, and see how you like the rules… I know I will change a few things once I get enough spare time.

Previously mentioned: Divine Wind coming out next year:

link

"Includes Army lists for the Samurai (2), Sohei, Ikko Ikki, Koreans, Wako and Mongol Invasion force as well as history and a campaign system."

Many playing WAB use the Samurai in skirmish formation (which light troops are allowed to do) and have them reform for hand to hand combat. So you really don't need a "Warhammer-like" skirmish game when WAB may be all you would require. I'd wait for Divine Wind. It's Rob Broom's baby and should be excellent.

Ralph

Sounds promising. Thanks.

CC

I wonder if it will include some naval (boarding) rules.

TMP link

CC

Here are some nice converted empire rules, so you can still use your samurai army on tournaments provided you don't need to have GW models.

membres.lycos.fr/lyondri

WAB's "Armies of Antiquity" book has a Samurai army including Ninja and lots of room for characters. Also in WAB all infantry troops can adopt skirmish formation in built-up areas, and all the non-character troops (exc. "Samurai Infantry") in the WAB AoA list are light troops so as mentioned above their cav can too. In such a small game if all players are comfortable with it I'd just allow any troops to be in skirmish, any time – you're probably looking at pretty close to a 1:1 figure ratio? I'm told that list is pretty unstoppable by anything other than more Samurai, some gamers I know consider it unbalanced (too much power for points cost vs. Roman legionaries or Norman knights) but by all accounts Divine Wind will be awesome.

Figures wise, Kingsford Miniatures (of Vancouver, BC) have some very nice 28mm pewter figures. Packs of 6 infantry/3 command/1 cav figure, lots of variety in poses etc. They accept Paypal and are very service-oriented. While packing to move recently I discovered I needed some additional secure storage to pack some recently painstakingly painted figures. Emailed them about ordering one of their storage boxes ($17 Canadian, holds 66 figures – quite a deal) and whether I could pick it up, since I live close to their premises and was moving within two days! The owner/designer delivered it in person, and even brought along some new figures from packs about to be put into production. Now that's what I call service. I don't play Samurai at the moment but I'll be shopping Kingsford if I start in the period at that scale.

Kingsford advertise in Wargames Illustrated, and their site is at: kingsfordminiatures.biz Well worth a look.

Scheltrum do at least one very nice fighting Japanese ship in resin which might be of interest btw. Not sure of their info but I'm looking at a picture on the cover of WI 167 (Aug 2001).

Going wacko? Maybe I will too.

Some of these Ronin could easily work as Wako (Wokou):

TMP link
TMP link

CC

Cacique Wait for the Divine Wind sup. Also check out the Perry Bros. site for some real nice Samurai figs.

I'll second the motion for LotR:SBG. It is specifically designed for very small skirmishs using "heroic" personalities vs. hoardes of mooks. Having played it and put on LotR:SBG particiapation demo games at Millennium, I can vouch for how well the mechanics work for this type of "heroic" game.

WAB AoA has a samurai list but the game doesn't impress me. I own the rules, read them and realized that they are simply WHFB warmed over. WHFB is fun fantasy gaming, it doesn't translate to historical very well.

LotR:SBG is you best bet, I think. BTW the enormous hardcover rulebook is $50 USD US. It contains lists of LotR and modeling/painting instructions, etc. It's cheaper to buy the Mines of Moria game. You get some plastic minis that are pretty well done and actually look like the movie characters and a small version of the rules. It's complete but the lists are only for what's in the box and all the modeling stuff isn't there.

You might be able to find someone who is will to part with theirs if they've moved up to the big book.

"WAB AoA has a samurai list but the game doesn't impress me. I own the rules, read them and realized that they are simply WHFB warmed over. WHFB is fun fantasy gaming, it doesn't translate to historical very well."

RayRangel is absolutely correct! Everyone knows historical armies fought in the manner described by the DBx rules. How are their skirmish rules BTW?

Ralph

I would go between the both of you, LOTR for the Seven Samurai Skirmish but WAB for any battles or sieges

I wouldn't recommend DBx for Samurai games either. There are some pretty good rules out for both big battles and smaller encounters. For the one-on-one, Seven Samurai type games, LotR:SBG will work fine.

crhkrebs,
There are more rules out there than WAB and DBx you know. I would recommend to everyone and anyone that they shop around and try to find rules that support the their personal understanding of history along with the scope and abstraction level of the game which they want to play before they start pounding history's round peg into any set of rule's square hole.

Hi Ray,

For sure you are right. Its just that that was CC's original request.

Ralph

Its all your fault I cant get Josef Ochmann and Black Hats Samurai out of my head now :0)