"German 'Webbing'" Topic
8 Posts
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Artilleryman | 11 Nov 2022 4:07 p.m. PST |
When I model a unit, I always like to look into the detail of the uniforms and equipment even if it will not be reflected on the table. Building German infantry units for Normandy, I have been having a close look at the Landser's webbing or combat harness. What strikes me is the way the Y-Straps are attached to the belt and pouches with quite open hooks which do not look that secure. This is probably for the reenactors rather than the wargamers amongst us but how did the Y-Straps stay on? Or did the soldiers have to reattach them every time they put their equipment on? I am just curious, but I would like to know. |
jgawne | 11 Nov 2022 4:58 p.m. PST |
Ha ha ha, yeah, the hooks are very open, and yes the gear falls apart all the time. On the front hooks that go the ammo pouches there are actually small metal bumps that can help hold in the pouch D ring. those hooks can be pounded slightly closed and they generally will not fall out, but then you'd have to pry them open if you wanted to take it apart. The rear hook to the belt is more problematic as it's more of just a simple "J" style hook that needs gravity or upwards stress to stay attached. So, how to keep it all together? Very carefully. With skill you can manage to put it on and take it off without a problem, but it's a pain. But you can also take a small string or piece of wire and secure it. I have been somewhat reliably informed that was done by actual German soldiers, but will admit never to have heard it second hand. I can say that it does work well in practice and is easy to do from readily available material. It was an antiquated system, but like all gear of the day was designed for professional soldiers who spent lots of time training to use it. |
Artilleryman | 12 Nov 2022 5:14 a.m. PST |
Fascinating. Thanks for that. Just a little insight into the reality of operating on the battlefield. I think the French called these small details 'the asides of glory'. |
Griefbringer | 12 Nov 2022 10:10 a.m. PST |
It was an antiquated system, but like all gear of the day was designed for professional soldiers who spent lots of time training to use it. It seems typical in many 20th century militaries that when a shortcoming in some piece of equipment is discovered, the usual approach is to provide instructions to users on how to work around the problem, rather than fixing the equipment itself. That said, considering the amounts of material produced and stored, it is not necessarily trivial feat to re-work them, especially if one happens to be in the middle of an armed conflict. That said, on reading through a book on British webbing gear development (Europa Militaria series), I was surprised to find out that both the military leadership and webbing gear developers could quickly adapt the design during WWI based on feedback coming from the front lines, and unit craftsmen could be provided instructions on how to perform adaptations to existing kit. There was some effort put to ergonomic design already back then, though understanding on the subject has gradually developed since then (though more modern soldiers are also able to find shortcomings in somes of the equipment). Speaking of more modern designs, I recall having some issues with the webbing gear I was issued during my service in the Finnish military a number of years ago. This webbing gear came as a single piece item that held together well, but it was also issued in just a single size, with the user expected to adjust the various straps to make it fit his/her dimensions. However, I was of rather slim dimensions on my waist (and still am), and even though I tightened the waist belt as much as possible the belt buckle of coming loose regularly (it being rather loose by design, presumably to make it easier to use). Eventually, a more experienced instructor hinted that placing a leather strap to the buckle loop would make it fit more tightly – and after going through the selection of leather straps I had been issued (around ten pieces) I found one of suitable thickness that did the job. That said, as summer turned onto autumn and winter I also started to wear more clothing on outdoor exercises, adding a bit of bulk to the waist. |
Dn Jackson | 12 Nov 2022 7:42 p.m. PST |
"That said, considering the amounts of material produced and stored, it is not necessarily trivial feat to re-work them, especially if one happens to be in the middle of an armed conflict." Indeed, it is an issue. My father was still wearing web gear made during WWII in the 1960s when he was in the Marine Corps. |
Zephyr1 | 13 Nov 2022 9:51 p.m. PST |
I remember seeing a PBS show about WW2 equipment & reenactors commented that the German leather webbing squeaked quite a bit, while the British cloth webbing was much more quieter. Just an observation… ;-) |
ScottWashburn | 14 Nov 2022 8:41 a.m. PST |
This compares with the American web-gear system which is nearly impossible to take apart :) |
jgawne | 16 Nov 2022 4:07 p.m. PST |
Assuming you mean the WW2 American web gear, it coms apart pretty easily if you know what you are doing, yet does not 'fall apart' as the German does. But more on the German- consider the belt buckle of the common soldier. It does not really have a standard 'tongue buckle' like most belts- but has one buckle to adjust the size down to a few inches- you set that, and then it is a simple hook and loop to actually fasten the belt together. This means it has to be slightly tight, or else it will just fall apart. Makes it easy to open up, but much liek the Y straps loops, it can open up at the worse possible moment. You get used to it, but there are better ways. |
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