"The sad yet growing trend of Wargaming on Youtube" Topic

A pet peeve of mine is the increasing replacement of written wargaming blogs/websites with boring, overlong, badly produced Youtube videos.

Seriously I can read very quickly and I don't have time to sit there and watch 2 hours of nerds rolling dice and trying to be witty.

In fact I hate the Youtubification of everything. My brother sends me 30 minute videos on history whose content could fit on a single A4 page that I can read in half a minute or less!

Now I do like Youtube for tutorials on how to make terrain or assemble kits with no instructions.

For everything else, the written word with pictures is so much better.

!'m with you. Esp. long rambling videos with no editing. Of course this is all over youtube now, check out fishing videos, or rather DON'T. :-)

I completely agree. But then again I'm the sort who like to spend a full minute admiring a high resolution picture and occasionally saving it for future inspiration.

Same goes with painting tutorials, weirdly enough. Give me this:

link

Over this, any time of day:

YouTube link

The key is brevity.

I agree with the four posters above.

Butt, reeding werdz is mor harder than wachin vidioes.

I do sometimes semi-watch (listening, mostly), while washing dishes and such.

You can see how long the videos are, and all too frequently I just don't have the time to spend 30-45 minutes watching something. I'd rather read, too.
Grelber

You don't have professionals doing it. Just fans. And that's the problem.
Worse are the "unboxing" videos. You have a bunch of 30 (or older) year olds acting like a 8 year old at Christmas.

Having said that, I sincerely do not consider wargaming a spectator sport.

Unboxing videos are indeed the worst.

Having said that, I sincerely do not consider wargaming a spectator sport.

I enjoy sitting there watching a game in real life and socialising with the players.

But that's different to watching 3 hours of it on a video!

As the OP said I've found video tutorials on YouTube very useful (not just wargaming related either but motorbike repairs and DIY jobs) becuase I find seeing something in real time works better than reading about for me.

Having said that I can't get into battle reports and product review videos I find them overly long and not particularly fun and much rather read a blog post with a few nice photos.

I suspect that those who make the videos would not do anything if not doing a video.
Therefore, I welcome videos rather than nothing from these contributors.

I cannot deny gamers their outlet. It is not my job.

martin

I much prefer to read material online rather than watch videos.

I can save/copy/print what I want to retain.

I certainly don't have time to watch videos.

Barrie

As someone who produces stuff across various formats, each type of social media has a different place.

Instagram – Goldfish level, glance, like, v little interaction
Twitter – like insta but with more swearing and a bit more interactive
Facebook – a little bit longer in format, good for a few pics and a couple of paragraphs
You Tube – Good for a visual feast and rule run throughs
Blog – long format write ups, scenarios etc

The sad thing with blogs is that viewer numbers are down drastically on where they were even 5 years ago. Although on the thread above most people seem to want to read blogs in real life the majority don't and I think that is why more people have moved over to Utubes.

In general however its the public that judge on, like or follow or subscribe to a channel (or not) and those who are good will get the followers.

However I would encourage people to put stuff on Utubes if that's what they want as they said on Field of Dreams "build it and they will come" I can choose to watch or not. It takes time to learn to edit and use a camera etc, most channels get better with time. When I watch my early videos and compare them to where I am now I have learnt so much and it was only through stumbling through those first forays into video that I learnt what to do and what not to, I still have a long way to go.

Regards Ken
The Yarkshire Gamer
yarkshiregamer.blogspot.com

"Although on the thread above most people seem to want to read blogs in real life the majority don't and I think that is why more people have moved over to Utubes."

Sorry, Yarkshire. I may have to live in a Cyril Kornbluth world, but I don't have to act like a Cyril Kornbluth character.

It's a book reference. Get over it.

Robert,

have you got out of the wrong side of the bed mate, what are you on about ?

I have made a personal observation from my experience about reduction in blog post hits and my conversations with other bloggers and those who read, or used to read blogs.

Get over it yourself, never mentioned you, never suggested you needed to change.

Ken

Easy Fix. Don't watch them. I find blogs generally boring and the very, very few YouTubes I have attempted to watch are abysmal. I don't bother with either of them unless there is a very specific reason to do so.

We'll be looking forward to seeing what exciting and engaging videos you will be producing, OP!

I don't watch wargaming videos. I think personally the only thing worse than watching one would be to have to make one!

The sad thing with blogs is that viewer numbers are down drastically on where they were even 5 years ago. Although on the thread above most people seem to want to read blogs in real life the majority don't and I think that is why more people have moved over to Utubes.

I have to say I was rather appalled by your rationale, seeing that it's coming from the owner of a blog I have long admired. Are you deriving revenue from views? Because it really shouldn't be a popularity contest. I find chasing likes, whether on YouTube or Facebook, to be really sad. You of all people should be content in the knowledge that you own and are capable of producing beautiful armies of well-painted miniatures that will provide hours worth of tabletop fun.

Talking of sad, there's a couple of incorrigible self promoters who flood multiple message boards on different sites with links to their YouTube videos that nary get a response, and when they do, they immediately ask the person to subscribe.

We'll be looking forward to seeing what exciting and engaging videos you will be producing, OP!

It actually isn't that difficult, as any of the multitude of homemade cooking videos with near-professional production quality can tell you. The key to it all being good lighting, a decent camera (though in this day and age you can easily get away with a high end phone), and crisp editing involving multiple angles and some common sense about timing.

And yes, this is coming from someone who had experienced movie-making and advertising first hand back in the early to mid 2000s, and who thinks film and book critics ought to exist.

Maha,

Honestly, you have read my intention completely wrong, I am merely stating fact. Blog visits are down over the board and I clearly state that in my OP as a result of my own experience and those I have spoken to.

Both other blog owners and readers have confirmed this to me. Nowhere have I said it was a popularity contest, nowhere have I said I make money from it (in fact nothing I do is monetised, I have been doing my best to help Gamers all over the world, for free for years and to suggest otherwise is very poor form.

I am not chasing likes etc and have a wide and I thought friendly following on many areas of social media.

You are massively wide of the mark,

It is sad that blog views are down, not because I want likes but because blogs are a fantastic and FREE method of spreading helpful information. I love reading blogs many other, mostly younger Gamers say they don't have time, I think that's sad as they are missing out, am I wrong.

I do not say anywhere that I am moving away from blogging at all merely that FOR SOME the reduction in visits will reduce THEIR enthusiasm to post using that format.

Very disappointed that you would think that way about Yarkshire Gamer, very disappointed

Ken

Written formats require writing skills. Sadly, the younger generations are falling into modern shorthand writing, and grammar skills are fading very quickly. For the younger generations, videos, and other social media, are 'easier' for them to produce.

I do some technical writing for my job. It is a lot of work. I need to update an 84 page manual every quarter (it was only 77 pages until last quarter…). Technical writing is a set of skills few people younger than 40, possess anymore. The world has moved heavily towards modern texting shorthand: U – you; R – are; etc. It is what it is. Adapt, or not. If you want your information to reach the younger generations, you need to adapt to their preferences.

Sadly, many forums have been abandoned in favor of YouTube, FaceBook, and other social media venues, which are not as well suited to creating a lasting, navigable, searchable, body of work on the Internet. Forums require different navigation techniques, but IMO, they are better suited to searches, and they are supremely better organized, but that is just my opinion. FaceBook, to me, is like an endless, run-on sentence, the way posts are organized, always being pushed ever downward, by newer posts. I find it very difficult to follow, so I gave up, closed my account, and I've never looked back. I choose to adapt partially: IMO – In My Opinion; LOL – Laugh Out Loud; emojis; and a few others. ;-)

Sadly, the texting shorthand is often believed by younger job seekers, to be acceptable for business communication, particularly in cover letters included with their applications! Businesses have not adapted to this "shorthand", yet, and I doubt they ever will. Cheers!

In part a lot of gamers are "playing" with various platforms, and I think we'll see a settling out over time.

Youtube is great for some things, like DIY projects or terrain building or painting tips. But people who make a 90 minute video on the same don't know what a "tip" is.

Same for rules explanations. A short vid to walk through one tricky bit can be helpful. But a 25 minute video on how to move….ugh.

Also, video's can't be usefully bookmarked or marked up etc.

Yarkshire said:

"The sad thing with blogs is that viewer numbers are down drastically on where they were even 5 years ago.

I have to agree with this, as oddly enough, I was discussing this on (of all places), my fb page, and the resounding answer was essentially "Yes, blogs are slowly dying out".
Now does this mean they will end? Of course not. If you want proof, all I can say is that "Myspace is still up and running and some people are still using it. Same with LiveJournal."

I don't watch a lot of the "Gaming" stuff on youtube, but I have used it to see some of the classes on painting skills that were taught at the recent RVE 2021. I find that very helpful.

However, all I can say is, if you don't like the stuff on youtube, then either:

A: Produce something better.

or

B: Don't watch it.

YMMV and probably does.
Murphy

There are good videos and bad. Personally, I like to watch a video or two of a game I may potentially buy. Doing so has saved me hundreds, if not thousands, of dollars. If the video is crap, I don't watch it. If the guys voice annoys me, I don't watch it. If the guy can't hold a camera still, I don't watch it. If a game AAR is only 5 or 10 minutes long, I don't watch it.
If, on the other hand, the video is clear and well presented, I find it can really help my gaming isolation. And some really helped during lockdown.
Actually, I am kind of surprised that not more people have this POV.
Oh well, whatever blows your hair back is ok with me.I

Steve

I prefer to watch a 90 minute youtube video reviewing rules than to watch most 90 minute movies that come out of Hollywood.

Sgt Slag@ I suffer from Dyslexia writing a readable blog post (or even a message board post like this) can take me some time. I have to employ a spelling and grammar checker as well as family members to read it. Even then it can be mistake ridden. It doesn't stop me writing a blog I just try to add lots of pretty pictures to cover up my crappy writing.

The Youtube videos for playing Euro games are great and can be extremely helpful. Even though I play some complex rules and board war games I was having trouble wrapping my head around things like Terra Mystica. Presto, watch a 15 minute video and you're ready to play! The unboxing videos are definitely a waste of time, especially those that feature games that have been out for years.

The biggest issue with the wargaming videos is that you have to take it on faith that the gamers in the video are playing the games correctly! I've seen several where they're playing the rules wrong, interpreted the turn sequence incorrectly, and so on.

My take on the decreasing blog traffic is not only the rise of videos, but the sheer number of forums and things like Facebook groups, where clearly a large segment of gaming has moved to. There simply isn't enough time in the day to read everything, so something has to go and in this case it's blogs and web site traffic.

While I'll agree it not a spectators sport and I've gain knowledge by going to workshops at HMGS cons, Some Youtubers are better then others, just like some GMs and blogs are better then others. There a correlation between experience and quality.

Prince Rupert I share your pain.

Life is too short to watch endless video, although some instructional stuff on uTube is very useful indeed for repairing/fixing things.

Maybe it is a generational thing.

I like doing my blog as it is a record of stuff I've done. I'm not hugely bothered if people read it or not. I just view it as an easier to maintain website.

As noted above, media has fragmented across zillions of platforms now. I've lost count of how many gaming and re-enactment FB groups I'm in.

Thank you Yarkshire Gamer for the videos you make. I watch if interested in the subject while others I don't. Easy enough. But your efforts are appreciated! In particular, your video on using oils to paint horses was awesome. I had used oils for years but your video greatly refined my efforts. And I've incorporated your tip to use Refined Turpentine- great stuff. So again, thank you Yarkshire Gamer and sorry someone criticized you without cause on this thread. As they say, no good deed goes unpunished.

Hey Gray Bear,

Cheers for your kind comments, that oil paint video went down really well, glad it helped you out.

I've got no idea what the two people above are on about, the pair of them have got the wrong end of the wrong stick.

Thank you for your support, much appreciated.

Regards Ken
The Yarkshire Gamer

Prince Rupert of the Rhine, thank you for your comments. My post was not aimed at people with Dyslexia, nor any other medical issue which hinders their ability to write coherently. My comments were aimed at what I see overtaking the majority of our education system, and societies, as a whole around the globe.

Social media, in all its myriad forms, is dumbing down younger generations, as well as my own. My reference to cell phone shorthand appearing in business letters, was literally true. It is happening on a large scale, not just in my neighborhood of the World.

I applaud your efforts. You care enough to make extra-ordinary efforts to write good prose. You should be very proud, Sir. I respect your efforts, as well as your results. You are far ahead of those I was wagging my finger at -- they can't be bothered to make any real effort. I take my hat off to you! Cheers, Prince Rupert of the Rhine!

I actually like some of the YouTube stuff. I watched the BBC shows that show Peter Gilder and his friends playing different battles. Waterloo, Gettysburg, and some English civil war. I found it quite enjoyable.

Sorry Yarkshire. To me, the decline in reading is a national tragedy, and you were treating it like hemlines going up and down. Certainly a good instructional video can be worthwhile, but all too often for me the moving pictures and loud noises are a substitute for facts and reason. See the evening news or most of Hollywood's production.

If you're doing good work, go on doing it. But a world with fewer readers is a worse world.

Agree the decline in reading is sad, but not sure how you solve for that by railing against YouTube content on wargaming. Consider that most wargamers are relatively literate vs, say, console gamers.

Is this not replicating real life? People read books, then TV arrived. Now people read books AND watch TV. it's simply the changing way in which people consume, and produce information.

I follow a few painting, crafting and terrain making channels on youTube.

The quality is improving significantly over the years as the presenters learn film-making skills and invest in tech and post-production.

The Little Wars TV guys are making some entertaining and diverse wargaming stuff.

Check them out.

YouTube link

regards

David F Brown

I ditched the blog in 2012 and replaced it with YouTube. I don't make videos over three minutes.
I don't read blogs anymore. Someone wrote above that blogs are dying. Unfortunately however, they are already dead.

Yarkshire Gamer,

nowhere have I said I make money from it (in fact nothing I do is monetised, I have been doing my best to help Gamers all over the world, for free for years and to suggest otherwise is very poor form.

No need to get offended. As someone who has spent a small fortune shelling out money for modelling guides and rules supplements in both paper and pdf form, I do not object to gamers seeking to supplement their hobby budgets. For that matter, I also do not have anything against those countless self-professed cooking experts and cosmetics reviewers who earn revenue off the back of their YouTube videos. All perfectly legitimate.

The reason I asked whether you are earning income from your content is because that's the only reason I can think of for why someone would pay close attention to their site and view stats.

I am not chasing likes etc and have a wide and I thought friendly following on many areas of social media.

I don't mean to be snarky, but do you realise how oxymoronic that statement is? It actually reminds me of a conversation I recently had with a friend's daughter who kept insisting that the 2000 or so friends she has on Facebook is "just a number" but who nevertheless was clearly very proud of it, judging from how often she would bring it up.

It is sad that blog views are down, not because I want likes but because blogs are a fantastic and FREE method of spreading helpful information.

What's so sad about it? As a follower of your blog and many others, I don't give a tuppence about whether the number of readers or subscribers are down as long as those blogs continue to exist and updated (though I will happily settle for the former as I am continually revisiting old entries).

Sad is when a great blog like Yarkshire Gamer disappears just because it's no longer getting the readership it once commanded. Now that's a tragedy.

I love reading blogs many other, mostly younger Gamers say they don't have time, I think that's sad as they are missing out, am I wrong.

So you're doing this all for them? Even if you weren't on Facebook and YouTube, I'm sure people would inevitably make their way to the wonderful resource that is your blog one way or another, be it through a Google search for a manufacturer's figures or "this is uber cool, take a look" links others share on their social media platform of choice.

To be clear, I don't think it deplorable that you're diversifying mediums or trying to stay relevant in front of a younger audience. At its core the hobby is a social one and sharing is an integral part of it.

I like doing my blog as it is a record of stuff I've done. I'm not hugely bothered if people read it or not.

This!

Same as Martin Rapier. I had a wiki which was originally a one-shot weapon to showcase rules and the club etc. I moved to the blog because I found it easier to use and it encouraged me to actually complete stuff. Finding like-minded people across the globe has been a bonus.

There are lots of people out there doing goodly things with toy soldiers that could/would never produce an article for a glossy mag. How they showcase is up to them. I'm just glad they do.

Maha,

Is this the 5 minute argument or the full half hour.

If you use the word "appalled" in your first sentence about me, it just might get my back up lol, you are completely wrong especially when (as I have said before) I was merely stating fact. Your OP comes across as a accusation that I was purely chasing likes and doing it to make money, neither of which is true.

I'm going to suggest that their is a reasonably strong correlation between quality of content and number of followers or likes. Both of those indicators could be used as a guide to "am I doing this right ?" Is this a good quality, informative post.

There is a danger that I'm sure some would fall into of chasing likes and changing their posts to get more likes. But I don't think there is anything wrong in producing quality posts that get more attention.

If I was chasing likes I would post constantly about Bolt Action and 40k, not about obscure theatres of WW1, Italian Wars of Independence and Medieval Italian re-enactors.

So to answer your new questions,

I think you are being snarky, which is fine I'm happy to defend myself. I don't think the statement I made is an oxymoron, there is no contradiction between the two parts of the sentence. It is perfectly possible to have wide following without chasing likes. A painting tutorial on 15mm Modern IDF Infantry is certainly not chasing likes.

I do think is sad that blog reads are down, not just my blog lots of others, is it wrong for me to want the hobby to thrive and grow. I think of the great assistance I have got with new projects from the likes of Steve's Balagan and Olicanalad and I am grateful.

I want those and new articles to be avaliable for new and old Gamers alike not be narcissistic and think they should just stay around for me.

Yarkshire Gamer as a blog hasn't and isn't going anywhere, I still think blogs are the best place for long form posts, be they scenarios or opnion pieces. Is that just chasing likes or is it just trying to help people ?

Yarkshire Gamer is more likely to dissappear when people are appalled at what I do and I think why do I bother, just say "Sod this" and just switch it all off.

Ken

I actually do like to see blogs as find inspiration from them very often, sadly don't go looking for them only when I see a link here about something that looks interesting or of my interests.
Watched many of these videos being talked about, (my YouTube app throws them at me) buy agree get to your point as often that 30 minute video even if painting and is back ground or a time waster between colors and find I'm fast forwarding.

I'll be honest. Too many wargame videos are lazily done. I get tired of people rambling on, saying the same thing 5 times, shakey camera, holding and spinning stands of miniatures so we can't really appreciate them, bad lighting, battle reports that ramble for hours, and so on. I've seen better videos from 12 year olds doing Lego!

Aegis is spot on about boardgame videos. We watch them as well. Model trains have awesome video shows as well.

An excellent video site is from iainmstanding. His Warmaster videos are excellent and took a lot of thought and prep. Always like Big Lee's videos as well.

No connection to followers. Look at views. But don't get puffed up about views. A view means that a real person watched it at least 30 seconds. A few hundred views? Whoopie. Likes and comments play a huge role. People who say they don't care about views and popularity are being disingenuous, otherwise the site would languish in obscurity. Who wants their work to languish?

"it's simply the changing way in which people consume, and produce information."

Nah. I'll grant anyone exceptions both ways, but the moving pictures and loud noises systems aren't into information: they're into emotion and sensation--which is why, for example, TV and movies have so may cop shows and thrillers, but so few actual fair play mysteries. Facts and reason aren't what they do. (And now I have to apologize to the makers of the old Timothy Hutton Ellery Queen, which produced a series of competent mysteries while only once taking one from a book. But you see how far back I had to reach.) Informational videos are less so than your average TV show--do they still call them that when their only release is on the Internet?--But a 30 minute video is the equivalent of 30 typed of printed pages in time consumed. Anyone want to argue they have as much information?

I enjoy it all; written blogs, video, audio blogcasts, magazines and books.

Its the quality of the content that matters not the medium.

Suggestion for a "good" video.

Get. To. The. Point.

An decently edited AAR or basic report should not exceed 10 minutes.

Intro. <10 sec splash is enough
Subject. <10 sec splash is enough
Body.
-1
W/Map
-2
W/Map
-3
W/Map
Overall impact w/ final map.
Conclusion.

Done.

I blog. Yes I am interested in the statistics for my blog. Not in a "wow, big numbers, must have big numbers" way, more in a "that went down well" sense. I like to think I am writing the blog I would have liked to have found when I started my ECW project. Yes I have digressed away from pure modelling and gaming, but the two parts of the blog are both very closely connected (a travelogue visiting museums/battlefields connected to the ECW as well as the miniatures side).

Yes, I run adverts and have a butmeacoffee link: this was suggested by a reader of one of my painting guides. It doesn't earn me any real money, but it does pay for the fees for the domain name.

Do I get excited by the numbers? Sometimes. Currently fast approaching 200k views so anticipating the clock turning over. I do find it amusing that people read my blog. It started out as a repository for lots of notes I had made.

Must be doing something right as I have been approached by publishers…

Would I produce videos? Nope. Genuinely hate the sound of my own voice.

Some videos are very useful, some less so. (If you fancy videoing, learn to use the camera – use a tripod, pan/zoom slowly!)

Videos about rules mechanisms – if a rules writer has to make a video to explain and illustrate how a mechanism works… perhaps they should relook at how they wrote their rules. Rules should be understandable from the rulebook, they shouldn't require a 15 minute video explanation. Too many rules are poorly written/not proof read/not explained well enough/ only understandable by an 'inner circle'.

There is this thing called "Fast Forward." I find it quite useful and I find you can actually skip to the point of the narration. Quite a useful tool.