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"A little Tank On Tank 3mm gamin'" Topic


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FlyXwire04 Jun 2021 4:57 a.m. PST

Hi Guys,

Here's some pics of something old and new – the mat is new, but the 'pizza treat' 3mm units are from a previously based collection I sold to a friend that we got back into action recently.

We played two Soviet vs. German encounters in about 3hrs. at our local hobby shop….(TonT here has always been a fun – low prep – good time).

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian04 Jun 2021 5:08 a.m. PST

Nice to see something different for a change. grin

Desert Fox04 Jun 2021 5:46 a.m. PST

Good looking game!

Tell us more about your basing, looks great!

And are those star-shaped bases entrenchments? How did you make them?

FlyXwire04 Jun 2021 7:57 a.m. PST

Editor Bill and Desert Fox – thank you Guys!

The "Panzer Wedge" basing for these started first as a sandwich of adhesive-backed magnet sheet stuck onto the back of a letter-size layer of black, craft fun foam (the foam sides providing enough thickness to pick the stands up by).

I cut out a metal master from a spare figure stand to use as a guide, and then placed this flush against the magnet side of the sheeting, to scissor cut along the three edges of the guide to make the base triangular "blanks". It's just a matter of moving the metal guide along the sheeting, and carefully holding the pieces together as you cut out your bases – who needs to buy bases when you can make your own from a sandwiched combination of magnet and foam sheets!

(the magnet backs can be used for holding your units secure within your storage/travel containers too)

Also, if one uses the adhesive-sided type of fun foam sheet, then the minis can be stuck right onto the peeled adhesive side when ready to mount them (I still used some glue to each casting to ensure attachment).

Last step for each stand is your flocking/basing material desired.

Hey, DFox….so you like those little dug-in counters, eh? :)

With this 3mm scale, emplaced/static infantry positions can just be indicated by some sort of scenic counter, instead of needing to buy & mount lots of little infantry strips. Those 'infantry platoon" counters started as game pieces from the board game Duel Of Giants -

They were flocked, and then I 1st used a black marker to draw out the trench lines on them, and then used Army Painter Strong Tone wash [it's like a brown stain] to go over the marker lines to give them a more diffused – earthy – look.

Wish I hadn't sold this 3mm kit to my bud, but there comes a time you feel you've got to let some things go.

Crazy I'm getting back into 3mm again, but hey…….

On the game here – that line of entrenched infantry above was a battalions' worth with a couple of AT gun batteries interspersed within the MLR (a "default" infantry battalion position with organic mortar and field artillery support backing it up).

The scenarios we played evolved off of this basic defensive front line – and by adding in different combinations of attacking and defending forces encountering this "sector", the scenarios were generated for the afternoon. Post-game I discussed with the buds how a mini campaign game could be managed by using these default battalion arrayed across a larger campaign map, with encounters being generated in the sectors the enemy side might attempt to push through (but that's another day/idea yet to come).

Bashytubits04 Jun 2021 11:50 a.m. PST

What rules are you using? I saw you reference TonT but what is that? Your mat and the terrain with the minis looks very good.

BattlerBritain04 Jun 2021 12:26 p.m. PST

Yeah the map looks great!

Is that Patton's Best or is it home made?
Different pencil colours across cardboard backing?

FlyXwire04 Jun 2021 1:16 p.m. PST

Bashytubits, the original hex-based Tank On Tank board game rules (and game series) by Lock n' Load Publishing was the starting point for my first 3D rules modifications.

Our local group has taken the rules system far beyond its basic beginnings – and that started by actually defining a ground and unit scale, then bolting on a simple armor penetration addition based on the new range scale, then some artillery differentiation, etc., but, the core game mechanics are still there, because the original game was so elegant to begin with IMO.

I've made the modded 2-page QRS available before, but it's changed since then too. ;)

Actually, I've made a newer 3mm variant just recently that uses single based units with some limited step reduction mechanics, and have a 6-12mm variant that uses platoon units comprising their actual combat elements. So instead of rolling a single time, as per each base with the 3mm miniatures variant, the larger scale version has players rolling for each tank, squad, or weapon element contained within the platoon maneuver unit, and casualties are taken by elements too, rather than by attriting a complete stand (or suffering a step reduction) at a time.

Basically, the rule system can scale with the minis used, or even by the defined ground scale.

From my point of view, it's the utilization of a gridded map board that helped maintain the symplified, areas-based stacking limits we have defined, and keeping easy to manage area-defined terrain, which helps keep the game manageable. However, the aesthetic goal was to make a functional game board that still presented a grid pattern, without looking too much like a gridded game board. Having the map "platform" opened up the possibility of beginning each scenario's design by using a common map "system" – then the next step begins by differentiating each scenario by laying out the mat's particular game terrain for it.

Here's a graphic I made up for a discussion with the local group, exploring/explaining some of the versatility of using a gridded game board (for the movement scale), but with a range stick that can be adjusted to what a particular range band "increment" actually equals -

Btw, I'm not always the clearest with what I'm trying to convey with these things, but as long as I get the things to feel right "on paper", that's my goal…… :)))

Edit: Just saw your comments above BB – the mat is my modified, digitally-rendered map, that's been printed out on vinyl. This one seen here is basically a half-scale reduction of my original, 6ft. X 4ft. version. I have a winter version too that I plan on having printed out at half scale also (so as a 3ft. X 4ft. mat)…..to lay out next to each other on a single, standard-size tabletop, to have two games running at the same time.

I sort of look at these smaller scale mats with these 3mm minis, as being intro-type game variants…..while the game group could have another table running one of the 6ft. X 4ft. mats, and for featuring a more involved scenario on (this for like at a game day or con).

Mark 1 Supporting Member of TMP11 Jun 2021 5:05 p.m. PST

If I ever went to a miniatures ruleset with 1-to-several unit scales, this is the approach I would hope to emulate.

For me, if I'm playing with miniatures and the rules say it's a platoon of tanks, I want to see a platoon of tanks. If it's a cardboard chit I don't much care how many tanks are shown, but if it's miniatures I want to see the tanks. That's the whole reason I'm playing with miniatures.

I really appreciate what you've done here FlyX. Besides being aesthetically pleasing (ie: it looks good), it also seems to give a real feel for the battle forces spread across the terrain (ie: it looks good in a different way).

Please continue posting as you continue to develop and use this approach. Good looking stuff!

-Mark
(aka: Mk 1)

FlyXwire12 Jun 2021 5:21 a.m. PST

Hi Mark!

Thanks so much for your comments, and I'll make sure to post some more updates on this 3mm project.

Right now I'm working towards a game date for playing at our local shop, and as being sort of a "let's get back to the game table" event next month.

Finger-deep right now making up snowy tree stands to populate a new winter mat for this upcoming game day.

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