Tango01 | 03 Feb 2021 10:11 p.m. PST |
"Lets say the Japanese decide to send the Yamato to the Guadalcanal campaign. Instead of a jumped-up pre-WWI era battlecruiser, its the planets latest BB which faces South Dakota and Washington. I suspect that South Dakota is a goner, OTL she was hit 3-4 shells from Kirishima which did not penetrate but destroyed her radar and electrical systems. No way she is taking a comparable number of hits from Yamato and living to tell the tale…" From here link Amicalement Armand |
Editor Katie | 03 Feb 2021 11:28 p.m. PST |
From the Alternate History forum. |
Nine pound round | 04 Feb 2021 5:28 a.m. PST |
Deployment decisions at Guadalcanal for both sides were heavily influenced by the length of supply lines and tanker capacity issues. It was, in effect, a battle fought at the very edge of the logistical envelope for that period. Although important, it was never potentially decisive- which was one reason the Japanese limited their naval commitment. They were always going to fight the Big One somewhere more advantageous. At night, under 1942 conditions of training, command and control, and general proficiency, I think Yamato would've given a good account of herself, but not necessarily as good as the poster seems to think. We played Yamato and Kirishima vs South Dakota and Washington once, as a daylight encounter using Seekrieg. Even with the caliber advantage, the Americans landed the first blows and kept on hitting, long before Yamato scored back. The shell size is an advantage, but it's greatly offset by the American fire control systems. |
HMS Exeter | 04 Feb 2021 8:24 a.m. PST |
Yamato and Musashi both did stints at Truk during the Guadalcanal campaign, but neither was actively employed, given their staggering fuel demands. Yamato was primarily used as a floating fuel barge, topping off other ships. I dont have the sources at my fingertips, but I remember reading the initial Japanese naval offensive was possible because of the pre war fuel reserve. By the end of 1942, oil imports and processing were only just keeping pace with consumption. Actively employing Yamato simply wasn't feasible. To have done so, so far into the forward area, would have necessitated benching an unacceptably large portion of the remainder of the fleet. |
Wackmole9 | 04 Feb 2021 11:46 a.m. PST |
I agree with Nine pound round on the fuel oil issues. Even with the conquest of the Dutch east indians, Japan had a major oil shortage and lacked of Tankers. Remember most of Japan's Imports pre war were brought in using US/British shipping and they really didn't capture a lot of shipping in the early that was useful. Also they had a huge shortage of Merchant Seamen and In generally had a terrible logistic chain. |
Tango01 | 04 Feb 2021 12:18 p.m. PST |
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Zephyr1 | 04 Feb 2021 9:55 p.m. PST |
I think Yamato would have run aground someplace down there. In alternate history, it would have become a diving/tourist destination… ;-) |
John the OFM | 04 Feb 2021 10:49 p.m. PST |
Eerily reminiscent of the 15 Tiger tanks who get off the train behind the front, and 4 arrive at the battlefield. Quantity has a quality all its own. |
foxbat | 05 Feb 2021 12:38 a.m. PST |
Let's suppose everything turns fine and the Japanese can successfully deploy the big Y to the Canal… I tried that one with Naval Thunder some years ago. In the end, the Washington was sunk, but the Yamato was waiting for the coup de grāce by the Sodak with all three 18" turrets out of commission. |
Nine pound round | 05 Feb 2021 7:40 a.m. PST |
The Guadalcanal campaign is one of the most interesting to game, in part because it was the only point in the war when the two sides met for surface engagements on a close-to-level playing field. The rapid expansion of the USN diluted the experienced crews heavily with reservists and recruits, and the Japanese night-fighting advantage was at its peak. By early 1943, the USN had gained the upper hand, and the differential between the two sides expanded continually thereafter throughout the war. The temporal positioning of Guadalcanal makes it unusually feasible to test what might have happened had available ships been sent, or new ones become available slightly earlier. For the USN in particular, the new wartime construction was coming into service, so it's not an incredible strain to say something like, "what if the Clevelands had been available in division strength six months earlier?" Properly timed and placed, they might have made Tassafaronga (for example) look more like Empress Augusta Bay. |
Tango01 | 05 Feb 2021 12:35 p.m. PST |
Interesting…. Amicalement Armand
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ScottWashburn | 07 Feb 2021 11:00 a.m. PST |
As far as I can tell, Yamato didn't have a reliable fire control radar until mid 1943 (she had an air detection radar earlier than that). So in a night action at Guadalcanal she would not have been able to make use of the long range of her guns. The action probably would have begun with the American firing first due to their radar, but still at pretty close range. If we assume that South Dakota does not suffer the electrical failures that crippled her then Washington and South Dakota could certainly have given Yamato a run for her money. |