"1809 Austrians WIP" Topic

Dave,

Paint is what I have to work with, but I can copy any color available and import it to Paint.

Hello everyone,

I am almost finished with the Austrian officer and now working on Bavarians. All that is left is the casket MK cipher. This is the 4 Line Regiment. I went with a darker coat than the traditional painted cornflower blue. I have been using Albrecht Adam, Wilhelm von Kobell, the Johann Cantler plates on Napoleon-series, and Dr. Petre Bunde's plates which give a clearer view of small details. Von Kobell gives tons of examples of Bavarian infantry in 1806-1807, 1809, and 1812-1814. I was not sure when the company distinctive was put on the raupenhelm, but the man on the left has one and can be seen in the 1807 painting.

Painting by von Kobell at Poplawi 8 Infanterie in Halt. Picture from von Winterfeldt.

Officer of the 4th Regiment.

Felduniform des Obersten Carl von Dietfurth vom 11. Regiment

From Ingolstadt Military museum

nice work again, the Bavarian blue still a bit too bright.

A lot of Austrian muskets were used in the Bavarian army.

Please check if in 1809 still a part of the waistcoat could be seen under the lapels.

Hello everyone,

I darkened the second Bavarian fusilier coat and made a senior officer in field uniform. Also, the Austrian officer on the left has a slightly more grey coat than the original on the right. Let me know what you think. Thank you for your time.

Austrian officer coat colour looks better (could be lighter still). Assuming these are German regiments then cuffs should be square not pointed. Then can also be facing coloured.

1809,

Ok, I will take it a little lighter and work on the cuffs. I read a few articles on Austrian officer uniforms. It seems a lot of information is they might have worn this or that, with white turnbacks or regimental color turnbacks seem to be both acceptable as well as color on the cuffs of the grey coat.

the changed Bavarian blue looks much better.

I wouldn't change the Austrians unless there are more contemporary sources showing lighter hues.

More work on the Bavarians. I finished the full dress uniform of the Colonel and two light infantry battalion soldiers. The one on the left has a lighter green coat which changed in Nov 1809 to darker green. Also, some work on the lapels below.

More work on the 1809 Austrian and Bavarian army. I added the oak leaves for the Austrians and started work on the standard bearer, but the flag might be out of my reach of my artistic abilities using Paint. Also, a unit I posted on my blog awhile ago Officers and soldiers from the 5th Infantry Regiment Preysing. To make them larger, double click and press open image in a new tab.

Any comments are welcome,
Michael

Pour les Autrichiens: SUPERBE!

Je m'interroge juste sur cet "écusson"?
Insigne d'un Gefreiter?

url=https://www.photorapide.com/photos/1755668/w0rbzp.jpg]

Bernard

Bonjour Bernard,

C'est censé être des feuilles de chêne. C'était le meilleur que j'ai pu dessiner avec Microsoft Paint ! Je vais ensuite créer un officier supérieur et travailler le drapeau. Après cela, très probablement Grenzer ou Hussars. Sur quoi travaillez-vous maintenant?

Cordialement, Michel

nice work again, the nco stick / cane – on for the Feldwebel looks odd, it seems to be tucked under the cross belt?

Do you have Müller Braun – he shows it quite well, will send you a pm

von Winterfeldt,

I will make the change for the Bavarian NCO. Thank you1

Do you have any good documents on mount infantry officers ? I only have a few portraits of senior officers.

@M-C
Ah, je n'avais pas compris…

Je travaille actuellement sur la bataille d'Arnhofen le 19 avril 1809.

Question à la communauté:
Est-ce que quelqu'un connaît la différence vestimentaire entre un Gefreiter et un Gemeine?
A priori un insigne…???
Bernard

@M-C
Aurais-tu l'état de situation de la 1ʳᵉ Division du 7ème Corps d'Armée Bavarois au 15 juin 1809, mais NET.
En effet, je l'ai déjà récupéré chez toi, mais flou…
Impossible de lire les petites écritures.
Bernard

the saddle cloth was red with two laces in button colour and according to the Stein / Gärtner book also with fringes (there I have my doubts, maybe for colonels only, I found I few contemporary prints, alas of 1807, which I will send with pm

Bernard,

Malheureusement, l'image est floue et le 15 juin, von Zandt est mort, donc je ne sais pas qui était Adc. Je ferai de mon mieux pour éclaircir l'image.

von W,

Thank you! I will probably only be making the Colonel for the Austrians & Bavarians so I am grateful for the help!

Fascinating stuff indeed.

I am in the research stage of a new refight and am learning about the Austrian army of 1809 so your work is of great interest.

The actual colour of Austrian white is most interesting as the ‘ washing machine whiter than white' look seems to be predominant on the war games table.

White is a terrible colour to keep clean and using chalk must have added to the mess after a rain storm.

However, I have looked at the National Army museum in Vienna has a gorgeous display which may be of interest.

link

I think Von Winterfeld suggested ivory white and unbleached wool is another option in my opinion.

Keep up the good work.

Best wishes,

Chris

For some nice prints of Bavarian mounted officers have a look at Die Uniformen der Bayerischen Armee, von 1682 bis 1848 / von F. Münich,… und L. Behringer, at link

Thank you very much.

Lots to learn!

Chris

@ Chris

The late great Shep Paine used two whites which he called warm white and cold white. Warm white had a very pale green tint to it and cold white was slightly mauve. I do French and Austrian infantry in warm white uniforms with Vallejo Ivory belts and it looks surprisingly good.

I never use pure white or black anywhere on any figure so if I were going with a grey / sepia sort of of white I would probably start with Vallejo Silver Grey or Ivory and shade and lighten from there.

4th, you can't just reveal this information about warm and cold whites, then jump to other Vallejo colors. What, pray tell, would be the Vallejo equivalents of the warm white or cold white? I'd love to improve my Austrian colors! Thanks in advance!

Thank you very much for the colour suggestions.

I have used Von Winterfeld's suggestion and mixed white with yellow to make ivory.

This when washed with Gamewash umber creates a very good copy of the infantry uniform on display at the Vienna Army museum.

The benefit as well is that when white is painted for the strapping it stands out as per the original.

I will post some examples when my first Infantry regiment is completed.

Best wishes,

Chris

@ Wunsche

There is no direct Vallejo equivalent nor no set paint ratios, but the rough formulae for each colour were as follows:

WARM WHITE (greenish): Long way: in a clean bottle add equal parts of white (951), buff (976) and khaki (988). Mix well. Add more white then a touch of light blue or medium blue (809) and a touch of brown drab (873). Mix well a little at a time adding white until you get a warm off-white. Short way: as the above comes out pale green-brown, just add 974 Green Sky to white.

COOL WHITE: Long way: start with pure white, use the same colours, but add a smidge more blue (light or medium blue) and somewhat less of the buff and khaki. Add a touch of purple (810). You end with a pale brown-mauve. Short way: add purple and khaki to white.

The truly odd thing about these very unintuitive colours is that when you apply them in lieu of white, they just look white. They really do. The warm white is a sort of Farrow & Ball white, whereas the Cool white is a sort of dry-cleaned-office-shirt white. Vallejo Ivory or Silver Grey for the belts are then noticeably different whites.

You have to exaggerate the green and the purple on our scale of figures. On 54mm and up they look very subtle.

A guy here made his own warm white using Ivory, Japanese uniform, English uniform, light sand and black, giving a white uniform colour that uses no actual white:

link

This mix looks greeny-brown when it goes on, but by the time he finishes the figure, it doesn't – it looks off-white.

Imitating the museum shades is a good shout, but as they are under artificial light and 200 years old, it's hard to know exactly what to aim at. The light blue Hungarian trousers aren't what I'd call light blue, which gives food for thought. They're actually not far off Bavarian blue.

I've always assumed Bavarian blue to be this colour

hm, I don't mix white with yellow to create ivory, this kind of colour is available by a lot of brands, this is for a warm white.

Hi Mr W.

Sorry, my post is possibly misleading.

I meant to say I had used your suggestion of ivory white for the uniforms.

The method I used, was to create my own ivory using white and yellow.

Manufacturers of course supply these colours.

Sorry for the confusion but thank you again for the advice.

The results are in my opinion excellent.

Best wishes,

Chris

My understanding is that the BMW blue is better for later in the century. In the Napoleonic era it's annoyingly similar to everyone else's blue.

Cheers,
John

Hi.

My research suggests that according to The Austrians-Hungarian Army 1792-1814 by WJ Rawkins , the Infantrie Gewehr 1798 had brass fittings and not iron as the previous variant.

I hope that this is of use.

Best wishes,

Chris