Help support TMP


"The American Indian Holocaust, known as the ..." Topic


17 Posts

All members in good standing are free to post here. Opinions expressed here are solely those of the posters, and have not been cleared with nor are they endorsed by The Miniatures Page.

For more information, see the TMP FAQ.


Back to the General Historical Discussion Message Board


Areas of Interest

General

Featured Hobby News Article


Featured Ruleset


Featured Workbench Article

Tree Bases from DAS Clay

Is DAS Clay sturdy enough to mold tree bases from?


Featured Profile Article

Magnets: N52 Versus N42

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian wants to know if you can tell the difference between weaker and stronger magnets with 3mm aircraft.


Current Poll


603 hits since 14 Sep 2020
©1994-2020 Bill Armintrout
Comments or corrections?

Tango01 Supporting Member of TMP14 Sep 2020 4:03 p.m. PST

…."500 year war" and the World's Longest Holocaust In The History Of Mankind

"The term Genocide derives from the Latin (genos=race, tribe; cide=killing) and means literally the killing or murder of an entire tribe or people. The Oxford English Dictionary defines genocide as "the deliberate and systematic extermination of an ethnic or national group" and cites the first usage of the term as R. Lemkin, Axis Rule in Occupied Europe, (1944) p.79. "By ‘genocide' we mean the destruction of a nation or an ethnic group."

The U.N. General Assembly adopted this term and defended it in 1946 as "….a denial of the right of existence of entire human groups." Most people tend to associate genocide with wholesale slaughter of a specific people. However, "the 1994 U.N. Convention on the Punishment and Prevention of the Crime of Genocide, describes genocide beyond outright murder of people as the destruction and extermination of culture." Article II of the convention lists five categories of activity as genocidal when directed against a specific "national, ethnic, racial, or religious group."…"
Main page
link


Amicalement
Armand

pzivh43 Supporting Member of TMP14 Sep 2020 4:16 p.m. PST

I blame the Mongols. They started all this move into a territory and ravage the land thing. If you go back far enough, I'm sure the Neanderthals have a beef against us homo sapiens.

Brian Smaller14 Sep 2020 4:24 p.m. PST

The biggest killer of humans in the New World after contact with Europe was disease. But even if the first Europeans had shown up, smoked a peace pipe, sung kumbaya and left – the diseases would still have ravaged the inhabitants with no immunity to the various diseases.

doc mcb14 Sep 2020 5:39 p.m. PST

What Brian said. More broadly, and with disease as #1, consider also that the Indian's cultures were so weak in relation to the Europeans that the slightest contact brought them despair and destruction. Politically, religiously, ecopnomically, technologically, the natives could never make a 'fair fight." Wars were generally alternating massacres, as Indians attacked by surprise -- the only way they had a chance -- and then the Europeans/whites retaliated by exterminating them. A great tragedy, and quite unavoidable.

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian14 Sep 2020 6:33 p.m. PST

The Spanish did not intend to kill the Indians, they would have greatly preferred to enslave them.

Personal logo mrwigglesworth Supporting Member of TMP15 Sep 2020 3:25 a.m. PST

Don't forget that natives were using genocide on each other as well.

Mr Elmo15 Sep 2020 5:14 a.m. PST

The Elmo family took a vacation recently and visited the Little Bighorn Battlefield. What is interesting was the arrangement of the Black Hills Reservation was destroyed by the discovery of gold.

The government tried to keep prospectors out, it didn't work and the Indians didn't want to modify the treaty. Honestly, given gold it was a losing fight.

lloydthegamer Supporting Member of TMP15 Sep 2020 8:22 a.m. PST

Yeah, might makes right so let's blame the victims for being too weak. There's a lot of self interested rationalization going on here. Not much difference between killing someone and enslaving them, which for the Indians was a virtual death sentence since they died like flies while enslaved. Mr Elmo is right. Greed rules. You've got what I want and if you don't give it to me I'll kill you one way or another. That about sums up White/Indian history.

Choctaw15 Sep 2020 10:33 a.m. PST

We were killing each other long before you boys showed up.

Col Durnford Supporting Member of TMP15 Sep 2020 12:50 p.m. PST

A great "what if" for me would be to ask; what if the immunity issue would have worked the other way around and the Europeans had no immunity to the diseases of e new world? At the local level it would have been like "War of the Worlds". But, just imagine the sequel where the invading aliens take the diseases back to their home world.

Tango01 Supporting Member of TMP15 Sep 2020 1:02 p.m. PST

"The Spanish did not intend to kill the Indians, they would have greatly preferred to enslave them."

Not only Bill… the Spanish also mixed very well with the natives… see Mexico for Example….

Amicalement
Armand

doc mcb15 Sep 2020 4:35 p.m. PST

If a culture is so fragile that it disintegrates at the slightest contact with a stronger one, destruction is inevitable. Of course that is a tragedy. But this is not a case where "blaming the strong" trumps "blaming the weak." Blame doesn't really come into it. Of course both sides were human and did bad things. But it takes some parity of power to establish a long-term peace. Just a fact.

RudyNelson15 Sep 2020 6:30 p.m. PST

Hogwash, the Spanish waged war n the Aztecs, Incas, Florida tribes and totally annihilated those Florida tribes who sided with the French.
They blazed a trail of destruction across what is now Alabama and Mississippi.
They conducted a centuries long war against the Pueblo and Navajo.
Tribes that did not want to convert to Christianity were slaughtered.

Choctaw is right traditional enemies fought endless battles. One battle between the Choctaw lasted several days until the exhausted survivors called a truce to bury the dead. Two mounds were started with one for Chickasaw and the other Choctaw. The twin mounds grew into hills several hundred feet high and covered with dirt. Just one example from my articles in Time Portal Passages called Under One Sun:A record of First Nation conflicts with each other.

Mr Elmo16 Sep 2020 5:59 a.m. PST

The great mystery to me is how did white Europeans become what they were: steel, gunpowder, etc.

What led them to be such bad assess?

rmaker16 Sep 2020 10:52 a.m. PST

The need to resist Islamic and Mongol imperialism.

doc mcb16 Sep 2020 6:24 p.m. PST

Yes. Europe was under siege, and when it broke the siege around 1400 it kept expanding. Also, we have been very open to foreign ideas. The Chinese invent paper and gunpowder and make firecrackers. Europe gets it and makes "A Mighty Fortress."

bobm195928 Sep 2020 4:55 a.m. PST

Mr Elmo….a suggested read: Guns, Germs and Steel by Jared Diamond

Sorry - only verified members can post on the forums.