"Anyone familiar with TacShip? Are we playing wrong?" Topic

My son and I tried TacShip (free) by the author of Full Thrust. It was fun and all, but the fact that the attack probabilities are based on the exact distance to target (and not ranges/bands of distance) meant that we are constantly making runs at each other's ships and firing at point blank ranges. Didn't even had to roll to see if we hit half the time. Since you can shoot anytime during your movement and not only at the end of it, you can close the distance and get literally on top of your target, shoot point blank, and finish flying past them. There really doesn't seem to be a reason to shoot from far away or stay away. Since you are taking turns moving ships it was really easy to get to the target.

Since it was our first time, we made all the ships the same and gave them thrust 8, which was like middle of the examples in the tacship rules. For most of the game, we were at speed 8, which meant each turn required 2 thrust points, allowing us to make up to 4 turns (which we often didn't need). Occasionally we slowed down to 4 and at that speed you can turn around almost in one spot, since each turn has to have just one hex forward movement in between. Makes for a really tight turn there.

Once the ships got together, they stayed close to the middle of the map, making strafing runs and hitting someone every turn point blank, then rushing past them.

Does this sound right for the rules, or are we doing something wrong by shooting point blank and staying close most of the time? The rules for the missiles say firing one puts it 6 hexes ahead and all the ships are so close together once the battle begins, that's too far away. Most of the game, we are really close to each other.

It's exciting and plays fast, except it's not fun when you almost never need "to hit" rolls, because everyone is shooting point blank. Is it just this game system that's like this?

That doesn't sound right at all from the game play.

Are you using a D20 for firing? And are all your weapons turretted? Those are common mistakes for first time players.

As for missiles, the rule state the missile must move it's initial 6 inches/hexes before adding the speed of the launching fighers at which point it can attack. Are you starting the game at less than 18 inches/hexes apart? Because i'm not sure how you can engage so early in the game with missiles otherwise.

The advanatge to staying far apart is of defense; the further you are from another ship, the less likely it is to hit you. Given that damage is automatic, that's the major defense.

IIRC TacShip was a precursor to Full Thrust. Full Thrust is also free and available here:
link

IMHO FT is a superior game to TS.

MajorB, there are kind of different animals as well; TacShip is fro small fighter-like craft, while FT is more for squadrons of large vessels, corvettes and on up.
But I agree the mechanics in FT are simpler.

Sorry gentlemen, I was unable to reply for a couple of days- apparently when you are new to the board, you can create a thread, but then you cannot post to that thread for three days.

Walrus- we are playing with 20 sided dice indeed. We are currently just trying out simple fighters, so they don't have turrets. But it wouldn't make a difference, because the reason we make runs at the enemy wouldn't change. Your attack roll directly depends on your distance to target, so there's incentive to get point blank- then you don't miss. If you have the speed you can then continue past them, because a) shooting in the middle of movement is allowed and b) there's no collision.

That means if I am 8 hexes from a target with speed 10, I can make turns, go right at him, hit point blank so I don't even have to roll, then go past a couple of turns. If I don't do that, I still have to fly somewhere and then shoot from a distance, which means there's a good chance I will miss. Given how quickly fighters die, might as well go for it instead of trying to stay away and miss a bunch.

When you have 3-4 fighters per side on a 18x24 hex board or similar, everyone is within striking distance and there's no way to stay away from everyone for defense, without taking yourself out of the fight.

Other rules I have read are different- full thrust, silent death and starmada AE differ in two ways: attack rolls are based on ranges of distance instead of actual hex distance, which reduces the need to charge (at least not point blank). Also they don't allow shooting and continuing to move, so there's less of "run at enemy, shoot in his face, pull up and go past." Granted, FT and Starmada are not for fighter dogfights, so less movement is allowed for.

If this is how TacShip plays, then fine. It's enjoyable for what it is, a fast game with fighters that doesn't overstay its welcome. I just didn't know if we were playing wrong. Because we are hardly ever rolling to hit, there's always someone close enough to make a run at and no reason not to.

You could try a '1' always misses rule, Colonial Battlefleet uses a roll attack die + firecon vs range to target mechanism but they also have a 1's always miss rule.

Robert

I don't know the rules, but… you might want to try the old-school hex-by-hex movement where every ship moves one hex (assuming they are all equal) and firing after each hex moved is done via some sort of quality hierarchy -- better pilots fire first -- and the damage applies with each shot (not simultaneously).

It will take longer to do one "turn", but on the flip side, from your description, you may not suffer the simple charge and shoot situations and you might start to see a fighter dogfight.

Pair that with some sort of regenerative 'ammo' limits (i.e fighter phaser banks hold 10 dice worth of shots, you can shoot up to two each *one-hex move*, but the engine only returns 1 die worth back to the banks at the end of each *turn*) and then you start thinking about when to fire at 'good enough' range and possibly do 'enough' damage to make longer-ranged shots worthwhile.

But, all this increase bookkeeping (like using markers or pennies to track dice left in the banks of each fighter), but may be worth it to change the current "equations."

Just a thought…