"Battle Honors NVA Casualties Painted" Topic

Here are some casualty figures from Battle Honors. They are the only 25/28 casualties I have found yet. Will be using them for dead figures in Force on Force Ambush Valley.

Nice paint jobs …

Good job.

I believe Baker Company has a few as well.

I also made up some blood trails. Helmets, pouches, and tissue paper bandages (All with some blood painted on) on bases for my Ambush Valley gaming.

Nice work, Hayes.
You have been busy! I got this strange feeling that your game at Spring Offensive is going to be even better than the one you ran at Cold Steel.

best always

Sam

Nice.

Well done!

These look familiar – were they originally Platoon 20?

Thanks!

Skarper these are 28mm, platoon 20 is 20mm, although maybe same poses?

Maybe – only so many ways to sculpt a dead body after all.

Skarper.

A very interesting point. Not sure anyone does dead US Marines, well in miniature anyway. Might be considered in poor taste anyway…..not unreasonably.

But how to sculpt…no I mean to pose…a dead body. Plenty of photos of dead NVA, WWII Germans etc. Rarely see limbs outstretched, as almost universally in model form. My impression is of a genuinely sad figure, hunched up, no headgear, flat to the ground, almost sunk into it and that before the M48 track arrives.

I have never been too convinced my own attempts to create the occasional fallen hero or villain. Horses are easier!

Deadhead you are right they are likely not the most enjoyable thing for a sculptor to research or complete! With the 1:1 rules out there they are a necessity but agree with tastefulness issue.

I had some of the platoon 20 US KIA/WIA figures.

I think if you are going to take the leap and wargame something relatively recent [or indeed not recent] at a scale where casualties need to be represented and not just 'removed' then I say go all in.

Otherwise don't 'play' these kind of games.

I was never a fan of 'disruption' points or 'fatigue' points which seemed to become a thing in the 80s/90s.

If you're simulating a firefight then the players need to know what kind of wounds the troops have suffered so they can prioritise first aid etc.

My rules for Vietnam were 'a little grisly' without I hope wallowing in it.

Some of my players liked them because they put them in difficult situations and were 'atmospheric'. Others never liked them because there were no set victory conditions and they had to decide for themselves how well they accomplished their missions.

I don't have a problem with sculpts of the war dead … as long as they are the "enemies' ". But of course I'm biased …

I think it is helpful to remember what we are learning about and "gaming" did indeed have human consequences. Might even make the players a little more thoughtful about their decisions.

Western countries are always concerned about their wounded and rightly so. In Vietnam, especially, both side put a premium on the recovery of dead and wounded (perhaps for different reasons).

I think the reasons are not so different – just the NLF/PAVN also wanted to deny their enemies an accurate bodycount.

Both sides wanted to save their wounded comrades and recover their bodies if at all possible. It's only human.

Due to the nature of the war, NLF/PAVN forces suffered a much higher proportion of MIAs. Hundreds of thousands of soldiers and civilians are still unaccounted for.

I thought it was interesting to hear, in Washington DC, that there will never be another Unknown Soldier, with advances in DNA testing.

The US MIA issue was truly tragic in keeping alive hope, which, as far as I know, never revealed, much less brought back, one more captive after the initial releases. I once read a great book "Myth Making in America" which showed how easily the MIA numbers were inflated eg a B52 goes down and one parachute is seen. All crew are then listed as MIA as no-one knew which of the crew it was. At least that was what it said….

They are still finding dead Americans. Remains of one was repatriated just last year.

I agree the MIA issue was shamelessly politicized with very little evidence of any people being held after the end of direct hostilities.

I suspect some MIAs died in captivity and were listed as MIA to cover abuse/executions. Tragic but that is the nature of war and especially the American war [as it is called here].

I don't take sides in this. Good people fought and suffered on all sides. Some bad people too. I have some sympathy with those who were personally involved either directly or through family or friends.

It's the hypocrisy I can't tolerate.

They are still finding dead Americans. Remains of one was repatriated just last year.

In SE Asia as well all over the world where both World Wars, Korea, etc. were fought. Remains are being looked for and in some cases found. E.g. recently the Norks gave the US some MIA remains found there.

I have some sympathy with those who were personally involved either directly or through family or friends.

As do I. Visiting the Vietnam Memorial Wall is always very touching, etc. Especially when you see relatives and friends of the dead talking about him, his life, service, etc.

Of course I served with many Vietnam Vets in ROTC and then on active duty. As well as know and talk to many at the YMCA, VA, various Veteran functions etc.

It's the hypocrisy I can't tolerate.

As a member of the Military Officers Association of America. And being asked to be on the staff. I go to an number of Vet events and functions. I just received an invite to a local Veteran's Lunch from one of the many Veteran support organizations, etc., around town. Many of these functions are Free to all Vets. And everything is donated by many local businesses, restaurants, etc.

I mentioned to my cousin it is really amazing to me how well many Vet's are treated now. Verses during the Vietnam War and for years afterwards.

He was drafted during Vietnam but could not pass the physical because of an illness that he had for a long time, and still does. He did have many friends serve and die in Vietnam. He said one word to me when I mention another Vet's lunch/event I was invited to – "Guilt" …

He may be right … some in the US are feeling guilt about how poorly Vietnam Vets were treated.