"Medium Mortars in Chain of Command" Topic
10 Posts
All members in good standing are free to post here. Opinions expressed here are solely those of the posters, and have not been cleared with nor are they endorsed by The Miniatures Page.
Please avoid recent politics on the forums.
For more information, see the TMP FAQ.
Back to the WWII Rules Message Board
Action Log
30 Jul 2019 10:15 a.m. PST by Editor in Chief Bill
- Removed from 28mm WWII boardCrossposted to WWII Rules board
Areas of InterestWorld War Two on the Land
Featured Hobby News Article
Featured Link
Featured Ruleset
Featured Showcase Article72 riflemen join our forces!
Featured Movie Review
|
Trajanus | 30 Jul 2019 9:20 a.m. PST |
When we started playing CoC a while back, we didn't use Medium Mortar Barrages that much and I've noticed a lot of people playing the rules on You Tube don't either. Since playing the Operation Martlet mini campaign we have been experimenting with them (all games are played down the length of the table and from the narrow side) and found that particularly if used by both sides, they can dominate the game by the shear amount of table they cover. Of course they can be stopped by the ending of a turn (voluntary or randomly), providing players don't have Chain of Command Dice to counter act this but its not that hard to bring them back and sometimes its better for one side or the other to just to let the current turn continue. How have others found their use as part of a game? |
advocate | 30 Jul 2019 11:14 p.m. PST |
It's been discussed extensively on the TFL forum. Some people think they are overpowered and too easy to adjust, others are OK with them. I haven't used them enough to decide, but I tend towards the former opinion. As to how to resolve it, I'm not sure. |
TacticalPainter01 | 31 Jul 2019 1:20 a.m. PST |
I'm okay with them, but wouldn't be upset to see a few tweaks. A mortar barrage was powerful, so I think there's nothing wrong with that. Are there ways to mitigate it? Sure. Don't deploy if you don't need to, no point offering targets. Spread out, don't bunch up. Have a sniper on hand and try to take out the FO. End the turn (as you note) Add entrenchments as support, the barrage will do less damage to units in hard cover. |
Levi the Ox | 01 Aug 2019 9:39 p.m. PST |
We play with them not being able to shift after the barrage is called in. That way the initial ranging process matters more, and calling in the barrage commits it to that position until the end of the turn. Still quite powerful, but not as responsive as the official version. |
Basha Felika | 02 Aug 2019 2:17 p.m. PST |
Anyone I know who's been on the receiving end of a mortar barrage assures me that the CoC interpretation is really not ‘over-powered' – it's one of the scariest things a platoon commander can face. |
Trajanus | 06 Aug 2019 8:02 a.m. PST |
We play with them not being able to shift after the barrage is called in. That way the initial ranging process matters more, and calling in the barrage commits it to that position until the end of the turn. Still quite powerful, but not as responsive as the official version. That sounds like an idea. One of the problems in the Campaign was the ability to effectively use them as area denial weapons and march them down the table, on to and then through, the objective. OK so no one did, or does, like being on the end of a mortar barrage and as described above is what they are for. However, it was annoying to players as a brainless tactical ploy to start a barrage and then with helpfully accrued CoC points keep it going until the opponent couldn't hold any longer. Legitimate in the real world but not much of a challenge in a game environment. The Sniper V FOO solution can work but that heads off into another area of the rules – how would you know where the FOO was, or any other target for that matter! Oh look! My barrage just landed where I needed it and hit a whole bunch of concealed stuff, how fortunate! There's a whole new discussion, right there! |
advocate | 06 Aug 2019 9:16 a.m. PST |
Yes, mortars were effective, but we're they used to shoot attackers in to within 25 or 50 yards of their objective? The rules make them very flexible and often a game winner (at other times the turn and barrage can end before they become effective, and the mortars become no longer available). So probably worth considering ways to mitigate their effectiveness as they can on occasion dominate a game. |
UshCha | 07 Aug 2019 5:47 a.m. PST |
Assuming the model has any credibility you can start here link to see if it has any credibility. |
Wolfhag | 07 Aug 2019 7:34 a.m. PST |
If you are on foot you need to move as soon as the first round comes in, ideally perpendicular to the direction it came from. Try to get out of LOS if they have an FO on you. The Time of Flight is going to be about 30 seconds, maybe more so you should be able to move 50-60 meters, maybe more. Probably the worst thing to do is hit the deck because they can correct and FFE on you. In a worst-case scenario, you've stumbled into a location they have already ranged in on and FFE right away. This is what would happen: 81mm FFE Barrage YouTube link This is what happens if you stay in the beaten zone: YouTube link The best strategy is to pin down the target first with small arms fire and the mortar them. Judge for yourself how effective it can be. Notice how long the smoke and debris hangs in the air. The target is effectively blinded so should be counted as suppressed during that time. Probably the best way to use mortars against foot targets is with two tubes each drop 3-4 rounds in quick succession with a slight adjustment between rounds to put an "X" pattern over the target. All of the rounds are going to land in 8-10 seconds and most likely force the target to hit the deck. You then adjust the barrage and FFE. Looks like a 155mm barrage: link Wolfhag |
TacticalPainter01 | 09 Aug 2019 1:17 a.m. PST |
However, it was annoying to players as a brainless tactical ploy to start a barrage and then with helpfully accrued CoC points keep it going until the opponent couldn't hold any longer. That's a lot of CoC points accrued and assumes your opponent can't match them, plus no triple 6s rolled during either command roll. If the defender has some entrenchments then wait until the barrage has rolled over, then deploy. I'd suggest not deploying is one of those the best tactics (ie stay hidden and don't offer a target). Legitimate in the real world but not much of a challenge.In a game environment There are tactics to overcome everything, embrace the challenge. The Sniper V FOO solution can work but that heads off into another area of the rules – how would you know where the FOO was, or any other target for that matter! FOO spends a lot of time trying to conceal himself so as not to be a target, a sniper spends a lot of time searching for concealed men like FOs to make them a target. One specialist facing another. Oh lok! My barrage just landed where I needed it and hit a whole bunch of concealed stuff, how fortunate! There's a whole new discussion, right there! I don't understand what you are saying here. A barrage can only hit what is deployed. Stay hidden and you can't be targeted. An attacker cannot take an objective while his barrage is on it, at some point the barrage must lift…… |
|