"15mm early Ptolemaic and Spartan army" Topic

Hey TMP community,

I'm wanting to start a 15mm early Ptolemaic and Spartan army and am wondering which company would be the best place to purchase the miniatures.

Would the Forged in Battle Alexandrian Macedonian starter set be appropriate?

link

Does anyone have any photos of there Forged in Battle Successor armies Ptolemaic or not?

I'm also not 100% which Spartan set to choose either. I really would like to do early Spartan which Forged in Battle do but the Xyston miniature Spartan army looks very nice too.

Again if people have any photos of there sets I would love to see them.

Would the Forged in Battle Alexandrian Macedonian starter set be appropriate?

That set seems fine, as well as the Later Macedonians for Ptolemaic. However, the hypaspists kind of went away after Alexander.

You will need the Carthaginian elephants. Thracians and Galatians and later Greek cavalry are also good extras.

For Early Ptolemaic, the elephants should be Asian. It was only when the Seleucids cut off their supply that they had to source elephants from Africa.

The "Forged in Battle" "War and Empire" elephants look like 'hybrids' – an Asian humped back but African large ears. Also, the phalangites should not be ''Asiatic'. They have some nice figures but I think you might be better to look for a different range.

Cheers,
John

Thanks, Jjartist and John.

What's the difference between Asiatic phalangites and a phalangite? As forged in battle do Macedonian phalangites too?

link

What range would you recommend John?

The Forged in Battle Asiatic phalangites have trousers. This may have been a Seleucid thing and/or the epigonoi of the early Successors. I think the FiB phalangite shields look a bit small on most of the figures – the real ones were supposed to be 2' or larger across. The Bactrian Greeks have a larger shield but has a rim which is probably incorrect. These are distinguished by a helmet which crops up on Bactrian coins.
The 'reformed hypaspists' look like they have separate shields which may look better than the others. I'd hope they would be about the same as those shown on some of the standard bearers.
Depends what you mean by early Ptolemaic. By the end of the 3rd century they were using African elephants. The FiB elephants across most of the ranges do seem a bit of a mix. I think the best elephants are those from Xyston and on the whole I'd prefer their figures for the rest of the army too.

Xyston's Spartans are very nice. They have gone with the pilos helmet for the Spartans which various writers have suggested.
FiB use the same helmet on their 'Death of Leonidas' pack, though it may be a bit early for Thermopylae. The rest of their hoplites have a mix of helmets, using the cloak wearing figures for Spartans. There is some doubt whether this was worn in battle so you could always use other hoplites instead.
The Xyston hoplites are great but may put you off if you don't want to drill hands for spears and glue on shields. FiB are also nice. They have some separate shields but spears are cast on which you may prefer. The metal used is quite tough so is less liable to end up with the spaghetti spear look than some companies'.

OG15s hoplites are worth a look. They have a Classical range and a Hellenistic range (though the figures are really both Classical period). I think the 'Classical' hoplites and the Spartan hoplites are better then the other pack.

My own Ptolemaic army is mostly from Freikorps (now available through link ) but that was a long time ago and I don't know what the moulds would be like now. Also, the photos of the phalangites seem to show figures different from the ones I got . . . Their 'Asiatic' phalangites were wearing trousers too, which sets them apart from 'Macedonians'. The War and Empire 'Alexandrian' phalanx might work but I haven't seen the actual figures. The War and Empire ranges tend to closely follow the old WRG "Armies and Enemies" books.

They are also quite small by today's standards (more like 'true' 15mm).

Xyston are very nice as Swampster points out, but also bigger, which may suit you of course. OG are cheap and still closer to true 15mm (if they are consistent with their other ranges – I don't have any OG successors.)

According to the DBx lists (so probably with the Duncan Head stamp of approval ;-) ), the changeover from Asian to African elephants is 275BC so Asian for Ptolemy I and part of the reign of Ptolemy II.

War and Empire are great,

Xyston are great,

The only thing with Xyston is you have to like gluing on shields and drilling hands for spears

I have thousands of Xyston but if I were to start today it would be War and Empire

link was linked to on TMP a few days ago and is handy for seeing comparisons with OG15s, Xyston and FiB.

There is some variation within each companies range though FiB are most consistent. A rough guide with the Greek, Macedonian and Successor figures from Xyston is that lower number codes tend to be a bit smaller but it looks like some of the very large figures have been replaced.
I have some OG figures which are quite a bit smaller than others but most look fine next to Xyston.

That's very helpful. Thanks.
John